Has anyone ever found/used a "push-to-talk" type app for iOS/Android that could work instead of Clear-Coms on a show?

[jona1984]

Anybody ever heard of or use some kind of push-to-talk app that lets technicians talk to each other in real time whilst operating a show, kind of like ClearComms but everyone uses their own devices/headphones?

Also this isn't an essential requirement so I'm only looking for FREE apps if anyone's created anything like that. I bet Clear-Com themsevles have probably made an app like that already and charge $30 a month per device for it because they realise how pointless it is becoming for anyone to still use their outdated headset models....!

[Bryson]

I know of some schools that use either Discord, Zello or similar apps, but, they just aren't reliable enough for professional use.  Plus the headset situation isn't great.

 

I doubt Clearcom are all that worried.

[Ynot]

I sincerely doubt that there will be anything practical that will be sufficient for this that can replace a proper talkback setup. People have talked for years about using other methods of comms between stage and other areas, such as 2-way radios, but every other option has its downfall. PMR Radios are only simplex operating and anything using wifi or bluetooth will have lag issues and reliability problems.

Personally, I don't see the point in trying to replace a perfectly good system of communication - if you can't afford to buy, just rent when you need to.

 

[J Pearce]

There are various ways to do it, but none of them are as good as a wired comms pack. Using a mobile phone is relying on battery, the user's own device, and a solid wifi setup. 

The easiest route would be to setup your own VoIP server, and use a softphone on each device dialling into a group call running on that VoIP server. Then you'd need a strong network setup for VoIP QoS, with multiple access points to serve all zones. Do you want to become a network administrator, or do you just want to plug some comms packs in and get back to the kettle for a brew?

Clearcom do have their own system for comms over BYOD, and it integrates with their wider comms systems offerings very well. It's most useful for integrating remote workers, or across massive sites where direct cable runs are problematic.

I wouldn't call Clearcom outdated either, they and the other suspects all have a wide range of modern systems to suit various budgets. I'm a big fan of Clearcom's Helixnet system for oldschool partyline user interface but with LAN backbone and vastly improved sound quality and channel density.

[mackerr]

There are a couple of production comms apps that know of. I think the most widely used is [url=https://www.unityintercom.com/pricing]Unity Comms[/url]. There are 6 channels available on each phone, very low latency, and good audio. The user app is free and available for IOS or Android, the server software costs real money, but server time can be rented from a few people. Unity was the main production comm for the live police show in the US. All camera comms, IFB and program feeds were done on cellphones.

I have tested them on transcontinental connections and they work remarkably well.

Clear Com does also have a system called Agent-IC but there are significant hardware expenses involved.

Mac

Edited March 10, 2022 by mackerr

[david.elsbury]

Look into Mumble, and run your own Murmr server. You'd still need to work out the headset situation though.

[Brian]

13 hours ago, jona1984 said:

... because they realise how pointless it is becoming for anyone to still use their outdated headset models....!

Whilst I'm sure there is a place for budget systems on shows where it doesn't matter if you lose comms to the stage manager, there are plenty, probably the majority, of shows where it really does matter.

I've just come off a huge corporate event where there was about 50 people on comms. On the rehearsal day I had a headset on for over 12 hours. Try doing that on a phone based app.

[timsabre]

For headsets, I have done some mucking about with intercom apps and if you use a phone with a 3.5mm jack you can get a splitter cable which allows you to plug a gaming headset with mic/headphones jacks into a phone. (first example off amazon: https://www.amazon.co.uk/Splitter-POSUGEAR-Headphone-Microphone-Compatible-Black/dp/B079PJL14Y)

The apps all seem to work over wifi and the problem I found was the speech latency was random and could be really high (like 2 seconds) which is obviously no good for cueing!

[xllx]

I've used Unity a few times, but only to link remote sites. It has come on leaps and bounds in the last two years.

It would work in a venue quite well, assuming you had a good stable wireless network and that everyone kept their phones charged, and didn't receive a call or a notification at an inopportune moment. The other option is phones that are just used as intercom beltpacks, and a charging regime not unlike that which we are used to fro radio mics.

These sort of soft intercoms have their place, the last couple of years have shown that, but I don't think they're a direct replacement for a good wired system.  A couple of dedicated devices linked into a cabled system would be useful now and then, but only with the proviso that the wireless network is robust and properly designed, not just a domestic access point at FOH!

I seem to remember back in the lockdown days, that all the Unity servers went offline for a few hours... Rememebr if you are relying on an external cloud based server it could all go wrong and nothing you can do about it.

 

 

[mackerr]

Here is a link to a training/demo of Unity by Pete Erskine.  https://www.facebook.com/events/303801038342512/?ref=newsfeed

[paulears]

My experience of Zello was moderately good. On proper walkie-talkies using PoC or phones, and mobile units. The radios are the most reliable. Phones seem to allow other apps precedence even when you think they’re off and brief calls can not wake them up. The biggest snag with all of them is the need to wait for access. You press the real PTT or the onscreen one, and often it takes up to a second for the system to connect and the audio to go end to end. The IP based systems are always trying to find better routes, totally out of your control and pressing the button and saying “go” often results in nothing at all the other end. Pressing the button, and saying”………………….go” might. You can also have fights with others when people press at the same time, and you don’t know which of you won! I can’t comment on anything apart from Zello.

[matt_h]

I would concur with the general concencus that you can't beat a traditional wired comms system in most scenarios.

However would a Zoom/Teams/Webex/(Other video conferencing solution of your choice) meeting with video disabled achieve something close to the result you are looking for at the budget/free end of the market? I doubt that there are niche free/cheap solutions out there, that are more reliable or stable than the conferencing options?

There are plenty of POC apps, free and subscription that do PTT, (have a search for TASSTA or WAVE) - few offer "full duplex" though...

 

[mackerr]

26 minutes ago, matt_h said:

I would concur with the general concencus that you can't beat a traditional wired comms system in most scenarios.

In a single venue you are probably right, however, there may be people involved in the production who need the mobility to leave the venue. If the production involves multiple venues, or multiple cities or even multiple countries, it is much harder to run those wires. Solutions like Unity or Clear Com's Agent IC, properly implemented are a no brainer in these cases.

[Charlotte_R]

I've just done a corporate job where techs were talking to each other via slack.

[alistermorton]

How well does it work?