New Midas 'Something' at Namm

[Mark Payne]

Word is £3-3.5k

 

 

£3300 and proper support from the Midas dealers.

We will take your pre orders now!

 

Actually it has been very hard to not say anything about this. Why would you X32 when you can M32?

 

Will let you know as soon as they land.

 

M

[TomHoward]

Looks like it runs the Behringer OS. There are still the Behringer logos on the expansion card pics as well.

[sam.spoons]

1390511390[/url]' post='491162']

1390510537[/url]' post='491158']

Word is £3-3.5k

 

 

£3300 and proper support from the Midas dealers.

We will take your pre orders now!

 

Actually it has been very hard to not say anything about this. Why would you X32 when you can M32?

 

Will let you know as soon as they land.

 

M

'Cos it's about 30% cheaper?

 

 

[Stuart91]

£3300 and proper support from the Midas dealers.

 

To be fair, support for the X32 through Behringer's network seems to have been more than satisfactory.

[smalljoshua]

I'd want to A/B before making too much comment on which I'd go for, but I've a feeling there isn't much if any difference that would sway me (I don't care much for looks or feel, functionality is much more important).

 

On the other hand, look at the M32 product page, specifically the sketches. The bottom one looks like an SD9, the middle one looks like a CL series from the side and the desk looks like an iLive T112. I think its a sign that desks are maturing now that a "standard" ish layout and build format is emerging.

 

Josh

[Stuart91]

a "standard" ish layout and build format is emerging.

 

Yes, and it's a pity that there's a stupid slope on it which means the flightcase is twice as deep as it needs to be.

 

This isn't an issue on an arena tour, but for small corporate and band gigs, which many of the compact consoles are aiming at, it's a bit of a killer. If you are trying to handle the console yourself, or fit it into a tight pack in a Sprinter-sized van, it's a lot of added grief for very little gain.

[smalljoshua]

This isn't an issue on an arena tour, but for small corporate and band gigs, which many of the compact consoles are aiming at, it's a bit of a killer. If you are trying to handle the console yourself, or fit it into a tight pack in a Sprinter-sized van, it's a lot of added grief for very little gain.

The X32, A&H GLD/Qu and Si Expression all seem to fit this "flat" bill nicely.

 

Josh

[dbuckley]

So Uli has broken the rules again.

 

Conventional wisdom is that within one group, one practices market segmentation, so customers have no confusion about if they should buy Brand A or Brand B. The Music Group now have a pair of 32 channel desks, and conceivably many buyers could make a choice between an x32 or a m32. And the allied products work interchangeability on both stables. And worse than that, the "inferior" product is not a load of junk but a very competent, capable tool.

 

Go Uli.

[S&L]

chief differences seem to be:

96k sample rate - lots of small studio people have moaned about the sample rate of the x32 and said 96 is standard but I doubt whether you can really audible tell the difference, certainly not live.

midas faders and knobs

cranked upper portion - if they had one you could crank and lay flat for transport that would be great - I find it difficult sat at the x32 to read the screen if the desk is laid horizontally. you have to stand up (I usually mix on a stool) or lean over a long way.

So it's a GHIA model of the x32 for £1,000 more.

the x32 sits in a none wheeled case without dog house comfortably in my estate car - when I work theatres depping for another engineer I put the x32, and a trunk of mics, cables, stands etc in the boot and I'm good to go - no van needed. it's almost manageable in and out of the car with one man but not quite. the m32 is definitely a touring or fixed installation beast.

If you are a theatre, house of worship and you want midas dealer support and the spec meets your needs then the m32 is going to be your choice. If you are a budget studio then you are going to pick up this and the x-touch.

If you are getting your hands dirty in small venues, theatres, even bars then you are going to want the x32, or it's little siblings.

but here is the clever bit - you now have a growth path from the x32 producer to the midas touring kit. I wouldn't think anything about jumping on the m32 having worked the x32 - when an m40/48 comes along that will be similarly easy to switch to. it's soap powder for engineers - and I don't mean that disrespectfully - get a teen or 20 something to buy your powder and they don't bother changing the brand for most of their life as they get older, regardless of what's in the box.

