Jamtastic3 Posted February 10, 2005 Share Posted February 10, 2005 Hi, I was just wondering what the main 'rules' were again for using strobe lighting because I've totallly forgot them. It's within a venue or nightclub. I use a 10m Pulsar flexi flash strobe tubing containing about 20 mini strobes. I just wanted to know such things as strobe flash rate, how long a strobe 'session' is and the time between a first strobe session and the next session. I just want to make sure because I don't want someone falling to the floor because of too much strobing or flash rate.Cheers to all Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vinny baby Posted February 10, 2005 Share Posted February 10, 2005 I think its more of a case of being sensible. I only ussaly use strobes in bursts, not full on!! I meen im not medically impaired but I get kindy dizzy after about 15 seconds!! I think there is a guidline on strobes, but not 100% sure Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Posted February 10, 2005 Share Posted February 10, 2005 The official HSE notice is here. Also, loads of other stuff if you search the Blue Room with the word 'strobe'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mush Posted February 10, 2005 Share Posted February 10, 2005 Hi, I was just wondering what the main 'rules' were again for using strobe lighting because I've totallly forgot them. It's within a venue or nightclub. I use a 10m Pulsar flexi flash strobe tubing containing about 20 mini strobes. I just wanted to know such things as strobe flash rate, how long a strobe 'session' is and the time between a first strobe session and the next session. I just want to make sure because I don't want someone falling to the floor because of too much strobing or flash rate.Cheers to all<{POST_SNAPBACK}> Its polite, maybe mandated, to put a sign at the entrance advising that stroboscopic lighting effects and theatrical fog are in use within. Mebbe a warning by the strobe fire button that the operator can clean the puke off the gear if they cause it, is more effective. Mush whose had that slippery multi feeling more than once :-( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vinny baby Posted February 10, 2005 Share Posted February 10, 2005 interesting, never knew there was a limit on FPS, seems its got to be less than 5fps! again, still manufacture strobes capable of flashing faster (or slower which ever way you want to look at it). its the the whole road speed limit thing again, can only do 70 on a motorway, but they manufacture cars that can do well over 200!! I still dont get it. also 1 in 10,000 people are affected, thats not very many! Its polite, maybe mandated, to put a sign at the entrance advising that stroboscopic lighting effects and theatrical fog are in use within. Yep always done this, to cover myself! BUT.........trouble is ive had one incident in the past where I put a sign up and somebody has had a fit. They actully tried to pursue legal action against me. I actully asked them straight out. Didnt you read the sign. they answerd "what sign"? the 3ft by 3ft sign on the door when ya came in. She said she didnt see the sign. Im sorry but if I had an illness, and I was going to a venue where there is a high chance strobes will be in use, I would be looking for the frigging sign. I probably wouldnt even venture into the venue, and put myself at risk. I think some people are ignarant towards illness sometimes, its like when people get heart problems and they are told to slow down and retire.............do they nope!! carry on with the job in hand, and carry on to smoke 20 cigs a day. sorry bout the rant, but I nearly lost everything due to that claim, good job I used the fupin huge sign, or I would have gone under! vince Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stu Posted February 10, 2005 Share Posted February 10, 2005 Didnt you read the sign. they answerd "what sign"? the 3ft by 3ft sign on the door when ya came in. She said she didnt see the sign.I've always thought it might be worth making an annoucements either at the beginning of the show (after FOH clearance) or when doing FOH calls to get the cattle in stating this show uses strobe effects etc etc. Does anyone do this out of interest? Can't be any harm in making these points in both a visual and aural format. Stu Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peter Posted February 10, 2005 Share Posted February 10, 2005 I'm afraid I have to disagree with some of what you're saying, vince. A number of my relatives and friends are epileptic. Depending on the environment they're entering, they'll normally "take the risk". Something like 2% of all epileptics are actually photosensitive, so the risk of a seisure is relatively low. If you are a known photosensitive epileptic, you'll make damn sure you check for the signs. Other epileptics would probably rather live a normal life than avoid every single situation where flashing, strobing, etc occurs - one of the worst situations for triggering photosensitive epilepsy is driving a car along a road which is lined with evenly spaced trees. If the sun happens to be shining at the correct angle relative to your driving speed, it can trigger a seisure. It is the responsibility of the venue to ensure that the audience are aware of any potentially dangerous situations which could arise from attending a performance. This could be in the form of a sign, or could be a verbal announcement at the start of a performance. What I'm trying to say is that not all epileptics know that they're photosensitive, and those who do will probably take heed of your signage. Unfortunately, those who don't know can't really be blamed for not paying too much attention. You don't honestly read all the safety signs before you go on every ride at alton towers, do you? Incidentally, I've been to a performance with one of my epileptic relatives and they asked the ushers if they