Bryson Posted October 15, 2005 Share Posted October 15, 2005 I don't know if this means I'm getting old, but... Last night, I went to the opening of the Carling Academy in Newcastle. I was, I'm ashamed to admit, in the VIP area, champagne, etc etc. (It's good to know the right people... ;) ) They had performances from the Futureheads and a couple of up-and-coming bands. Now, this is not the usual "the sound was too loud" that your usual grumpy ole fart gives you. On the contrary, the sound was excellent - just the right level and nice and clear too. No, we're in the lighting forum now, so my moan is about the LX. Whoever it was that lit the Futureheads was not afraid of the strobe, flash and audience sweeps buttons. Oh no indeed. In fact, the movers (Mac 600s and 500s, I think) spent 80% of the time pointed directly into the audiences faces, strobing as hard as they could. By the end of the show, instead of the once-familiar "ears ringing" I get at most gigs, I had really sore eyes from the constant flashing. The real shame was that in the few points that the guy actually lit the band and not the audience, it looked really quite nice - he had some interesting placement of the movers. It just seems to me that flashing, strobing and audience sweeps have a certain amount of "impact", and by using it all the time you lose the ability to make that extra emphasis, and give your audience really bad eye-strain.:) So, am I just getting old, or do you reckon that a little restraint is a wonderful thing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamtastic3 Posted October 15, 2005 Share Posted October 15, 2005 I suppose the whole use of strobes is to signify the chaotic rambles and climaxes in songs. I think its more of a concern and impact if the strobe was not a moving light but an actual dozen or so set of 3000W strobes pointing out to the audence. If I'm using strobing effects, I tend to use them when the fixture is moving I.e not static in peoples faces. That or strobe the bands, pointing the fixtures to them. Though I have to say I like the random strobing effect where all the fixtures flash at different times so actually the strobe is slow for each fixture.But I mostly use blinders for the crowds - you get that 'wow' factor from their faces ...mmm whats worse, blinders or strobing...? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stutwo Posted October 15, 2005 Share Posted October 15, 2005 Quote removed Bit off-topic, but what did you think of the place Bryson? Was considering going next week. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bryson Posted October 15, 2005 Author Share Posted October 15, 2005 I suppose the whole use of strobes is to signify the chaotic rambles and climaxes in songs. I think its more of a concern and impact if the strobe was not a moving light but an actual dozen or so set of 3000W strobes pointing out to the audence. Actually, it was that too... ...mmm whats worse, blinders or strobing...? Both....? Bit off-topic, but what did you think of the place Bryson? Was considering going next week. Overall, pretty good. Strange misguided choice of decor in places (Brown carpet? Is it still 1977?) but sound was good, so you can't argue with that for a music venue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andy_s Posted October 16, 2005 Share Posted October 16, 2005 definitely with Mr Bryson on this - if I go to see a band, I want to see and hear the band, not the audience. if I want to have flashing lights pointed at me, I go to what used to (in my day) be called a "disco". Or I would if I didn't have this gammy leg and bad back....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bright spark Posted October 16, 2005 Share Posted October 16, 2005 I only want lights pointing at me if they are effective and nice. I hate bands who insist on using blinders all the time, and I really dislike people who point macs at the audience for ''effect'. Also, pointing lights at the audience (unless its done 'properly') can look rubbish unless you have proper coverage. The ONLY band I have seen point lights at the audience properly and effectiveley are Pink Floyd (LD Marc Brickman)... With regards to strobes, I think they are only effective if a song is building up to a fast tempo, not just strobing for the sake of it.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Modge Posted October 16, 2005 Share Posted October 16, 2005 It all really has to depend on the music IMHO. I love strobes as blinders for thrash/death/heavy metal, for Indie and soft wanna be rock never. Though to be honest I try to avoid soft wanna be rock anyway. Fast random strobe on open white with some sort of break up gobo moving about lots and not pointed at peoples faces looks cool in my book as well, if used sparingly. definitely with Mr Bryson on this - if I go to see a band, I want to see and hear the band, not the audience. I can see where your coming from on this one, but the best lit gig I've ever seen (IMO obviously) was "a perfect circle" at the Birmingham academy a year or so back and they had no front light at-tall. It looked really really good, though confessedly as arty as their music. They had lots of movers on the floor of the stage at varied heights, doing lots of slow moving wible around there feet and leaving them as just as silhouette(sp?) And whilst mole fay are better for cooking people with I'd rather look at one of them than an atomic. Though the both option Bryson mentioned I've seen look cool. And really quite bright. (Sorry for the English was being young last night - drinking chess