..and the way they have done it is clever - buy midas, nick the brains and develop a desk at the bottom of the market, change the game then nick back the best bits for the top of the market - genius.

it doesn't look like it's built yet so given behringer's usual marketing strategy we will still be waiting in September for a release. after that the jury will be out while the market decides which way it goes - but you know what?...x32's are everywhere now and if I'm right about the soap powder this may be music group's smartest marketing move yet.

 

by the way did anyone notice that with v2 for both desks you can now use one for monitors, one for FOH, set the gains and lock them AND THEN independently control gains from either desk. and that's before we get to both consoles being able to run IQ speakers on their network. of course that would lock you into turbosound.

[pisquee]

It could also be that, in essence, the X32 was the beta test/R&D before bringing the 'proper' M32 to market for the big boys, where they can effectively say that it has been road tested for x amount of years/units, had this return/failure/DOA rate etc.

 

they could at least have rebranded the FX plugins to be KT rather than Behinger though.

 

I'm also wondering if inside is the same motherboard running things, and as soon as the M32 is out people will be seeing if they can extract its software for hacking onto an X32 - would the X32 have the 96K capability also built in from scratch, with an original plan to enable it in the future, but instead they launched the 96K capable desk as a different model? ... who's gonna be first to open up an M32 and X32 and compare the two's internals?

[smalljoshua]

It's important to note that the M32 is stated to be have a "96 kHz capable open architecture" and no-where does it state that the console is actually running at 96kHz.

 

This is compounded by the ability to still run 48 channels bidirectionally on each AES50 port. This is only doable at 48kHz.

 

Josh

[S&L]

,..my understanding is that it's more or less the same software - people around the world have been busy downloading v2 beta for x32 and reporting on it and there is at least one video of it being demoed at NAMM. what is described on the M32 web page is what is in the x32 beta. I understand the beta is final in 3 or 4 weeks time,

it comes with:

all the extra fx shown

p16 system operating cat5 enabled speakers from turbosound

independent gain control of 2 desks when linked

snippets as well as scenes to save your favourite channel settings

pre set snippets from engineers with name bands

500 scenes or such - not clear on this point yet but the ability to use the go button for 500 different memories in a theatre environment.

(thought that may get the attention of some of you)

flashing send to fader button so you do not forget it.

a RTA

and lord knows what else.

I will post the list below but be prepared to scroll through it goes on a bit - from what I can tell these are all available for both M32 and X32.

 

IMPORTANT - I understand that v2 doesn't yet have an x-edit version to go with it

MORE IMPORTANT - old scenes in v1.x are not strictly compatible with v2.01 but since they are essentially text files with each setting described and valued, it aught to be possible for you to edit a new text file with old data and no doubt some clever devil out there is already writing a converter.

here is the full list. it's long. you were warned!

 

 

 

• Updating from Firmware V1.15 to V2.0 beta and also downgrading from V2.0 beta back to V1.15

will erase all data on the console! Please backup the data from your console before upgrading or

downgrading!

• Shows and Scenes will not be exchangeable between V1.15 and V2.0 beta!

• X32-EDIT will not sync with V2.0 beta!

• X32-MIX (iPad) will not be fully functional with V2.0 beta!

 

New Features !

 

New Scene/Snippet/Cue Management

• Cue List with 500 Cue entries and additional editing operations

• New flexible structure called 'Snippet', allow settings selective parameter and channel filters for

storage. Recalling a Snippet will exclusively affect the stored bits of information, leaving the

remaining console status untouched. This allows to surgically introduce specific bits of automation

into the current mix status

• 100 of the new Snippets can be stored internally, or can be exported/imported to/from USB drives

• Every one of the Snippets can be loaded separately from scenes or together with a scene recall

• 100 Scenes remain to be covering a complete snapshot of the console parameter status, but the

same scene can now be re-used in several cues

• Every Cue can load any one of the 100 internal Scenes and/or one of the 100 Snippets concurrently

or separately

• By separating Cues from the actual scene and snippet memory, X32 Version 2.0 provides a new level

of agility in automation

• New Scene "0" ignores any safe flags and thus offers a new way of establishing a customizable

initialization of the console. !

