Ali2580 Posted February 11, 2011 Share Posted February 11, 2011 Hi all. Looking for a bit of information/advice here... A local education building which I am working in soon has a theatre. The council/education regulations are trying to minimise the use of ladders as much as possible which is a bit of a pain in the bottom. Now, in my LX plan for the show in a few months time there is gobo's in S4's located on FOH Booms which sit right above seats. Previously the only way to access these booms is to try and fit the ladders in between the seats. As they are trying not to use the ladders, I have been told that they are replacing the bulbs in these lamps by a cherry picker while it's in the theatre doing something else however, I have been told that to get to these lamps for this show I can use the ladders but I have to take "health and safety precautions" - what does this mean exactly? Is it just a case of 'think it all through first' or get hold of another form of restraint should an accident happen? I realise things may be different to where other people are located and different councils will have different regulations. Just to say as well that as the budgets are as tight as *insert joke* and it's a bit pointless to bring in a cherry picker/scaff tower for 5 minutes of putting a gobo in and focussing it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andy_s Posted February 11, 2011 Share Posted February 11, 2011 As everyone knows, the HSE has not forbidden the use of ladders. It would probably be possible to risk-assess the focussing as a "low risk short duration" activity and therefore careful use of ladders for access would be indicated. here is a link to the HSE website ladders area ... Ladders although there may be complicating factors which mean that ladders may not be easy to use - you say the positions are over the seating, and clearly this might have an impact on how easy it is to set up the ladder of course - as you imply in your post, so this would be referred to in the risk assessment... perhaps it becomes "medium risk short duration" ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
themadhippy Posted February 11, 2011 Share Posted February 11, 2011 just follow the advice you were given on your safe use of ladders course ;) or just read up on what the H+S site has to say on the subject Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seano Posted February 11, 2011 Share Posted February 11, 2011 I have been told that ...... what does this mean exactly?No doubt you'll get some suggestions here, but if you want to know exactly what the person who told you that meant by it you're going to have to ask them aren't you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ali2580 Posted February 11, 2011 Author Share Posted February 11, 2011 andy-s: Thanks for the link! Will have a look now.. themadhippy: I would, If I had been on such course. Seano: I think the person who informed me is more of a messenger as he would have been told that from someone within the council and/or building. But will ask. Cheers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ynot Posted February 11, 2011 Share Posted February 11, 2011 At the end of the day, without SPECIFIC guidelines from the premises management, (which rightly you are seeking) the safety of YOU working at height is essentially down to YOU and YOUR assessment of the potential risks involved. If you feel that you are experienced enough to assess the ladders, the point onto which you're leaning them, and the work you're looking to do, then you should do so. If you have concerns, then make out a written RA and make sure that you cover off any and all high risks. A written RA for every single instance of WaH is not really necessary, but writing one does tend to focus the mind if you're not experienced. The venue really should have their own WaH policy and general RA for same. Ask to see that if you feel the need (or even if you don't - it's worth a gander). Finally, you ARE making sure that on NO occasion you work at height without a second body with you? a) they're able to foot ladders for you and b) are there as a safety net should you have an incident. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ali2580 Posted February 11, 2011 Author Share Posted February 11, 2011 ...Finally, you ARE making sure that on NO occasion you work at height without a second body with you? a) they're able to foot ladders for you and b) are there as a safety net should you have an incident. Thanks for the reply Ynot. Much appreciated. Yes, I always make sure there is someone within the room so I have thought about that. Cheers, A Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew C Posted February 11, 2011 Share Posted February 11, 2011 themadhippy: I would, If I had been on such course.Unfortunately, I think that means you don't climb a ladder in a workplace. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ali2580 Posted February 11, 2011 Author Share Posted February 11, 2011 themadhippy: I would, If I had been on such course.Unfortunately, I think that means you don't climb a ladder in a workplace. Interesting.. Is this a law that you MUST undertake a professional course of how to climb a ladder before using one? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
themadhippy Posted February 11, 2011 Share Posted February 11, 2011 Not law,but in todays sue first ask questions later more and more places want to see bits of paper before letting you do a job that youve been doing for years.Anyway cant hang about got to do a refresher on safe use of a kettle course. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulears Posted February 11, 2011 Share Posted February 11, 2011 No - you do NOT have to go on a course. In fact many people who get sent on them really hate these course, meant primarily to give you a nice certificate to proudly display. By the wayYes, I always make sure there is someone within the room so I have thought about that.The second person, is of course, standing at the bottom of the ladder! Ynot's advice is sound - produce a risk assessment. Consider what could happen if it goes wrong, and detail what could happen to the person, risk wise. Then put in place your simple safety systems and see what the resultant risk drops to. Then just make sure you carry out the work in this manner. The fact they have considered a Genie to re-lamp, but forget that refocusing and colouring is day to day activity suggests they are clueless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew C Posted February 11, 2011 Share Posted February 11, 2011 No - you do NOT have to go on a course. In fact many people who get sent on them really hate these course, meant primarily to give you a nice certificate to proudly display. Unless the venue, or your employer set it as a requirement. HASAW requires a safe system of work, and suitable training is/can be a part of that. My employer do them in house, and it is no less dull than an external trainer, but we HAVE to do it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seano Posted February 11, 2011 Share Posted February 11, 2011 Finally, you ARE making sure that on NO occasion you work at height without a second body with you? ... and b) are there as a safety net should you have an incident.Not literally I hope. Unless the second person is unusually big and soft. ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kerry davies Posted February 11, 2011 Share Posted February 11, 2011 Nice one Seano.PEDANT ALERT; Sorry, Ali, but as an under 18 you would probably need to prove some level of competence and then still need to be supervised by a competent responsible adult, not just anyone hanging around the room. I only say this because it appears that as Paul suggests the venue has "issues" around risk hierarchy and are indeed clueless. See this convoluted thread from a few years back; http://www.blue-room.org.uk/index.php?showtopic=26100 I am not trying to infer (imply?) that you are not competent at height but that a local authority governed (clueless) venue may require some proof from you and at 17 showing training, experience and skill is going to be difficult. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boswell Posted February 11, 2011 Share Posted February 11, 2011 But he will be 18 in 4 weeks time so the world is then his shellfish :** laughs out loud **: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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