is neither big nor clever) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andy_s Posted October 16, 2005 Share Posted October 16, 2005 definitely with Mr Bryson on this - if I go to see a band, I want to see and hear the band, not the audience. I can see where your coming from on this one, but the best lit gig I've ever seen (IMO obviously) was "a perfect circle" at the Birmingham academy a year or so back and they had no front light at-tall. It looked really really good, though confessedly as arty as their music. They had lots of movers on the floor of the stage at varied heights, doing lots of slow moving wible around there feet and leaving them as just as silhouette(sp?) (Sorry for the English was being young last night - drinking chess is neither big nor clever) I can cope with this, front light is by no means essential - my point is simply that the lights should be focusing your attention on the turns ( however artistically) rather than giving me snow-blindness and a headache. If I've got a light in my eyes, I can't appreciate the beautiful effects on the stage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
niclights Posted October 16, 2005 Share Posted October 16, 2005 I can't agree more. All types of lamp and focus have their place, but many new LD's seem to have no concept of this. If the band is 'big', then audience lights/strobes may have their place, but only occasionally or you loose the impact.If I was to have a preference then the blinders win over the atomic bursts anyday. But IMHO blinders should only be used on full momentarily for that 'wow' factor. If they are to remain on to light the audience then they should be used at a level just high enough for that purpose. I saw a seemingly identical example of this with another of the 'next-big-thing' bands last week. Effectively the show was nothing....blinders full/atomics burst full...again...nothing...nothing... etc. For the whole show. Terrible, yet the operator seemed oblivious. You know it's bad when all the sound crew are talking about it at the end! Similarly I often see LD's turning on lamps/testing specials during changeovers. Not only is this annoying, but where is the sense of theatre? As I have already ranted about in another thread too many LD's don't appear to choose fixtures according to the music style/application. So much modern music looks ridiculous with movers, yet they insist on using them. The same applies to LED's. Why? Pars are still my favourite lamp and yet they are so simple.... My personal favourite demonstrations of the correct use of fixture are Pink Floyd-Pulse for movers (still unbeaten IMO) and Rammstein-Berlin (Gert Hof) for pars! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Modge Posted October 16, 2005 Share Posted October 16, 2005 The Motor head "Silly big par-can rig" is officially great. No call to go and sully it with movers,and so far they haven't. They do have 5 atomics though (or at the gig I saw them do , again academy Birmingham) they used these to good effect i.e. as others have stated not too much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ken Coker Posted October 16, 2005 Share Posted October 16, 2005 Nope, sorry..........you're getting old. I think it's what those pesky kids do these days................ However, I had a student that tried to strobe the carol concert - until his mates took him behind the dimmer racks and hit him with a stick. I do, however, have similar feelings about modern typefaces.........imagining that I can even see them with my current glasses. Cheers Ken Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamtastic3 Posted October 16, 2005 Share Posted October 16, 2005 slightly :** laughs out loud **: topic but carrying on from some things said earlier:I think that a rig with LED's is not a particularly interesting site - probably just because they are individual LED's. I haven't used LED stuff yet and I'm guessing it must be a wonder to use the stuff because of what you can get out of them but seeing them on T.V (TOTP, CDUK) they just don't look very good to the eye. Bring on the parcans, movers and dare I say harvesters!? Back on topic, I was at a gig in Edinburgh a couple of years ago for a 'battle of the bands' contest and on each side of the stage they had a row of 3x 3000W strobes facing the audience and at the front of the crowd they must have been about 2 metres away.It wasn't a exactly great when the LD strobed the crowd because everyone just had to look away - also my friend who was next to me was epileptic and couldn't bare it. We moved to the bar after the first band Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
niclights Posted October 16, 2005 Share Posted October 16, 2005 LED's have their place, but they don't have to be used simply because they are the latest thing! They are just another tool and when (if) they manage to create equivalent of a focused 575 discharge then things will really start to happen. Personally I prefer LED's to be diffused - ie. a block of colour that simply illuminates itself, rather than illuminating other things or projecting light. IMO on smaller stages the raw LED's are too bright when viewed on axis and you can see the individual RGB when viewed off-axis. Once there is enough distance between the units and the audience this is less of an issue. Perhaps I am just old too.... Incidentally I'm sure that CDUK copied me with the panels.... :** laughs out loud **: (isn't this whole thread 'offtopic'?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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