 

New 100-Band RTA and EQ Functions

• New high-resolution 100-band Real Time Analyzer (RTA) with Bar and Spectrograph views

• A large RTA view can be used as a separate meter with any signal available

• The RTA can also be blended above every one of the Channel and Bus EQ curves, allowing to see the

results of filtering in the audio spectrum directly

• Additionally, the RTA can be displayed on top of the 31-band graphic EQs in the FX Rack—

identifying problematic frequencies has never been easier

• The Analyzer can be assigned to a fixed channel, or depending on Select Channel or Solo status

• The RTA Spectrograph mode displays the audio energy distribution on 100 frequency bands over

time—capturing a sonogram window of 10 s length

• The Channel EQ display editing controls have been rearranged improving the workflow,

synchronized with the channel strip controls, and allowing per-band bypass !

 

Improved Library Function

• The internal preset library for Channels, FX and Routing can now be exported and imported to/from

USB media as a whole or in parts

• A random selection (or all) of the presets can be written to USB as a bulk

• A random selection (or all) of the external presets can be imported back to a selected area of the

internal presets

• All channel presets in the library always cover the complete channel information, and only the recall

scope defines which elements will be loaded back into the channel !

 

Channel Spill Out for X32 COMPACT and X32 PRODUCER

• X32 COMPACT and X32 PRODUCER can now use all 16 faders for controlling e.g. input channels

• By pressing two of the left-hand fader layer buttons concurrently, the selected 8-Channel blocks will

be spilled out on the 8 input and 8 Bus faders

• This allows for example combining channels 1-8 on the left, with channels 9-16 or with the stereo FX

returns on the right side

• Any combination is possible, and the top layer button defines what channels go to the left fader

section !

 

Gain Splitting and Remote Control for FOH and Monitoring Applications

• New Gain Split mode for separating the channel gain (Trim) from the head amp gain

• When Gain Split is active the head amp gains can only be adjusted on the Setup/Preamps page,

while input channels have digital trims only

• After having set the head amp gains with reasonable headroom during soundcheck, the Gain Split

can be engaged. During the show both, FOH and Monitoring consoles, will operate their local gain

Trims independently

• The new HA Gain Remote option allows console gains to be remote controlled by another console

(e.g. for using X32 RACK as a Digital Snake) !

Intuitive and Faster Access to Effects Editing

 

• Jump To Page function on the Assignable Buttons can now store the FX page and layer, so left and

right side dual effects sharing the same slot can now be recalled on separate buttons

• When the effects page is open and a channel/bus effect is inserted, selecting that channel will

automatically display the corresponding FX editing page

• Similarly, the corresponding side-chain FX page will automatically open upon selection of the

sending bus

• Dual FX inserted into a Channel/Bus will show the respective names and icons on the edit pages !

New Effects Programs

• 3 new Reverb Effects emulating Lexicon 480L Rich Chamber, Room and Rich Plate programs

• New 4-Tap Rhythm Delay

• Multiband Compressor with several automatic features

• Emulations of Vintage Compressors such as Fairchild 670, Teletronix LA-2A, Urei 1176LN

• Emulations of Vintage EQ such as Pultec EQP-1a and MEQ5

• Emulation of Roland Dimension D Chorus

• Dual Sub Octaver and emulation of Sonic Maximizer effects

• Edison Stereo Field controller with M/S input and output options !

 

New Routing & Patching Flexibility

• Output routing matrix now treats output signals and XLR Output connectors separately, allowing to

send signals directly from AES50 or expansion cards to the XLR Outputs, without losing input

channels and Output 1-16 signal patching functions – e.g. for passing FOH signals through

• Output patching now with optional pre/post muting taps (e.g. mute P16 feeds with channel mutes) !

 

MIDI Control for Fader, Mute and Pan

• Channel/Bus faders, mute and pan control positions can be transmitted and received via the physical

 

MIDI I/O port or Card MIDI (X-USB or X-UF cards installed)

• Individual flags on the Setup/remote tab allow to configure the parameters for TX/RX

• Fader information is transmitted on MIDI CH01, Status 176 (xB0), CC# 0…79, 0/95/127

• Mute on MIDI CH02, Status 177 (xB1), CC# 0…79, 0/127 (Mute off/Mute on)

• Pan on MIDI CH03, Status 178 (xB2), CC# 0…79, 1/64/127 !

 

Support for X-DANTE, X-MADI and X-ADAT Expansion Cards

• 3 new Expansion Cards enable integration into multi-channel audio networks or to other

recording environments

• X32 can be synchronized to external clock sources, or provide clock to other devices !

