JTilling Posted October 24, 2017 Share Posted October 24, 2017 Hello everyone I have been tasked by a local night club to strip out and re-rig there entire lighting and sound rig and whilst in there they would like a couple more moving heads. They must be suitable for both silly flashy moving around stuff for the normal club nights as well as for the many tribute band nights they have in there. Ideally I'm looking for beam lights rather than wash's although I know there are a lot of good hybrids coming out as well. Unfortunately the outstanding word here is CHEAP! I'm talking around £100 - £200 per unit. Also looking for a new hazer for them as well as all they have currently are smoke machines whose smoke clears rather to quickly for what they want. Again the same budget applies. All units but be up to a fair bit of use and need to last a couple of years. Any advice is greatly received. Thanks . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david.elsbury Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 I wish you well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gareth Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 I'm talking around £100 - £200 per unit .....{snip}.... up to a fair bit of use and need to last a couple of years http://www.blue-room.org.uk/public/style_emoticons/default/laugh.gifhttp://www.blue-room.org.uk/public/style_emoticons/default/laugh.gifhttp://www.blue-room.org.uk/public/style_emoticons/default/laugh.gifhttp://www.blue-room.org.uk/public/style_emoticons/default/laugh.gifhttp://www.blue-room.org.uk/public/style_emoticons/default/laugh.gifhttp://www.blue-room.org.uk/public/style_emoticons/default/laugh.gifhttp://www.blue-room.org.uk/public/style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timsabre Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 As the other 2 replies suggest this is an impossible task. In the £200 range you can only buy cheap disco tat which will no way stand up to continuous nightclub use. My advice would be to refuse to buy cheap and tell them a realistic budget, if you buy something cheap it will be forever your problem when it keeps stopping working. £600-£800 will get you something of nightclub standard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTilling Posted October 25, 2017 Author Share Posted October 25, 2017 Well aware that cheap does not last but never the less it is a paying job and I dont want to just turn it down. I know that Lanta do a couple of tumblr's for £150 a piece (+VAT) so I dont think its an entirely impossible task. The club owner has said he's entirely up for some of the foreign knock off's as there is only a couple years left on the lease anyway! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timsabre Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 Well aware that cheap does not last but never the less it is a paying job and I dont want to just turn it down. Won't pay very well if you have to go back every 2 weeks at your own cost to fix the broken down cheap tat you installed. (I've been here myself - wanted to help the customer out by finding them something to meet their meagre budget - but it became a maintenance nightmare and the customer held me responsible despite the warning I'd given, which they denied ever having heard and it was verbal so no proof. Would have been wiser to refuse.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
osmosis Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 If you are a Highlite dealer there are some Showtec movers within your budget, you will get some kind of warranty with them as well. I have no experience with the really cheap range but have been fairly impressed with there infinity range. I'm sure there makers like headbanger and Chauvet would have similar products, again will come with some kind of warranty. Unlike some ebay imports. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigclive Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 That's the worst thing about nightclubs. They make so little money that they have to get enthusiasts to supply and install the lighting at their own expense. Just like churches really. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTilling Posted October 25, 2017 Author Share Posted October 25, 2017 they have to get enthusiasts to supply and install the lighting at their own expense.<br style="color: rgb(28, 40, 55); font-size: 13px;"> Im not just an enthusiast this is my job, also its not at my own expense at all. The club is paying for all of it including mine and another technicians hours for the two day rip out and reinstall! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gareth Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 If the budget is that tight (£100-150 for a moving head), it's almost a given that the equipment they can afford to have you install won't be up to the job of regular use in a nightclub. That means you're going to get endless calls to come and fix the kit that you installed for them. But if they can't afford decent fixtures they won't be able to afford to pay you for maintenance visits. But they're going to insist that you go and fix the kit because "you put it in, so it's your responsibility". I hope it works out OK for you - it may well do. But if it was me I'd politely decline this one unless they can find some more in the budget for decent gear that'll last the course. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigclive Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 Im not just an enthusiast this is my job, also its not at my own expense at all. The club is paying for all of it including mine and another technicians hours for the two day rip out and reinstall! What size is this club, how many nights does it run and what sort of attendance does it have? If it's a popular venue with good turnover then they will benefit greatly from using appropriate equipment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulears Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 I'm not as negative as many others, but there are ways you can do it to solve the problems. Firstly DO NOT buy the equipment yourself, because most night club owners have a very poor memory as to what was agreed, so sort out a deal where you will recommend and suggest and they pay you for your 'management' of the project - they purchase the goods themselves. This also helps if they are VAT registered and you are not, because if they get hot with the VAT on import (always a gamble) you are not left out of pocket. So what you do is offer them three different packages, a very cheap one, then the one you want, then a more expensive option. You provide them with honest comments on the negatives of each one, and the positives - which there really will be - because some prices are genuinely cheap. If the plan requires 6 of one model, you specify 7, and give the client the option of retaining one as spares stock, or using it and taking a gamble on spares availability in the future. As for the kit and lifespan - it is nowhere near as doom and gloom, because most nightclubs, apart from the really posh ones don't looks after their installed kit, and are quite content replacing it after quite short (by comparison with theatre) lifespan, and anyway, people get bored with the same thing weaken week out. I've been very pleased with cheap Chinese kit, and if the budget means 2 'name' brand units, or 8 to 10 Chinese ones, I'll take the Chinese ones every time. I bought a large amount two years ago for use in my pier venue, and it's 6 months use, then 6 months dark - literally dark, through the winter in a salty environment. I think there are somewhere around 30 units of all kinds. All of it is now 2 years old. So far, I've repaired one, and swapped out two power supplies. I've repaired the LED driver in one, and put in a new driver board in another. One has developed a lack of accuracy - it seems to always be a few degrees away from where it should be, and another - one of those B-eye lookalikes is different from it's partner, the lens assembly in a slightly different position that seems to resist me changing. All of them show slight signs of rust on the exposed unprotected metalwork, like the screw heads. Some of them are the RGBW zoom washes with the lenses mounted on a plate that moves in and out for zoom, and one sticks a bit if the head is spun 180 and then reversed - it catches. I've just removed everything and I have just one fault that needs fixing - the red had failed, but this was simply a dry joint, and a ten second fix. For less than ten grand, there are a lot of heads of 4 different types, and it's really been painless. In fact, in panto we tend to use the hire stock from one well known decent company and the expensive Robe's are far more unreliable. Sure, mine don't get trucked around the country and rigged and de-rigged in the same way, but even so ............ Chinese lights when you pull them apart can actually be quite well designed and constructed - read one of BigClive's recent reviews on a dirt cheap one that he found to actually be quite good. The critical thing is that you do NOT want to be liable for their reliability, so give the owner a choice, and do everything apart from use your money. I've done this quite often with one local nightclub - I provide the details of what to order, and then I go and charge for installing and programming. When they die, if I can fix them, I do - if I can't and the damn things are always gunged up with dust and cheap haze fluid. None of the ones I have bought have been bad buys. Two years old, all paid for in their first year, making money in their second, and apart from one driver board I'm waiting for, all still working. Of course the build quality, lifespan and extras on the expensive name brands is there, and missing in the Chinese products. I do have three or four cracked mouldings and there's a screw rattling inside another - but that really is that. I know that I'll buy more with no qualms at all. £100-150 isn't going to get you particularly bright or well specified units, but you might get rather a lot of them! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
musht Posted October 26, 2017 Share Posted October 26, 2017 this is my job.... The club is paying for all of it.... hours for the two day... Is your job lighting retail , in which you really need at least 100% minimum gross margin, so your 150 - 200 quid unit has to cost you 100 quid trade max. Fine if it is but usually need to shift volume to get price down. Or is your job install, programming and maintenance so that what the client buys THEIR lites at the best price with your advice, you will install for them, program them and perhaps a return clean up a few weeks later in the deal. If they want breakdown insurance, tech on 24 hour call out, regular maintenance , re programs, trained operators not a problem at all, at additional cost. Your a service provider unless you want to move into equipment sales. If its beam effects on yokes , pinspot successors,tumbling dice, harvesters etc , 200 quid a unit should be enough to fill up some space, think people may be thinking of full featured moving heads. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timsabre Posted October 26, 2017 Share Posted October 26, 2017 He said "suitable for tribute band nights", that rules out motorised disco effects like you are suggesting... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
indyld Posted October 26, 2017 Share Posted October 26, 2017 Well aware that cheap does not last but never the less it is a paying job and I dont want to just turn it down. Won't pay very well if you have to go back every 2 weeks at your own cost to fix the broken down cheap tat you installed. (I've been here myself... Swipe left. Clients with no money are always -EV. Sort their current kit and tell them to save up. (Edit: EV = Expected Value. Just realised I used a term from a different industry.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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