UV Lighting

[bitofagiggle]

Hey guys, sorry for the ultra newbie question but I've never really done any lighting other than in college.

 

I'm looking at getting a UV light or two for my band. I've got some basic lighting already but have never bought a UV light so don't really know what brands/types of lantern to go for. It'll be used mainly in small rooms like pubs and I can't spend more than £50 a unit (I know that's not much but at least it's more than those crap things from Maplins that don't seem to do anything). Should I be getting one of the florescent tubes or are the 'spotlights' better bang for your buck? I am willing to buy second hand however.

 

Thanks for any help guys!

 

 

p.s., sorry if this should have been in effects, like I say, I'm new to this side of the forum.

[paulears]

UV flu tubes are cheap and effective, but need careful handling. UV floods create more shadows because they're a point source - they use fairly expensive lamps too. I'm not sure what the actual point is though? For special effect UV looks good, but no good for the whole set because UV doesn't stand up well against any other lighting - it's impact vanishes with quite low conventional light levels. UV on it's own will make some clothes glow, but tends to make faces black. Nice idea if your guitars or drum skins glow, and the band wear UV costumes - but to perform in for a whole set it's quite unpleasant. The thing I hate is that staring into UV sources is a bit weird - your eyes can't focus and it's just not nice for more than ten minutes or so.

 

So what is the actual idea?

[Jivemaster]

UV is only part of the effect! The important parts are the Fluorescent items that should glow in the dark when hit with UV.

 

UV is nasty to work in for long periods- try single figures of minutes for comfort.

Fluorescent clothes etc only glow in the dark -the effect is too weak to stand any room light.

Some odd things glow unplanned so sometimes you need to cover things.

 

Work out the whole effect before you pay money.

 

Fluorescent lamps come in Compact Fluorescent format, linear fluorescent format from 4" to 4' and discharge lamps needing special fittings. LED fittings are available too.

 

http://www.terralec.co.uk/lighting/uv_lighting/11540_0c.html

http://www.terralec.co.uk/effects/uv_products/11541_0c.html

Will give you some ideas

[kerry davies]

My opinion would be to avoid UV like the plague in pubs and small venues with semi-static audiences. The closer to the sources you or the audience are, the shorter exposure times need to be to be absolutely safe.

 

You do not want it in your face, take it from one who has suffered "arc-eye" in a former life and worked extensively with UV tubes and cannon. Certainly not beaming down on you for hours from a foot above your head and five feet in front of you.

[bitofagiggle]

Thanks for the input guys! I'll talk a bit more about what I'm thinking of. My band has this gimmick of having interesting face and body paint at every gig and basically what I was thinking was to do some of our shows with tribal styled patterns, Celtic knots and such painted over us but with a body paint which appeared to look normal until put under a UV light. It wouldn't be for an entire show, more for an interesting entrance and a fun ending as we always try to end our sets in a dancey, club like vibe (cue lasers and strobe etc..). I thought UV would add nicely to this effect. It would be nice for both the stage and audience to be under the glow but I would rather have either or illuminated well than both done badly.

 

Is there much difference in intensity between the spot UVs and tubes?

 

Also, I've seen a few "UV strobes" advertised. Also, does anyone have any experience with these and do they work like you would expect? Obviously I wouldn't expect it to have the same impact as a traditional strobe but I wanted to test it out slightly out of phase with a 'regular' strobe to see what sort of effect that creates.

[paulears]

UV strobes tend to just be UV LEDs, as LEDs can strobe easily - but they're not mega bright, like a real strobe (ordinary white LED ones too).

 

A row of flu tubes is pretty bright, but the cannons are punchier. I do quite a few UV scenes, and often something goes wrong with the feed (human issues) and 4 horizontal UV tubes are virtually as bright as the two 400W discharge cannons - but the UV effect from the cannons is more vivid, colour wise. The tubes are the best for coverage - so both at the same time are best for our venue.

[birt]

I lit a monologue that ended with a scene where UV lighting took over from the normal theatre lighting. (lights dimmed as the UV lights warmed up)

the whole stage was covered in the text of the monologue and this only became visible in this last scene. to get the effect bright enough (stage was 7.5x7.5m) we had 4 hanging pendant lights, aluminium warehouse style that were part of the scenery. each one fitted with a 125W discharge UV lamp and hanging at about 3m high.

there were two 400W discharge cannons as well, stage left and stage right front corner just over the first row of the audience at about 4m high.

 

I might have some photo's of that somewhere on my computer.

 

as others have said and you already mentioned it yourself, it's good for an effect. not for long periods of time. though it works pretty well for longer times at parties if you combine it with pinspots and maybe a mirror ball.

[greenalien]

Where stage lighting is concerned, many people use the term U/V incorrectly. What is generally meant is more correctly called Blacklight, i.e. near-U/V. Real U/V is used in things like sunbed tubes, and should never be used on stage, as it can cause eye damage and skin burning. Blacklight has the harmful wavelengths filtered out and is safe, even for relatively long exposures, although some people are more sensitive to it than others.

