Temporary House Light

[timperrett]

In my sometimes dull world of event lighting, I have to provide house light across a large venue (think big tops, Telford International Cattle-Shed etc) which is fully dimmable.

 

So we rig a truss, put some single cell Thomas 1K asymmetric floods or Selecon Hui/Lui flood up on it at the regular intervals I know will work to give an even light across the venue (I don't use Strand Codas as I find their beam too narrow for this application) and then I cable them back to the dimmer and fade them up so that people can see when they are coming in, dim them slightly for show state, fade them out for VTs and put them up to full at the end so people can see their way out....lovely.

 

This takes up far too much of my budget on paying for power from the venue or in generators. Does anyone know of, and preferably have used, an LED alternative which gives a similar wide, flat but powerful wash at 8m?

 

Just thought I'd ask...any advice which leads to a successful solution will involve beer tokens for your local establishment...unless you are 18 in which case you can just have the satisfaction of teaching a "professional" (whatever one of those might be) a thing or two about lighting!

[david.elsbury]

Something like the below link springs to mind, however I don't know what is out there that is dimmable- except for the theatrical stuff, and if you're trying to replicate the light output of a 1kW fixture, el cheapo LED won't cut it...

 

http://www.yucyled.com/images/products/20111025100006526w300h300uyucy/50w-led-flood.jpg

 

http://www.yucyled.com/led-flood-intigrated-circuit/728562.html

[Brian]

...if you're trying to replicate the light output of a 1kW fixture, el cheapo LED won't cut it...

You'd need three of the LED units David linked to in fact.

[mrboo]

Most led kit that is not DMX is not dimmable due to there power supply's but you can get DC dimmer power supply's so it depends on what driver pack is used as some are fixed and some you can dim. there are now units that can output the same as a 1kw but I dont know what power they use and there cost is lots more we are talking £100s more

[Pete]

Have you considered space lights?

I realise it's not an LED solution but might cover more area for the same power?

[jono9691]

A google search for "dimmable led street lights" came up with interesting results. Worth looking into.

[ramdram]

Had a play with one of those units referred to by D.E. It was the 6 LED version; beautiful piece of kit, all the colours and rf RC. Bright as anything...in a room.

[timd]

Depending on budget, the Pulsar Chromaflood 200 might be worth looking at. Incredibly bright, 45 degree beam and a very smooth dimming curve. Also IP65 rated, since it's designed as an architectural unit.

 

I've played with a couple recently, I was very impressed.

[Andrew Edwards]

The last lot of Hui/Lui's I purchased had 'do not use as house lights' all over the place. Even the name of the item on the invoice...

[adam2]

The LED floodlights linked to are not dimmable, they are however cheap and use little power.

Is dimming in fact required ?

It should be possible to obtain a wide variety of lighting levels by switching the lights in groups, remembering that a fair number will be needed.

 

Three circuits, A, B, C.

 

A---------3 lamps

B---------5 lamps

C--------12 lamps

 

A=3

B=5

A+B=8

C=12

C+B=17

A+B+C=20

 

That gives 6 levels of lighting, and all but the last one one is about 50% brighter than the preceeding level.

 

Another option would be CFL floodlights switched in two groups so as to give 3 levels of lighting, and also low power tungsten lamps on a dimmer.

Even for a large venue the tungsten lamps could be as small as 100 watts each, remembering that higher levels can be obtained from the switched CFLs.

As an example, one could obtain 80 lux, 50 lux, and 30 lux by switched LED/CFL floods and variable up to say 20 lux from tungsten lamps.

 

Dimmable CFLs are now available, but dont always give satisfaction especialy at the bottom of the dimming curve.

This may be partialy worked around by dimming the CFLs in two groups.

Put about 80% of the lamps on one dimmer, and the other 20% on another dimmer.

Start will both circuits on 100%

Then dim the larger circuit down to off, the CFLs may flicker or go out near the bottom, but this wont be conspicous as it will be partialy masked by the 20% of the lamps still on full.

Then dim the smaller circuit down to say 10% and snap to off.

The use of two circuits gives smooth control from full down to 2% of total light output.

[dbuckley]

Could you use HMI lighting? It's dimmable (despite what philistines might tell you), though not down to below some number like 15%. But it does have the advantages of lots of lumens per watt, and it's white.

[DrV]

The last lot of Hui/Lui's I purchased had 'do not use as house lights' all over the place. Even the name of the item on the invoice...

 

Apologies for temporarily diverting the topic but why would that be?

 

Dave

[Tomo]

Right now, the only real, practical LED replacements for houselights are DMX controlled.

 

2-wire dimmable fixtures just don't cut it, while some of the more recent Philips MasterLED comes the closest I've seen.

Even the "2%" or "5%" minimum some manufacturers claim is annoyingly visible during a fade to black as it snaps out at the end.

- Though if you never fade to black this doesn't matter.

 

- If you do go the 2-wire dimming route, check the dimming technology! A lot of these 'retrofit' devices actually need reverse-phase (IGBT) dimming and don't work at all on the 'normal' SCR/Triac dimming you almost certainly have.

 

There are quite a few venues using "White", "White White", "Amber White" or even full colour mixing LED fixtures as houselights.

The "AW" installs I've seen worked very well, though the "RGB" ones were a bit harsh.

 

The main difficulty is finding the fixtures with enough lumens and a nice beam that fits your budget.

The cheap ones are just that - cheap.

[rossmck]

I've seen a few venues (the largest that comes to mind is the Apollo Victoria) which now use RGB LED DMX controlled house lights and even incorporate them into the show in a couple of places. They also have crafted their fade out so when the house fades out it also shifts to a warmer colour temperature mimicking the incandescents that were there before.

 

There's a good article on these at http://www.etnow.com/news/features/2003/stageapollo/index.htm

 

As far as dimming mains LED products on a traditional dimmer.. some of the Philips stuff comes close and works well, as do some of the commercial and domestic downlights - although not much use in a temporary venue as the OP requires I can see these perhaps being installed in smaller venues - for instance much of my house uses the Halers H2 connected to triac dimmers and they work smoothly down to about 3% (then unfortunately snap out!)

 

I've used budget RGBAW parcans pointed at a ceiling in small temporary venues as houselights, it worked quite well, but the dimming was still a bit steppy compared to good old floods.

 

 

 

 

 

[Ynot]

Slightly off the OP's topic, but I'm still looking for some high output yet not-breaking-the-bank type low energy switchable working light floods for lighting our auditorium as cleaning lights. Tried most of what CPC has to offer in LED - none have turned out bright enough...