Patt. 45s

[pscandrett]

We have a couple of old Strand patt.45 lanterns - fairly ancient by definition! I've enjoyed researching them, from perusing the BR archives to reading other websites. It does appear however that they are, well, completely useless, frankly. From powering one up I've found that their nicknames eg toaster - look like one, and give as much light and heat as same! - are fairly accurate. One of them works for sure - I don't know about the other, I didn't spend much time examining them really - because there didn't seem much point if they were realistically only scrap material. (How does one determine the age of one?)

 

Does anyone know if they have any, well, value? I can't bear to throw out anything that't a) working or b) potentially useful but we certainly don't have a use for them and although it would be a shame to dump them I can't really think of any alternative. About the best thing I can think of is to swap the 250W lamp for a 'new' 60W spot or something and use them for 'artistic' lighting somewhere, either at work or home.

 

Any thoughts?

 

PS Why am I never[1] near the much fabled treasure troves of skips that actually have things worth having in them?!

 

[1] for certain values of never...

[stevep]

Patt 45's are pre-war - generally built in the early 1930's. Light output is pretty much pointless in comparison to modern fixtures.

I doubt they've got a value, beyond being an antique - or as a show prop, but put them on Ebay and you might be surprised

[Andrew C]

Do them up, chrome them, and use them to light the foyer?

[Grandmaster Dwarf]

Hi there, would have to agree, unfortunately, with everyone else's comments about these lanterns being entirely useless due to the fact the nothing comes out of the front. You ask how you date them, well firstly what series of Patt45 s are they? The first generation were indeed pre-war, being introduced in 1930. These had E27 (normal Edison screw) with a 250W lamp. This was uprated to a P28 (push and turn version of a type of a bayonet fitting, well sort of!) taking a 500W lamp, in 1952. These have a classic pre-war shape and are sort of octagonal and heavy. The Patt 45 s referred to as toasters are normally the next generation made from 1960-1978 (replacing the a Patt 45 made between 1952-1960, that was designed to take T class lamps) this last design looks like a metal cornflakes packet, has no reflector and isn't heavy enough to even function as an effective door stop, I love old lanterns, but this last one really was merely a way of Strand being able to provide lanterns on a budget and they sold loads but I would agree with the suggestion of using them as props or decorative pieces. Value, well you are intersted in them so you never know someone else might be as well- happy hunting, all the best.

[pscandrett]

Hi there, would have to agree, unfortunately, with everyone else's comments about these lanterns being entirely useless due to the fact the nothing comes out of the front. You ask how you date them, well firstly what series of Patt45 s are they? The first generation were indeed pre-war, being introduced in 1930. These had E27 (normal Edison screw) with a 250W lamp. This was uprated to a P28 (push and turn version of a type of a bayonet fitting, well sort of!) taking a 500W lamp, in 1952.

The one I looked at the other day has a 250W 10ishcm diameter lamp push and turn semi bayonet thingy that you describe fitting. Can't remember the precise shape of the case though, sorry!

 

Thanks for the info.

 

Incidentally, whilst we're talking about 'old' things... we do gigs in all sorts of venues, including churches and schools - and sometimes we come across old round pin style yet 30A rated sockets/connectors. We use standard ceeform for all of our kit and so have a bit of a collection of converters to and from things... and although these plugs are one up from having dimmers permanently wired into the supply, they're... well, they look ancient!

 

It's come to mind as we've recently done a gig (actually, this afternoon) in one of these schools who have had these 30A connectors. It's proven difficult to track down any info about this on the web, bizarrely, let alone getting hold of any of these. Noone seems to stock them or want to show me a picture of them. The closest I've got is thinking that it might be part of the 2/5/15A range of BS546 (IIRC) connectors but it's really been tricky finding anything about them. Ideally we'd like three of the plugs (if they're not too expensive!) to make some adaptors so we can plug our stuff into the supply at some of these schools. Can anyone tell me what they're called so that my search might be more fruitful and, indeed, where we might be able to get some? (If anyone has any that they'd otherwise be skipping, please PM me! :-)

 

We only come across these perhaps once a year or so so it's not exactly important but any info's gratefully received :-) (Hmm, perhaps this should be in the 'electrical and power' subforum...?)

 

Many thanks

 

Peter

 

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[Brian]

Incidentally, whilst we're talking about 'old' things... we do gigs in all sorts of venues, including churches and schools - and sometimes we come across old round pin style yet 30A rated sockets/connectors. We use standard ceeform for all of our kit and so have a bit of a collection of converters to and from things... and although these plugs are one up from having dimmers permanently wired into the supply, they're... well, they look ancient!

Lewden do a range of 30A round pin connector - usually seen in a watertight version.

 

Sort of picture here.

[jamienip]

The good old strand archive (here) has a good picture.

 

We had some similar lamps, made by Furse at the school I went to, looking from the front, they were an oval shape, and were a nice sort of bronze colour. (edit: They are similar to P44, but rounder). They also had the bayonet/push and twist in type lamp base. Awful pieces of kit, but would look nice if anodised in a more pleasant colour, and as AndrewC said, stuck in the foyer somewhere, or maybe even use as a fancy desk lamp in your office?

[Andrew C]

We had some similar lamps, made by Furse at the school I went to, looking from the front, they were an oval shape, and were a nice sort of bronze colour.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

Furze? Ohh Gods, the only use for those things was as a ballast for the power companies! I'd not even waste the effort chroming them. More like a small, local black-hole than a lantern...

[jamienip]

We also had some patt 137's which were basically baby patt 60's, pretty useless on their own, but with about 16 you could just about muster a warm wash. Comical to say the least.

[Ben P]

Jim Laws is always a good bet if you want to pass them on. His number is 01502 675264

 

Ben

[J Pearce]

Looking at the picture from the Strand archive there are about 8 of these at my old high school.

They get very occasional use when we've run out of lanterns or replacement lamps.

[P. Funk]

We had a couple of the Furse models as well. They've kind of died a bit now though.

[Darkfold]

I might be buying one just to install the guts of a toaster into it. Was thinking along the lines of plug it in and when you started toasting, have a small torch bulb come on at the front by the lense.

Not sure if its worth the hassle

[Mush]

Have a couple of Major 6" fresnels lying about, main advantage is that they are heavy enough to use as a door stop. Know nothing about Major apart from guess that there progress may have been halted by buildings requiring strengthening to use their lanterns.....

 

Also have a couple of 1K Pat 49 floods lying around, good for impressing non technical people with that big bulb look :-)

[Dave]

...sometimes we come across old round pin style yet 30A rated sockets/connectors.

 

...The closest I've got is thinking that it might be part of the 2/5/15A range of BS546 (IIRC) connectors but it's really been tricky finding anything about them.

 

My understanding is that BS546A (you are correct, this is the BS for 2/5/15A plugs) does indeed include a 30A version - simply a larger version of the 15A plug.

 

There used to be a couple of these outlets on the concourse at Euston station, but I think they've been replaced by ceeforms. I also have a vague recollection of seeing some of them feeding Mini II packs in a theatre somewhere - I'm sure I borrowed the plugs to feed my rig - but I've no idea where.

 

I think they fell out of use decades ago and are now obsolete. The Lewden sort that Brian mentioned have a screw locking ring, but the pins may well be to the standard arrangement and they should mate up.