Follow spots.. Automation vs Manual

[mackerr]

2 hours ago, lxkev said:

Things to consider 

if we went automated - are they quick enough on the fly? Can a touring op use the system easily?

Is there any venues who own a followme or robe system?

If you go with a system like the [url=https://www.prg.com/en/technology/innovation/groundcontrol-followspot-system]PRG Ground Control[/url] or the Robe [url=https://www.robe.cz/robospot]RoboSpot[/url] there would be almost no learning curve and the spot ops could be anywhere a DMX line can reach.

the other Mac

[ImagineerTom]

I’m not sure “look, it uses one of those new fangled fancy “computers” to operate” is going to be the attraction that tips people over into wanting to work in the industry your colleague thinks it is. 
 

To anyone under the age of 30 computers already run everything and if “getting to use one to move a light” is the only thing that inspires them to get into theatre work they are going to leave the moment they find out most of the work actually has nothing at all to do with computers. 

[indyld]

Agree with Tom that the "using computers" and Gen Z idea is a red herring.

Fact is that the recruitment problem you mention is the same all over. Can't get good people, can't get crap people, get can't anyone at all levels. This is because the industry has historically relied on the continuation of vocational desire, rather than making a proper offer to new people. Or making any effort to retain them.

I work with wonderful undergraduates, most of whom go on into the industry and have the potential to become the best professionals holding the industry together when they peak. However, I wouldn't blame them for ditching it and doing something else after a few years. And they are well capable of that. 

Anyway, as you were.... 

Edited September 11, 2022 by indyld

[Junior8]

For my money following is a very high level skill to be cherished. The difference between a top operator and someone who's just been given what seems to be a simple job is frequently quite obvious. Also when they are not following they can,  unlike a computer, get on with some other work like say rigging or making a cup of tea.  

[niclights]

An added benefit of the Robe system (and I imagine the PRG too) is you can control, or take control of, various parameters from the console as required.  So, for example, if you have a relatively inexperienced operator you could lock out the dimmer except for when it was required.  You could also control the colour so they only have to worry about position.  They also have the ability to restrict the pan and tilt range which, as well as ensuring it can't be pointed anywhere silly, can be used to assist, for example if you are mostly just panning and don't need much or any tilt.  They also have adjustable smoothing on the movement.

Edited September 11, 2022 by niclights

[J Pearce]

5 hours ago, Junior8 said:

For my money following is a very high level skill to be cherished.

Why then, if it is such a cherished skill, do most places think they can get away with paying minimum wage or BECTU minimum to those who have the skills?

[Junior8]

19 minutes ago, J Pearce said:

Why then, if it is such a cherished skill, do most places think they can get away with paying minimum wage or BECTU minimum to those who have the skills?

For the same reason they underpay anybody I suspect. 

[Bryson]

Having played with, and had a client buy the Robe system, I can say that it's very nice with lots of great features, but there is just the tiniest bit of lag in response, akin to using a very heavy spot.  Good operators will eventually learn to "anticipate" movements and lead them a little, but it might be a challenge with unpredictable performers.

 

I feel like they missed a trick by not calling in the RobeSpot, though...  😉

[sunray]

On 9/11/2022 at 10:50 AM, Junior8 said:

For my money following is a very high level skill to be cherished. The difference between a top operator and someone who's just been given what seems to be a simple job is frequently quite obvious. Also when they are not following they can,  unlike a computer, get on with some other work like say rigging or making a cup of tea.  

I worked as sound op at the local civic halls back in 70's, our crew of 5 (sound, lights, SM[for want of a better title] & 2x follow spot) tended to do the other duties at times. My first time on FS was Ruby Murray who didn't move around and I decided the job was easy. Next time was during the Christmas run of Freddy Starr  and I soon found the skill required when he did things like bop around or make his entrance from the other wing

[GR1]

Similarly to Sunray I was opp'ing a follow spot at The Royal Albert Hall for Joy To The World some time last century. I was given spot 5. I'm not an instictive follow spot operator I can be quite good but it is hard work for me. Low and behold every pick up in a blackout was Spot 5. Why? I missed the pick up of a dancer mid jump somewhere on stage in a blackout. What a surprise. Bad management - put your best operators on the spot that needs those skills. Without a rehearsal even the great and the good would have been lucky doing pick ups in blackout.

I hope the current generation of follow spots are much cooler. We had people bringing water round to us.

PS : My first time on follow spot was as a 17 year old on release from school to the local theatre. The show was Hair and the local council had made attendance available for over 18s only. Hmmm... Yeah. Oh well. It has all been down hill since then. Happily.

[paulears]

New bod. First day. Tribute band. Half an hour before doors, they ask for spots. New bod attached to old bod, sent up vertical ladder into roof space. One spot very wobbly. No point getting cross. Training was this does big and small, this does off to on. People will wander around. Don’t let them get dark. People will shout at you if you mess up. Bass guitar is big red thing, guitar is white smaller one. Left is right, right is left. 
 

what could possibly go wrong?

it was the diagonal, white painted for visibility, girder running at head height across the route from stage to follow spot box that got her. Flat enough to leave no damage once you pick yourself up from the floor. A Scotty in Star Trek moment every suffers up there.

[the kid]

IIR eurovision uses the Robospot, as does the eurovision heats in Sweden. Quite a few people are well versed, Like anything its a skill but you fall in to it if you know the basics. Driving left or right, same but different.

[timsabre]

https://www.robe.cz/news/large-robospot-system-is-a-winner-at-eurovision-2018

[dje]

On 9/11/2022 at 11:08 AM, niclights said:

An added benefit of the Robe system (and I imagine the PRG too) is you can control, or take control of, various parameters from the console as required.  So, for example, if you have a relatively inexperienced operator you could lock out the dimmer except for when it was required.  You could also control the colour so they only have to worry about position.  They also have the ability to restrict the pan and tilt range which, as well as ensuring it can't be pointed anywhere silly, can be used to assist, for example if you are mostly just panning and don't need much or any tilt.  They also have adjustable smoothing on the movement.

It's not even just for the sake of less experienced operators. It also just means you can snap dimmer and colour changes in perfect synchrony. If the fixture supports it, you can also fade from colour to another directly (on the CMY flags) rather than changing gels. Blackouts are easier, etc. Even the most experienced operator will never be able to get their timings as good as the computer.

Some systems also allow you to change, on the fly, which remote controls which fixture(s). So if you do have some very experienced operators and some very inexperienced operators, then your more experienced operator(s) can operate more spots than their own by changing what they control at different points in the show.

Edited September 14, 2022 by dje

[Bryson]

They're also surprisingly similar to playing MotoGP at the arcade. 😉