d_korman Posted January 15, 2016 Share Posted January 15, 2016 Hi, Does anyone know how the flaming dessert + fire extinguisher scene is done for the One Man, Two Guvnors UK & Ireland tour this March, and if the kit might be available for hire afterwards? We have a licensed local amateur production at the end of April and need to replicate this effect. Thanks, Moderation: I have edited the title and text above - it’s a “dessert”, not a “desert” - this caused some confusion... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ynot Posted January 15, 2016 Share Posted January 15, 2016 Hmmm... I'll be designing for this very play in September, though have not actually seen the tour (despite being on the load-in/out at Curve last year).But I would question the 'replication' of the pro version's staging. I'd rather see the rehearsals and my director's interpretation and needs and then design something for our own production which fits the author's original direction... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d_korman Posted January 15, 2016 Author Share Posted January 15, 2016 Hmmm... I'll be designing for this very play in September, though have not actually seen the tour (despite being on the load-in/out at Curve last year).But I would question the 'replication' of the pro version's staging. I'd rather see the rehearsals and my director's interpretation and needs and then design something for our own production which fits the author's original direction... All we have is what's in the script - the director is most likely going to ask us what we can do, and rehearse round that, rather than the other way round! Does anyone know the answer to my query? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ImagineerTom Posted January 15, 2016 Share Posted January 15, 2016 Highly unlikely to be available to hire and even if it is, comfortably out of the price range of am-dram as the consumables of the prop itself alongside the manpower, storage and paperwork/compliance costs are all quite significant. You should be looking at alternative technologies and trying to avoid any actual fire/flame component to it all as that almost instantly takes the cost of the prop outside your budget and aim to create something that has the same manic air of the original without directly aping it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d_korman Posted January 16, 2016 Author Share Posted January 16, 2016 "Highly unlikely to be available to hire and even if it is, comfortably out of the price range of am-dram as the consumables of the prop itself alongside the manpower, storage and paperwork/compliance costs are all quite significant." Thanks, but those are decisions for us in discussion with the theatre management and our insurers. Now - can anyone answer my question as to how it was done? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gyro_gearloose Posted January 16, 2016 Share Posted January 16, 2016 Now - can anyone answer my question as to how it was done?Tom could, but you'd have to pay him to tell you as designing such effects is what he does for a living. I don't know if he designed the effect you are asking about, but it was almost certainly created as a one-off for that particular show and isn't something you'll find in the Lemaitre catalogue, for example :) You can't really expect him, or anyone else, on this forum to give away details of creating that effect for free, can you? And of course there is always the very valid point that if you have to ask how to re-wire a venue/fly a performer/set fire to part of the stage/insert any other potentially dangerous task here then you shouldn't do it, and should seek professional advice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d_korman Posted January 16, 2016 Author Share Posted January 16, 2016 Now - can anyone answer my question as to how it was done?Tom could, but you'd have to pay him to tell you as designing such effects is what he does for a living. I don't know if he designed the effect you are asking about, but it was almost certainly created as a one-off for that particular show and isn't something you'll find in the Lemaitre catalogue, for example :) You can't really expect him, or anyone else, on this forum to give away details of creating that effect for free, can you? And of course there is always the very valid point that if you have to ask how to re-wire a venue/fly a performer/set fire to part of the stage/insert any other potentially dangerous task here then you shouldn't do it, and should seek professional advice. Oh FFS. None of you knows anything about our knowledge, experience, qualifications or resources. I can think of a number of ways of doing this - I'm just looking for a general idea on which technology they used to save too much re-inventing of the wheel. Where did I say we wanted anything for free? Did you miss the word "hire" in the OP? Don't read meanings into words that are not there, or tar other people with your own agenda. If someone had said that they knew how it was done/did it and would be able to do it but not for free, we could then enter into an offline discussion about the possibility of paying them to provide this for us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kerry davies Posted January 16, 2016 Share Posted January 16, 2016 However you manage it do be aware that the "audience member" is a plant and is an actress well rehearsed AND CLOTHED for her part. Apparently she comes off-stage and dives straight in the shower. I could find out the precise nature of the effect as one of the crew is a family friend I knew as a schoolgirl but for the reasons that Gyro states I really don't think I should. This is a pet BR topic with me. Replicating things is always less rewarding than using creativity. Trying to copy a Robbie Williams stadium show in the village hall is never going to work Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d_korman Posted January 16, 2016 Author Share Posted January 16, 2016 However you manage it do be aware that the "audience member" is a plant and is an actress well rehearsed AND CLOTHED for her part. Apparently she comes off-stage and dives straight in the shower. I could find out the precise nature of the effect as one of the crew is a family friend I knew as a schoolgirl but for the reasons that Gyro states I really don't think I should. This is a pet BR topic with me. Replicating things is always less rewarding than using creativity. Trying to copy a Robbie Williams stadium show in the village hall is never going to work Yes, we know about that - and the theatre has shower facilities extremely close to the stage. If the person responsible for this effect is on the forum, I'd be interested in an offline discussion with him or her about the possibility and costs of providing a version of this for us. If not, then we'll look into engineering our own version or come up with effective alternative. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ImagineerTom Posted January 16, 2016 Share Posted January 16, 2016 It has around £150-200 of consumables and disposables cost per performance, requires a few dozen rehearsal performances just to get the timings convincing, requires a specifically trained / dedicated crewmember and has a stack of RA's bigger than the rest of your show put together. It required large chunks of the set to be specifically modified and treated to make them able to withstand the "abuse" this scene causes as well as the extra flame proofing and sight-lines needed to ensure the sequence could be presented safely and reliably. This sequence was also modified a number of times on tour because of the different safety implications and practicalities in different venues. The sequence you saw was created as a specific result of the technical constraints of THAT production with THAT budget and THOSE performers/crew; it simply isn't an off-the-shelf system that could be picked up and dropped in to your production. Above all this particular sequence of events and gags belongs specifically to that original production and is NOT included in your license. It's not practical for you to copy the original production, I'd be very surprised if it's financially viable (and if you have got that much spare cash I've got other areas of the show you could spend it on to better effect) for you to do that original sequence, you don't have permission to do that original sequence and, above all else (and as I have suggested) you could create something much more practical and just as funny in the spirit of that original sequence for a lot less time, hassle and money than it's going to cost you to copy the original production. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pscandrett Posted January 16, 2016 Share Posted January 16, 2016 For those of us who haven't seen the play, can someone describe the effect/scene please? The only bit of One Man, Two Guvnors I've seen is the snippet in the NT50 live performance. Reading between the lines/putting the snippets I can deduce from people's posts together, I'm struggling to imagine a scene where a planted audience member and a desert aflame fits into that. I've got visions of camels on fire walking on stage and a front-row punter leaping up and putting them out so far, which makes very little sense! The plot synopsis on wikipedia doesn't give any more clues... Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ImagineerTom Posted January 16, 2016 Share Posted January 16, 2016 End of act one The Man needs some help with a dessert trolley and "randomly" selects someone from the audience to help him, they're briefly disturbed by one of the other actors and she is very badly "hidden" under a dessert/hostess trolley with huge oversized dessert on top of it. Dessert "accidentally" catches fire and semi explodes (at various times its been pyro, gas jet or just shed-loads of flash paper), audience member scrabbles out from under the flaming trolley screaming, the man grabs some water and throws it over the spectator, another actor runs on with the off-stage fire extinguisher and empties it all over her (and half the set) and several "stage crew" rush on concerned at the flaming, watery foamy mess engulfing the stage. The man then breaks the fourth wall and suggests the audience take a 15min interval whilst they try and fix the stage. So that's multiple live fire sources, water thrown about onstage, fire extinguishers and a stage that ends up needing to be mopped down and dried. The particular version also really does require some very good split-second timing from the cast because (like all farce) it's the pace and spontaneity that makes it funny; half a beat slower or anything done less frantically or "over the top" would kill the entire joke. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ynot Posted January 16, 2016 Share Posted January 16, 2016 So it's a flaming deSSert scene, not flaming deSert...Sorry to be pedantic (I haven't seen the script yet myself) but as with much of the English language an extra (or missing) letter actually does make a great difference. And D_Korman, as is the problem with any member who's not shown credentials here on the forum, the tendency here is always to advise caution rather than dive in with the 'how-to' in cases where safety and high risk are prevalent :)Don't think it's a personal attack, but even from my own first comment, it's aimed at maybe using the director's imagination and YOUR crew's creativity to achieve what was originally written rather than copying the big budget effects on a smaller stage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gyro_gearloose Posted January 16, 2016 Share Posted January 16, 2016 Oh dear. I seem to have upset the OP. Not my intention, I can assure you. Oh FFS. None of you knows anything about our knowledge, experience, qualifications or resources. No, we don't so we do tend to advise caution with regards to the things I mentioned in my previous post i.e. electrical mains wiring, rigging, pyro, etc. Basically questions about anything which has the potential to injure or kill people will usually be responded to with the phrase 'If you have to ask how to do it, you'd best get the professionals in'. If someone had said that they knew how it was done/did it and would be able to do it but not for free, we could then enter into an offline discussion about the possibility of paying them to provide this for us. You could always ask these people;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pscandrett Posted January 16, 2016 Share Posted January 16, 2016 So it's a flaming deSSert scene, not flaming deSert... Ah, thanks (and and also to Tom) for the clarification/correction. (I knew it was a farce so didn't think it particularly unlikely that a desert would crop up!). Sounds like an interesting effect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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