Zarges Skymaster- delivery difficulties

[Yorkie]

I've previously bought a couple of 7 rung trade Zarges Skymaster ladders. A couple of weeks ago I bought a 12 rung Industrial Skymaster (from an online supplier that I'd not used before). Tuffnells delivered it and it was received at reception (in a place where I do jobs fairly regularly). I unpacked it about an hour later and found that one of the rungs had sustained a whack during delivery. I phoned the seller immediately and sent them a photo of the damage, they have been generally unhelpful and say that they can't afford to make me a happy customer as I had apparently accepted it. Long story short, best they could do was offer a refund if I had it couriered back to Zarges in Bletchley where it was dispatched from. They said this was dependent on Zarges signing for its receipt though. I asked Paypal to review the situation as they had processed my credit card payment. They have concluded similarly that I can have a refund if I fork out for it to be delivered back to the supplier of my ladder.

 

I am in two minds as to what to do now... I am not content with paying full price for a premium ladder and have it turn up looking abused (since I'm self employed I tend to look after my kit). Either way I think I will return it personally to the supplier for a refund, even though it will cost me half a day, but what do I do then... Does anyone know if I can collect a newly purchased replacement direct from Zarges, is it worth me speaking to Zarges directly, what are they like with end user support? My other option is to buy a ladder whose seller/manufacturer will pack it adequately- does anything else match up to Zarges product quality? All advice welcome, except anything I cannot do retrospectively... (Had the courier called ahead which is often the case with oversized items, I would have inspected the delivery the moment the courier appeared...)

 

If you sell Zarges products and would do me a deal if I collected one personally from Bletchley, please drop me a PM with a price for a 3x12 Industrial Skymaster

 

Edits for spelling and grammar

[IRW]

Can't help you with the direct problem I'm afraid, but based on the situation you've been put in, maybe this is an occasion to name the supplier, as it sounds like extremely bad customer service!

[ontoprigger]

See if you can make a claim against the delivery company. I always ask for anything I have delivered and signed for on my behalf to be signed as un inspected or not checked. It gives you a little more leverage if you have to make a claim

 

 

 

[Stuart91]

maybe this is an occasion to name the supplier, as it sounds like extremely bad customer service!

 

Whilst I have sympathy for the OP, I'm not sure there's much more the seller could realistically do.

 

How much packaging would need to be applied to the ladder to prevent any damage in transit? The only time I've seen a rung broken on a ladder was when a stage weight was inadvertently dropped on it. Unless it's in a full wooden packing crate I can see how you could rule out damage entirely.

 

The delivery has been signed for as being in good condition - this means no comeback with the couriers. A small mail order operation will have very little clout with them.

 

The cost of a return delivery will be significant - especially if the ladder is to be picked up from the customer. Depending on quite how thin their margins are, that could knock out all the profit from three or four other sales.

 

The seller is the only one in this sorry saga not at fault - yet they're expected to absorb the cost of other people's screw-ups. It seems a little unfair to name and shame.

 

 

The moral of the story is to always check deliveries - even if it means leaving the courier standing there whilst you do. A few years ago I had a large flightcase delivered. It was fully shrink-wrapped and looked immaculate. We signed for the delivery, and discovered a hole in one flank. The wood was burst through, so we suspected that the damage had occurred before the wrap was applied. Sending the case back was going to be prohibitive for all involved, so a compromise was reached - the seller shipped us a dish piece which we were able to fit over the hole. Problem solved for a relatively modest amount of money. It's a shame that there's not an equivalent solution in this situation...

[marktownend]

My experience of sorting issues like this is to go higher - try to raise the problem higher within your supplier and also contact the area or even head office of the courier company as presumably you're assuming they actually caused the damage. Although Zarges may be able to help put some pressure on, it looks like it's not their fault that someone else damaged it. They must ship thousands every year and if there was a significant problem with their packaging not giving sufficient protection then they'd have huge numbers of complaints.

 

Once you reach the people with the authority and the wish to see the customer right it's amazing how quickly things can get sorted.

[madorangepanda]

First off, I'm a Zarges dealer.

 

When items are delivered direct from Zarges they normally ensure that the item is covered in stickers saying to check for damage before signing, as they themselves can't make a claim with the courier once it's been signed for. Though it's perfectly understandable that you weren't around and the damage wasn't noticed straight away. When this happens to us we just arrange for another ladder to be delivered and the damaged one taken back and take the hit on the delivery and collection costs etc

 

Did you pay for this as a business or as an individual? As an individual you have much more protection available to you and should be entitled to a full refund of all costs, including delivery and collection if the goods were received damaged. Having signed for them as in an ok condition doesn't hold much weight if the damage only became apparent after unwrapping the item.