The most cost-effective blacklight source is specialised 4-foot fluorescent tubes - they can be mounted in a standard fluorescent tube fitting, but need to be caged or boxed as the tubes are fragile. The tubes are 36 or 40W and cost around £10 each. Blacklight cannons use 400W discharge lamps and cost around £100 for lamp and housing. The lamps are fragile and they run quite hot, and many people find them more 'glary' than the tubes. There are also LED fixtures available for a similar cost, the long-term reliability of these units is apparently less than white or RGB LED fixtures, so be cautious if buying second-hand.

[adam2]

Something to consider in the longer term, is the possibility of the lamps for UV cannons being no longer available.

In many countries the manufacture or sale of mercury lamps is being restricted on energy conservation grounds.

Whilst I would expect UV lamps to be exempt, manufacture of them is unlikely to be economic without the large sales for general lighting.

 

UV fluorescent tubes have many applications and are most unlikely to become unobtainable in the forseeable future.

[timsabre]

Something to consider in the longer term, is the possibility of the lamps for UV cannons being no longer available.

In many countries the manufacture or sale of mercury lamps is being restricted on energy conservation grounds.

Whilst I would expect UV lamps to be exempt, manufacture of them is unlikely to be economic without the large sales for general lighting.

UV fluorescent tubes have many applications and are most unlikely to become unobtainable in the forseeable future.

 

UV lamps are not mercury lamps, they are metal halide with a blacklight filter on the outer glass.

[bitofagiggle]

The most cost-effective blacklight source is specialised 4-foot fluorescent tubes - they can be mounted in a standard fluorescent tube fitting, but need to be caged or boxed as the tubes are fragile. The tubes are 36 or 40W and cost around £10 each. Blacklight cannons use 400W discharge lamps and cost around £100 for lamp and housing. The lamps are fragile and they run quite hot, and many people find them more 'glary' than the tubes. There are also LED fixtures available for a similar cost, the long-term reliability of these units is apparently less than white or RGB LED fixtures, so be cautious if buying second-hand.

 

Can you recommend any suppliers for blacklight products? I've had a look at Terralec but don't really know who else might do them.

[adam2]

Something to consider in the longer term, is the possibility of the lamps for UV cannons being no longer available.

In many countries the manufacture or sale of mercury lamps is being restricted on energy conservation grounds.

Whilst I would expect UV lamps to be exempt, manufacture of them is unlikely to be economic without the large sales for general lighting.

UV fluorescent tubes have many applications and are most unlikely to become unobtainable in the forseeable future.

 

UV lamps are not mercury lamps, they are metal halide with a blacklight filter on the outer glass.

 

 

Are you certain ? the 125 watt UV lamp that I have in front of me certainly looks like a mercury lamp, and it works on a standard 125 watt mercury choke. Also it starts from line voltage, like mercury lamps, without any need for a high voltage ignitor circuit.

[timsabre]

UV lamps are not mercury lamps, they are metal halide with a blacklight filter on the outer glass.

Are you certain ? the 125 watt UV lamp that I have in front of me certainly looks like a mercury lamp, and it works on a standard 125 watt mercury choke. Also it starts from line voltage, like mercury lamps, without any need for a high voltage ignitor circuit.

 

Um, OK the big 400W ones as used in the UV cannons you seem to see everywhere are metal halide. I don't know about smaller ones. Some types of metal halides don't need external ignitors so that is not a good guide.

[Yorkie]

For a Panto where I wanted UV, I used a vertical fluorescent tube either side of the stage. UV Tube lamps are available from CPC for <£10 delivered and I put them into IP66 single fittings from eBay, with a stuffing gland and flex from one end. For a quick nasty mounting solution we cable tied each one to a spare upright mic stands. (The base of the light fitting was on the floor however)

[musht]

 

Um, OK the big 400W ones as used in the UV cannons you seem to see everywhere are metal halide. I don't know about smaller ones. Some types of metal halides don't need external ignitors so that is not a good guide.

 

With Adam on this, 400w UV cannon lamp is mercury:

 

http://www.lamptech.co.uk/Spec%20Sheets/Iwasaki%20MBW400.htm

 

Get Smaller ones as 125/160W MBTF , Mercury Blended Tungsten Filament, internal filament acts as ballast, sometimes referred to as self ballasted mercury.

 

Metal halide UV lamps are iron doped and cost a lot more, not usually single ended lamp either.

 

Blacklight is a range of lamp colours and types in lamp catalogues, specifically what needing for stage effects is Black Light Blue, BLB in the catalogues.

 

UV `cannons` totally unsuitable for use in small venues, very real risk of sunburn and arc eye, tubes or CFLs be much better

 

http://www.toolstation.com/shop/Lighting/Energy%20Saving%20CFL%20Stick%20Lamps/Low%20Energy%20Ultra%20Violet%20Lamp/d220/sd3283/p22396