Zero 88 Orb

[martinw]

The main reason that external power supplies are used is that it means the console is then exempt from the 'Low Voltage Directive'. This applies to any device which is designed for use with an AC voltage over 50V or DC over 75V, and requires a higher (ie. more expensive) level of safety testing before the product can be sold. This can be avoided by buying a pre-approved external unit.

 

Martin

[peter]

To answer a few questions (although we seem to have deviated from the desk to power supplies)...

 

The main competitors as we see it are those desks directly targetting the theatre market - offerings from ETC, Strand, ADB, etc. None of these desks have touchscreens fitted as standard, although like the Orb, most offer the option of connecting a USB/VGA touchscreen. Interestingly as the Orb runs Linux internally, you have far fewer driver support issues than experienced on some of the previously mentioned products.

 

We see the Orb as fitting in where the Strand 300 and 500 series desks left off, or as a replacement for the ETC Express ranges - great at generics, but somewhat lacking in the moving light capabilities. Orb takes this to the next level - proper palettes, colour pickers, ethernet capabilities, fannable effects etc. In our product range it superceeds the Illusion 500 and takes theatrical control to a level never before seen in the range.

 

There are a number of design reasons why we choose to use external power supplies, including as Martin says, the different classification of the product electrically, which helps to keep cost down.

 

Our external power supplies are high quality and certainly not designed to fail, however if you cross-phase or otherwise electrically punish any desk (as happens, with surprising regularity!), you will need to replace the power supply. Certain other manufacturers use (low-cost, due to the volumes they're produced it) off the shelf PC power supplies which are fine for powering a static PC which gets installed and left, but don't lend themselves well to being bumped around in flightcases in trucks every evening. Our power supplies are deliberately designed to be mechanically durable as well as easily swappable. Choosing an external PSU also reduces the heat and components inside the desk, which reduces the requirement for cooling significantly.

 

I do hope that this off-topic discussion doesn't distract from the point and that people will take the opportunity to visit us at PLASA and see what we've got to offer. It's inevitable that some users will shy away from any desk with Zero 88 printed on it, but I'd invite everyone to take a fresh look at Zero 88 - you might well be surprised.

[indyld]

Aside from the weird tangent about internal vs. external PSU's, this thread is just the same as all the other threads on the BR about lighting consoles. "Which desk manufacturing team do you support and will they win the cup this season?".

 

Perhaps a section of the FAQ could reproduce a generic argument where lampie A likes desk A and lampie B likes B and lampie C thinks desk A is best despite never even having been in the same postcode as one.

 

Perhaps a ban on discussing consoles could be added to the one on sport.

 

Seriously, why must console makers chase after every part of the market these days. One minute they're making the MaxMA III with 1000 universes and Warp Drive, the next they have added the Tiddly Frig iPC wing to their range - and everything in between. Zero88 make good desks for their market (such as the ML24) and MA make complex desks that suit their market. And everyone keeps trying to think up ways to provide for lost 520 followers (which is a hateful desk, anyway) who roam the wilderness hoping that their ancient boards will last a bit longer.

 

I am sure that there is a spreadsheet of business reasons for the manufacturers wide approach to product marketing, but trying to build up your supporters club this way seems like a sure way of fragmenting a specialist market to unmanageable levels.

 

Next thing you know, Avo will be trying to enter the theatre market with a cue stack feature.

[martinw]

Seriously, why must console makers chase after every part of the market these days.

Because its a very crowded market where there are probably too many players for a lot of them to make decent money.

 

Regarding external power supplies - a good way to test the quality of an external supply is to key a Motorola GP300 or similar radio nearby. This will shutdown many of the cheaper models for a few seconds. Please don't try this during your show

 

Martin

[Nick S]

I want to give a little disclaimer here - I think Zero88 are a great company, and I've had fantastic support from them when I'm working in the UK. Some of their desks are great, and the Jester is a world apart from ETC's low-budget SmartFade offerings (and sometimes I wish support in the States was as good as ETC, because I just had a number of jobs where I would have loved to spec a Jester).

 

...but...

 

The main competitors as we see it are those desks directly targetting the theatre market - offerings from ETC, Strand, ADB, etc. [...]

We see the Orb as fitting in where the Strand 300 and 500 series desks left off, or as a replacement for the ETC Express ranges - great at generics, but somewhat lacking in the moving light capabilities.

 

Firstly, I'm glad Zero88 are replacing the horrible Illusion 500 with something that looks comparatively much better.