 

Support for Portable iQ Speakers

• 6 new active PA loudspeakers from TURBOSOUND with DSP and ULTRANET (P16) CAT5 input

• iQ speakers can be remote controlled directly from the X32 Routing Screen

• Call up sound presets or sound modeling remotely, while working on the console !

 

Other Improvements

• New Sends on Fader function can be used with any target bus, including Input Channels à Main

Mono/Center and Bus/Main Mixes à Matrices.

o Sends on Faders is only automatically deactivated when switching to DCA fader layer

o Improved indication of sends on fader signal flow on small displays

o Sends on Fader button flashing, to show its activity more obviously

• Console Lock function removed from Setup menu. Now pressing HOME for 3 s will activate/

deactivate the control surface Lock function (pressing a second button currently with HOME while

locking the console, can be used to customize the Lock. For unlocking, HOME will have to be held

depressed together with that same button, again

o When console is locked the faders are disabled but can still be remote controlled

o Console lock function on HOME button also doubles as Safe Shutdown function

• Compressor threshold range optimized/reduced to -60..0 dBFS

• Gate can now be used in expander mode too (Ratios 1:2, 1:3, 1:4)

• Gate and Compressor now with key signal level indication in gain curve display

• Console initialization now sets the bus send 1-8 default to post eq (i.e. pre dynamics) instead of pre

fader (i.e. post processing)

• The Lock function for the S16 Digital Snake head-amp control is now moved to the SETUP/PREAMPS

page

• User Assign rotary controls now available on the ASSIGN/HOME page (useful for X32 COMPACT,

X32 PRODUCER and X32 RACK which do not have physical rotaries in the ASSIGN section)

• DCAs now show level meters displaying the max post fader level of all assigned channels

• Additional Input/Low-Cut (i.e. Pre Gate) signal tap for input channel bus sends

 

• Smarter handling of send levels when changing bus mode to SubGroup and back, again.

• Channel AFL solo is now working correctly on Auxes and FX Returns

 

edited to correct spelling and to add that I'm really not trying to be their brochure - just pass on information that there is obviously an interest in from existing users of the x32 and those now contemplating the m32.

Frankly I'm starting to think the desk is capable of almost too much. but I can always ignore the bit I think I don't need until I discover that I do need them

[amosacia]

So from what I can tell, the M32 is a nicer looking version of the x32 with potentially more expensive/longer life components (I see they are saying the faders are rated at 1million life cycle as opposed to 300K on the x32, I think!) and 'pure' Midas pre-amps? If that's right then surely the only real difference to the sound that comes out of the boards is the pre-amps and the A to D converters as it seems the software is identical. In which case wouldn't getting the DL16 digital snake be best upgrade path for x32 owners, then you get the 'sound' of the M32 (pre-amps and A to D converters) on your x32 board... this would also open up the rest of the x32 range to the 'better' Midas sound, or am I missing something?

[S&L]

So from what I can tell, the M32 is a nicer looking version of the x32 with potentially more expensive/longer life components (I see they are saying the faders are rated at 1million life cycle as opposed to 300K on the x32, I think!) and 'pure' Midas pre-amps? If that's right then surely the only real difference to the sound that comes out of the boards is the pre-amps and the A to D converters as it seems the software is identical. In which case wouldn't getting the DL16 digital snake be best upgrade path for x32 owners, then you get the 'sound' of the M32 (pre-amps and A to D converters) on your x32 board... this would also open up the rest of the x32 range to the 'better' Midas sound, or am I missing something?

 

but wouldn't that cost more? X32 plus 2 DL16 must be more than £3,300 for M32.

I think we are all missing the ergonomic benefits - if I get a choice of both and I am resident theatre engineer, then the cranked screen alone would sell it to me. and if I am a small studio then I'm probably going to be anorak about the 96k and may well not need the DL16's.

I think this is about buying the extra quality on work position, components and dealer support. and if you get a budget of £5k to spend on desk and stageboxes, what are you going to recommend to your venue manager?

[timd]

Heaps of new features exposing DSP we haven't seen yet, but they still haven't implemented channel pairing for non-adjacent channels, which is a stupidly simple firmware thing. Ho hum.