Managing premature collapse of wiring systems

[alistermorton]

Something like a 50mm sized version of the clips sometimes used to route brake cables on bicycles? Like these https://images.app.goo.gl/nkLoPAdkhtxJAXZm6 Edited January 4, 2020 by alistermorton

[sunray]

Am I missing something here?

Don't we carry safety wires to stop lights falling off rigs?

I usually use the old chains for the purpose as they can be clipped short.

 

Edited January 4, 2020 by sunray

[sandall]

A device similar to this Amazon Link - a simple 50mm spring clip. ............. You tape your bar in the usual way and then pop a few of these on to the bar over the bundle.

A useful alternative to tape or cable-ties for keeping cables tidy, but as a means of preventing cables drooping in a fire, maybe not - even if not weakened by the heat if one gets dislodged the rest may well follow in a chain reaction.

 

E2A: Sunray - There's an argument that safety-chains (& even bonds) on lanterns create a much greater risk than they prevent, but for securing cables to bars they are indeed another quick & easy solution.

 

 

Edited January 4, 2020 by sandall

[paulears]

At last - a use for the hundreds of old safety chains many of us still g=have laying around everywhere!

[the kid]

I can foresee an invention....

 

A device similar to this Amazon Link -..............

Didn't someone post on here a while back with a bar clamp/hook thingumabob that does just that??

 

 

Rings a bell. or something like a sky hook. I'm sure I have seen a layered sky hook with the intention of Mains, DMX, data/video.

[david.elsbury]

Several plastic clip products out there; this being one: https://www.quikstage.com/global-truss-dtsnap-cable-management-clamp-truss-cable-clips.html

[sandall]

Several plastic clip products out there;

In the context of a thread on fire-safety isn't "plastic" the operative word here?

[indyld]

Sounds like a job for the old skool RnR method using double hook hangers along the truss....

[david.elsbury]

If there is a fire I seriously think that cables falling off a truss are the least thing to be worried about. It’s much more likely that a cable or snake draped over a fire exit on a couple of nails is going to be an issue

[the kid]

http://www.citytheatrical.com/Products/cable-hooks?dept=f08878d4-186a-43b5-9499-62116fce6480

 

https://www.thomann.de/gb/eurolite_tch_50_28_double_cable_clamp.htm

 

 

 

All options, Or as others said . old bonds.

[Jivemaster]

Well the regulation is now there in ink, so probably it's now a good time to think about where and how cables run and are supported. Maybe the two nails in the top of the door-frame need to be considered or improved on for securing cables over an exit way. Maybe it's time to be positive about change, before someone makes and expensive product and markets it as the only way to compliance

[sunray]

I don't know whether I should be proud that I learnt the safety chain thing some 50 years ago at school, we used the double hook variety to form a loop in one end for the cable the hooked the other end over a very horrible raw edged upstand in the ceiling structure.

 

E2A: Sunray - There's an argument that safety-chains (& even bonds) on lanterns create a much greater risk than they prevent.

Ooh why is that?

I don't see anything that is likely to be hazardous other than complacency.

 

I confess I don't always bother with lightweight fitting over the stage but over the audience is another matter, but the fittings tend to be heavier.

 

I purchased some a while back which turned out to be plastic coated but they were crimped on the plastic. I hung some up with a dead weight [56lbs on 30Kg bonds] and monitored over a couple of weeks to see the plastic stretching and eventually fail.

 

Edited January 4, 2020 by sunray

[david.elsbury]

>> “ I hung some up with a dead weight [56lbs on 30Kg bonds]”

 

I’m not sure why you’d mix units, but for the rest of us that’s a shade over 25kg. Like I think I mentioned at the time you made that post; when made properly it’s no problem to plastic coat steels. It’s a shame that you seem to have ended up with some made by people with no idea.

 

Can someone elaborate why using chains is any good? Are you supposed to weld or glue them into a hook shape? Or are they so old and rusty that they hold their shape? Or are we talking about manually opening and closing a loop made by a length of chain?

[sunray]

>> " I hung some up with a dead weight [56lbs on 30Kg bonds]"

 

I'm not sure why you'd mix units, but for the rest of us that's a shade over 25kg. Like I think I mentioned at the time you made that post; when made properly it's no problem to plastic coat steels. It's a shame that you seem to have ended up with some made by people with no idea.

 

Can someone elaborate why using chains is any good? Are you supposed to weld or glue them into a hook shape? Or are they so old and rusty that they hold their shape? Or are we talking about manually opening and closing a loop made by a length of chain?

Apologies for the weight mix, I use both units with regularity and mentally convert back and forth, I forget that others don't need to.

I personally have never encountered plastic coated wire which has not been stripped to make the crimps, however in the context of this thread I'd start questioning the validity of crimping the plastic even more now.

My first comment about bonds or chains was about adding a safety once the cables are in place, as I learnt in school.

My second was about suspending cables, as learnt at school, by forming a lose loop round the cables [by clipping one hook into the chain] and simply hooking the other other over an edge of a perforated structure [roughly like Dexion but sharper edges].

Edited January 4, 2020 by sunray

[sandall]

There's an argument that safety-chains (& even bonds) on lanterns create a much greater risk than they prevent.

Ooh why is that?

I don't see anything that is likely to be hazardous other than complacency.

I always use a chain (or more recently a bond) when rigging a lantern on scaff because that was what I was taught, but while over many decades of rigging lights a few safety-chains & bonds have slipped & dropped, which could have hit someone unwise enough to wander underneath, but never a lantern. Nor have I heard of one spontaneously detaching itself from its hook-clamp & dangling on its chain. On the other hand always using an accessory-bond rather than relying on bits of bent metal to hold barn-doors in place is a no-brainer.

 

If you are going to use bonds buy ones made by a reputable source like Rope Assemblies, whose SWL rating you can trust, not from somewhere in China. RA's bonds have a safety-factor of 8:1, so a 30Kg bond should support over 200Kg, not fail with 25Kg.

 

Do you not use single or double-ended safety-chains with gated hooks in Oz, David? The OP was about safely attaching cables to scaff, not truss, & as Jivemaster says, over here we are talking about a legal requirement, so yes, it is time to take this seriously.