IRW Posted March 19, 2013 Share Posted March 19, 2013 Hi All,We've got 2x Chilli 2410 racks in our venue, and I'm getting a fair bit of nusiance tripping of channel MCB's going on. First things first, I know the equipment on the end of the circuits is electrically sound. Secondly, it only seems to happen when I put about 2Kw on the channel. One lantern on the channel and it's fine, however, pair 2x Par 64's, or 1K Sil's and it takes the trip out. Often, I can then kill the channel, reset the trip, and it will be fine for the show. Is this something to do with the in-rush current through the MCB? I can't remember the specific type, but they are 10A, so should be fine with a 2Kw load! Is it worth us 'warming up' the channels as part of the rig check? It doesn't happen on every channel, just a select few. Thanks, Ian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbuckley Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 The only reasonable explanation is inrush current. I just googled for the dimmer and the brochure says it has a Type C MCB, which is normally sufficiently "slow" for stage lighting applications. Diagnostics: check your actual supply voltage matches the rated voltage of the lamps you are using. Solutions: First, you could build the lamps up more slowly, which will have artistic implications. The other approach is to preheat, 5% or something similar, just less than the dull red glow. This will mean that the filaments are not fully cold when the power is applied. Edited for SPaG. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
themadhippy Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 I’ve got a nagging memory the early chilli’s had type B fitted Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbuckley Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 If that's the case then yeah, that would be less than good. Problem is that just swapping them out for Type C's might mean the electronics are inadequately protected, and that would also be not good... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
numberwrong Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 I had a similar problem on a Zero88 Beta pack with 4 cell moles. Was at a festival and channels kept tripping. thought it might be over current so set topset to 50% but no joy. It was very weird but pre heat solved the problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
photographic08 Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 I've come across Chilli's doing this. Anything above 2k and they start tripping if you bring up the channel too quickly. Warming those channels seems to help, plus where possible fade those channels up, on the wheel or whatever, rather than just calling it up at full. The other thing that helps is not going above 90%. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 It's not completely clear to me when things trip. Is it... a) when you patch in a lantern?b) power up the racks?c) completely random? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ianknight Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 Ian - before you ring Keith at Zero, pop the covers off the Chilli's and check the mains connections where the mains enters the rack. You're looking to check that the incomer live & neutral are stripped sufficiently to have copper contacting the clamp and that the clamp screws are tight on both sides of the incomer terminal block and if the Chilli's have incoming RCD protection that the clamps on those are tight. We install a dozen or so Chilli's every year and have very few problems with them (and the problems we have don't tend to be nuisance tripping), however the one's that we get called to that we didn't install usually have incorrectly tightened terminals (and Keith will tell you stories about field visit's he's done (at a dealers insistence) to non working Chilli's to find similar faults). If the terminals on the Chilli are tight then work your way back as far as you are able along the mains incoming chain checking for loose terminals. If you can't see anything obvious or don't find any 'loose' clamps when you do this, then call Keith and ask for more pointers. :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gibbothegreat Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 We had considerable problems with this with our Chillis: when new, all our lanterns were fitted with 1.2k lamps and a pair of those would trip the dimmer even when being wheeled up gently at no more than 40%. We lamped everything down to 1k, but even then a 2k pair would trip a 10amp CB if snapped to full. For info, voltage is around 240, and CBs are all type C. Two curious things we found: the tripping wasn't instant - working with the remote in the dimmer room, there was a lag of about a second betweent snapping to full, and the CB tripping, and it varied according to lamp type - a pair of ParCans wouldn't make it trip, a pair of T19s would. Applying pre-heat made if all go away, and they behave absolutely fine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adam2 Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 2,400 watts of lanterns will be marginal on a 10 amp circuit.In theory it is JUST ok, but if the mains voltage is generous or the lamps are designed for 220 or 230 volts, or if the lamps are slightly over the nominal wattage, then tripping is to be expected. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IRW Posted March 20, 2013 Author Share Posted March 20, 2013 It's not completely clear to me when things trip. Is it... a) when you patch in a lantern?b) power up the racks?c) completely random? It's when I turn a channel on from the desk. Come to think of it, probably to full. Sounds like I'm not alone with this! I'll try put some of the suggestions and see if it goes away! Thanks, Ian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevep Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 have the same problem with install 6's at a venue near here - agree with the comments that preheating tends to help - but it still continues to happen - only solution we have is to try to avoid loading anything up to 2K whenever possible and keep complaining about them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gyro_gearloose Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 We've got three Chillies that the hippy installed ages ago. Our circuit breakers will only trip if a lamp blows. They didn't even trip when the cable on a Source 4 caught fire as I was about to focus it :o Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
themadhippy Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 There the buggers I was thinking about,out of interest what type of breakers are fitted are the B or C type as I remember them tripping as soon as slim looked at them funny Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gyro_gearloose Posted March 21, 2013 Share Posted March 21, 2013 I think they're type C. I'll check when I go in later today. We really don't get nuisance tripping on them though. They only usually trip if a lamp blows, and sometimes not even then. I don't know if this makes much difference, but our mains voltage is somewhere around 245V. A little high, but not out of spec. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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