That said, I don't know where this new console can fit into the market. If you're looking to replace an Express, what possible reason would you have to choose an Orb over an ETC Ion?

 

The Ion is similarly priced, has some physical similarities, and the same number of channels but has five times the palettes, more subs, amazing driver support (we can agree to disagree that XP Embedded has better driver support than Linux), fader expansion, and (as you might expect) is easy to migrate to from an Express.

 

Now, to be fair, I haven't (obviously) used an Orb. I have used an Ion and Zero88s other offerings (Frog2, Illusion, etc). At least on paper, I can't see a reason for recommending this desk over other offerings from other manufacturers. But, you know, I'm prepared to be proved wrong and looking forward to trying it out, if I can make it out to PLASA. Just my tuppence.

[Robin D]

I'm probably closer to indyld's 'lampie C' :** laughs out loud **: and will not be joining the discussion on the desk capabilities as I'm not qualified to comment. On the PSU issue though, with my IT background, it puzzles me why server manufacturers have for years provided slide out and often hot swappable multiple PSU's (I'm running a server here with four) yet no-one seems to fit them into other mission critical computer based kit which during a show is exactly what a lighting desk is. I should have thought that for semi permanent installations such as the stated aim of the Orb, provisioning two hot-swap bays with one PSU as standard (optional second) would add very little to the cost if the PSU's were bought from one of the server suppliers. Heat dissipation is not a problem as these are designed as an stand-alone modules with all fan's and ventilation built in. It's doesn't solve the weight problem, but you're not going to leave the PSU behind.

 

Probably too late to help with the current desk, but a thought for the future maybe! <_<

 

best wishes ....... Robin

[Russ83]

... provisioning two hot-swap bays with one PSU as standard (optional second) would add very little to the cost if the PSU's were bought from one of the server suppliers.

I can see a lot of logic to that statement and like the idea however there are a couple of issues:

1) They will inevitably still be IEC connectors and when somebody manages to fall over a cable or the desk gets moved there's still a chance that both will come out.

2) I have yet to come across a quiet (never mind silent) server PSU. Heat removal and uptime are the key issues with servers, noise isn't (although I wish Sun Microsystems would at least think about it in their rackmount cases!) If Zero88 were to build hotswap PSUs into their desks they would have to fund and develop their own I would suspect.

[richard_cooper]

I once used a 550, can't remember who or where, that had something similar (but not quite) to this in place of the normal power supply. It was not too noisy.

[Tomo]

That'll be seriously noisy - four 35mm fans!

[richard_cooper]

That'll be seriously noisy - four 35mm fans!

Yes, it wasn't that model, similar concept though. This one only had one fan per module, and was about the same noise level as the stock power supply in our 520i, which I've always found to a bit loud anyway.

[peter]

The Orb website has been updated, adding new content and also updating the specification to include 1000 of each type of palettes, groups and macros. This change has been made directly as a result of the feedback provided here, so thank-you to Blue Room members for making the desk more what they want.

 

Please do take an opportunity to look at the new pages and keep that feedback coming - we want to hear what you think.

 

 

 

Peter

[richard]

One little question, on the ion (which this will be a competitor to) all the submasters can act as playbacks, in the hog style. Seeing that the Orb runs similar software to the Frog II which does have multiple playbacks is there any reason why all the subs couldn't be playbacks (or can they already?)

 

Also, how many macro trigger buttons are there on the front panel, can the bump buttons on the subs be made into macro triggers (as per 520) - people do like to be able to do direct selects of their palletes and a button is so much nicer than a touch screen!

[peter]

Submasters already can act as cue stacks on Orb, taking a range of cues from your master cue list.

 

At present the sub flash keys don't have the ability to be made into Macro triggers, but this would be an easy change. Although, do you want them to perform a macro, or the ability to link a palette directly to them? or both?

[thelxbloke]

One little question, on the ion (which this will be a competitor to) all the submasters can act as playbacks, in the hog style. Seeing that the Orb runs similar software to the Frog II which does have multiple playbacks is there any reason why all the subs couldn't be playbacks (or can they already?)

 

From the new "layout" page on the Orb's website:

 

10 Submasters across 20 pages offer flexibility for scene building and double as multiple cue stacks for larger shows.

[JDP]

Peter Peter Peter, you keep giving us all this information. But your avoiding the question on our lips (unless I missed it?) whats the RRP?