 

I hope that you're able to get your money back in this instance.

 

If you'd like to arrange to get another ladder, possibly whilst returning the damaged one to Zarges, please check your PMs.

[jonathanhill]

Talk to Zarges, this happened to me a while ago. They just sent me a new third section, even though it was bought through a third party.

[itiba]

The requirements of the Consumer Contract Regulations may come into play here especially as you would have ordered the ladder as an individual (being self-employed).

 

This document from the Office of Fair Trading contains the following (with my bold):

Terms requiring that the goods are accepted as satisfactory on delivery, or imposing unreasonable conditions on their return. Consumers have a right to a reasonable opportunity to examine goods and reject them if faulty. In the case of complex goods, a reasonable opportunity to examine means a chance to try the goods out. Consumers cannot legally be deprived of this right by being required to sign 'satisfaction' notes on delivery, or by being required to return goods in a way that may not be possible – for example, in disposable packaging that they are likely to discard after opening.

 

My opinion would be that an hour (or indeed any time the same day) would fall within the 'reasonable opportunity to examine goods' clause. An approach by the seller to impose such a contract term on yourself would therefore be in breach of the regulations.

[Yorkie]

Thanks all for your input so far!

 

Item was ordered/paid for as an individual, via a personal paypal account using a personal credit card. Since they've decided (like the vendor) that I am responsible for return postage costs, I might give them a ring in the morning.

 

I'm hoping that this http://www.which.co.uk/consumer-rights/action/letter-to-refuse-paying-the-cost-of-returning-a-faulty-item-

will help with getting it collected. Else this might help http://www.which.co.uk/consumer-rights/action/letter-to-get-a-refund-if-your-item-is-faulty

[sleah]

Is it not the case that you pay the return postage, but then the vendor refunds the postage cost on receipt of the faulty goods?

That's how I understand it 'normally' works and seems acceptable to Trading Standards. :unsure:

[madorangepanda]

Edit: removed

[musht]

As an aside, had some difficulty getting an 8` section of alloy extrusion delivered.

 

First one tubed , bubble wrapped, fragile labels, tube and contents snapped.

 

Second one bubble wrap, lots of tape, fragile lables, aerrived bent at 90 degrees.

 

Third one, the power of threatening twitter ;-), clear plastic bag and address label , no other packing, arrived mint.

[Yorkie]

I suppose it's about time I updated this one....

 

Paypal's buyer protection said I was responsible for return postage costs of the ladders; their man on the phone told me this was because they had no legal right to demand that the seller paid them. He suggested that I talk to the credit card company about a chargeback.

 

After sending two letters (a week apart by recorded delivery) with wording from Which - http://www.which.co.uk/consumer-rights/action/letter-to-refuse-paying-the-cost-of-returning-a-faulty-item- and http://www.which.co.uk/consumer-rights/action/letter-to-get-a-refund-if-your-item-is-faulty- I had an e-mail from the vendor saying it's definitely too late for a refund now (with a unhelpfully repeated accusation that I was probably returning the item as I'd damaged it during use...)

 

I called the credit card company. Once I had the authorisation to talk to them (as I'm a named cardholder but not the primary account holder), one call sorted it. The card company's man went through the vendor's website and assured me that their T&C's were badly written at best. I sent him an e-mail with copies of my letters (which had already served the appropriate information upon the vendor) and a copy of the invoice. The payment was refunded a few days later, with the caveat that the vendor had 45 days to make a challenge. Paypal immediately sent me an e-mail to say they'd opened a case in their resolution centre, and they were giving the vendor ten days to represent themselves. The vendor said nothing so Paypal closed the case. It seems all is now well.

 

My remaining query now is who owns the ladder that is still in my posession, having never been collected as requested?

[peza2010]

What ladder? ?

 

Its probably not worth their time and money in collecting it, fixing or throwing away the broken bit and testing it is fit for use.

[Brian]

My remaining query now is who owns the ladder that is still in my posession, having never been collected as requested?

 

Send them a letter by recorded delivery pointing out that you have had a refund and that therefore the ladder is theirs. Give them a reasonable period of time to arrange collection, say 14 days, and tell them that after that you will dispose of the ladder as you see fit. After 14 days, take it to a scrap yard.