Lamplighter Posted April 24, 2019 Share Posted April 24, 2019 Are you going to remind us?, Lots of coffee (and other fluids) have flowed since then.Brian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BML Posted April 24, 2019 Author Share Posted April 24, 2019 Well the **** hit the fan this evening with one committee member saying that the WI use the Induction Loop System but my wife who is on the Village Hall committee replied that her husband had communicated with the WI who told him that they have never used it because they didn't know how to. Another committee member claimed that the old people's club used it but as my wife used to help out with that club she smartly told them that the Induction Loop was never used and as a result her husband could understand none of the announcements. Then the Chairman, not wishing to lose face because of his objections to spending money on sorting out the system said that he had tested the system with a machine and it worked. It was then agreed that two committee members and the Chairman would take the machine down to the village Hall tomorrow morning and test it. My wife suggested that perhaps it might be worth while to invite her husband with his hearing aid with its T switch to test the system to which the Chairman strongly objected. The meeting must have been more entertaining than "The Archers". I will keep you informed. By the way, is there such a machine that in the hands of a non technician actually check out if an Induction Loop works? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timsabre Posted April 24, 2019 Share Posted April 24, 2019 Yes there is such a thing, it's basically a hearing aid in a box with headphones plugged in. Known perhaps unsurprisingly as an induction loop tester. If you can hear sound through the headphones, it's working. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sandall Posted April 24, 2019 Share Posted April 24, 2019 Yes there is such a thing, it's basically a hearing aid in a box with headphones plugged in. Known perhaps unsurprisingly as an induction loop tester. If you can hear sound through the headphones, it's working.The fact that it's "working" doesn't necessarily mean that it's usable. I recently had to check out a church system where the field strength was high enough to hear speech & music with a tester, but not high enough for a hearing-aid set to "T" to pick up anything . A re-terminate of the loop, a tweak of the drive current & a walk round with a field-strength meter & everyone was happy again. BML's saga is unfortunately an all-too-familiar one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbuckley Posted April 24, 2019 Share Posted April 24, 2019 Are you going to remind us?, Lots of coffee (and other fluids) have flowed since then. Do not have a drink in your hand. Simon's comment on hearing loop testing. Still makes me laugh like a hyena. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lamplighter Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 Thanks David, that's hilarious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Lewis Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 By the way, is there such a machine that in the hands of a non technician actually check out if an Induction Loop works? There's two types of unit:1) A field strength meter that installers - should - use to check and sign off a loop installation.Features vary from a simply readout of magnetic field strength in the audio range to more complex app based versions. Typically, they'll read background noise level, frequency response and field strength. These units can be slightly pricey (a few £hundreds). 2) A loop "listener" - which is little more than a telecoil and headphone amp. These are around £50 - £70ish and I encourage their sale with loop installations so that owners can test the loop by actually listening and determining that there's usable content (rather than looking at the signal strength meter on the amp). The comment that has brought dbuckley so much joy is still very true. Some installers see that the loop amp is producing signal without actually checking what it is producing! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Junior8 Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 Surely there is a third type of unit - someone with a hearing aid turned to T. Probably available for the price of a pint! Probably more reliable too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Lewis Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 Surely there is a third type of unit - someone with a hearing aid turned to T. Probably available for the price of a pint! Probably more reliable too. You are right - there is such a "unit"! In fact the British Standard recommends that a user listens to the loop as part of commissioning. However... there can be some drawbacks... Users vary from those wearing small "vanity" units with just a small amount of gain and no telecoil fitted, through to 'power users' who might have profound or near total hearing loss but may use an aid for some sensory assistance rather than to gain "full speech".Some may have had hearing and lost it, others never had it, so can't describe what higher frequency sounds are like.Some have a good technical understanding, others struggle to even work out how to select the telecoil setting or pronounce that the aid is broken when it's just a dead battery or blocked plastic tube. So - having an aid user is very useful, but having an informed knowledgeable aid user is sooo much better ;-) I will seek user feedback, but will also filter it with the knowledge that perceived faults may not necessarily be a problem with the induction loop. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sandall Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 Surely there is a third type of unit - someone with a hearing aid turned to T. Probably available for the price of a pint! Probably more reliable too.Available, yes. Reliable, perhaps not. It's a bit like a warning light. It might indicate low or zero current in the loop, but it might also indicate an insensitive hearing aid, or a change in hearing loss since it was fitted (f you have glasses you are bombarded with reminders for your annual retest, but trying to get an aural retest can be a bit like seeking an audience with the Pope). E2A: TBH I haven't actually tried for an audience with the Pope, so I may be being unfair to the Vatican. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuart91 Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 Some installers see that the loop amp is producing signal without actually checking what it is producing! The church I grew up in had Radio Two bleeding onto the loop system for many years. Nobody complained until it was "rectified". Surely there is a third type of unit - someone with a hearing aid turned to T. Probably available for the price of a pint! Probably more reliable too. Cultivating a reliable hearing aid user can definitely be worthwhile. However for many people, loop quality is quite subjective and often all you are finding out is the quality of their hearing aid (or their competence in setting it correctly) than the loop itself. I've had a number of call-outs where a loop is working perfectly, the complainer hasn't successfully switched to "T". One unfortunate chap had an American-manufactured hearing aid. He couldn't pick up the loop signal despite it coming through loud and clear on my listener. A quick call to Ampetronic and it turned out that this particular manufacturer had mounted the telecoil 90 degrees out of line, so the aid wouldn't pick anything up from a normal wearing angle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Junior8 Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 I meant a calibrated 'unit' of course. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pscandrett Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 One unfortunate chap had an American-manufactured hearing aid. He couldn't pick up the loop signal despite it coming through loud and clear on my listener. A quick call to Ampetronic and it turned out that this particular manufacturer had mounted the telecoil 90 degrees out of line, so the aid wouldn't pick anything up from a normal wearing angle.What did you do - get the guy to lie down on the floor to hear things?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuart91 Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 What did you do - get the guy to lie down on the floor to hear things?! Pretty much. Unfortunately he was also the one signing the cheque for the installation. Thankfully he saw the funny side, and paid the bill! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ninjadingle Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 Surely there is a third type of unit - someone with a hearing aid turned to T. Probably available for the price of a pint! Probably more reliable too. I'm adding this on my CV.... Also be aware the T position can vary between users too. Users can choose to have a blend of mics with loop or loop only, and this can be adjusted within the program of the hearing aid. This is why I've had mine adjusted to loop only (no mics) and when I test a loop I turn the main PA amps off first so anything I hear is loop only. Not had to put my head on the floor yet, but have had breakthrough from loops that are installed on top of one another in a building (different floors) - good work! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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