could make her aware just before the strobing occured. They did, and she was able to cover her eyes for the duration. Surely this is a much more inclusive attitude than avoiding the entire performance due to perhaps 10 seconds of strobing? Edit: Just checked, and accoridng to this site, its 5% of all epileptics. Edit 2: I wonder what we could do if an epileptic person turned up at a venue prior to a performance, and saw signage indicating the use of strobe effects. If they decide they're unable to attend the performance due to the risk, are they entitled to a full refund? Or should the strobes be cut? This is one area where the DDA may come into play - is the use of strobes discriminating against those with photosensitive epilepsy? If so, do we have a social and moral responsibiltiy to stop using them, or to disclose is all advertising material that the use of strobes is intended? Sorry to steal the thread, but as I'm sure you've noticed, this is an area close to my heart. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Light Console Posted February 10, 2005 Share Posted February 10, 2005 snip... If they decide they're unable to attend the performance due to the risk, are they entitled to a full refund? Or should the strobes be cut? This is one area where the DDA may come into play - is the use of strobes discriminating against those with photosensitive epilepsy? If so, do we have a social and moral responsibiltiy to stop using them..snip<{POST_SNAPBACK}> Very interesting post Peter. In the hotel I worked in last year, there was 1 show in a fortnight that required strobes in a blackout, during the second act. These were actually four Miniscans in strobe mode. The effect was used for a couple of phrases of music, off for longer, then on again for a couple of phrases. During the normal day activites, the show was advertised, and a mention about the strobe too. I had notices on every entrance (but may be tempted to make larger ones in the furture after this thread), I made an anouncement before the show started, before the interval, and before the second half. Every time the show was on at least one guest came up to me, thanking me for the notices. Most went on to say that they would like a tap on the shoulder the song before and they would leave (just as Peter noted). One person was in a wheelchair, and I just cut the effect. To me it is as simple as that, no lighting effect is worth risking somebody's life over. Besides the audience won't know where stobes were ment to be used. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Posted February 10, 2005 Share Posted February 10, 2005 also 1 in 10,000 people are affected, thats not very many!not on the face of it but consider... Take a panto run of 50 shows in a 1,000 seat house. If all shows are sold out that's 50,000 punters, so 5 of them will suffer from PSE. I'm sure that if 5 people had fits in a theatre I ran in a 6-week period then I'd be worried. The 1 in 10,000 figure is not set in stone. Other sources give... About 1 in 200 people suffer from Epilepsy (0.5%) rising to about 1 in 125 (0.8%) in 5-14 year olds. Figures for the number of epilepsy suffers who suffer from PSE varies but is reckoned to be between 8 and 17 per cent for the younger age range. This would give figures of 1 in 1,560 to 1 in 735; figures very different to the 1 in 10,000. The 1 in 10,000 figure come from a 12 year study, carried out between 1963 and 1975, on referals to a clinic serving about 5 million people and is based on 450 people presenting with PSE in that period. If anyone is really interested then get a copy of ...http://images-eu.amazon.com/images/P/1898683026.01.MZZZZZZZ.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lonfire Posted February 10, 2005 Share Posted February 10, 2005 hi,this is something I have always been concerned about.. what I have been told is that any lights that flicker or even move can cause a fit.. for example a mushroom type effect that moves fast enough can rotate beams of light past your eyes fast enough to cause a fit, so its not limited to the use of strobes.. so people that have a servere photosensitive condition tend to stay away from any club/disco type venues.. if its a theatre type captive venue I would say that an announcement IS neccessary, but in a night club or disco type venue where you will expect flashing/moving lights even a notice might not be neccessary.. I have been to many clubs and I have NEVER seen a strobe warning sign.. also when was the last time you saw a warning sign at a fair (that actualy really anoys me.. they have strobes on rides on for a long time, and no warning signs.. people might not notice the strobes before they get on and by that time its too late.. grrr) as most of my work is youthwork/charity based I tend to put up signs and if somebody comes up to me and says they have a photosensitive condition I tend to unplug strobes and try to ensure my scans don't strobe (when your running them sound to light thats quite difficult).. just a few thoughts..rgdschris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Posted February 10, 2005 Share Posted February 10, 2005 hi,this is something I have always been concerned about.. what I have been told is that any lights that flicker or even move can cause a fit.. for example a mushroom type effect that moves fast enough can rotate beams of light past your eyes fast enough to cause a fit, so its not limited to the use of strobes.. so people that have a servere photosensitive condition tend to stay away from any club/disco type venues.. In some people PSE can be triggered by moving patterns even things like railings going by if you're in a train/car. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamtastic3 Posted February 10, 2005 Author Share Posted February 10, 2005 Cheers guys for the replies.I had initially put up a sign last week in front of the front doors to the main room saying: 'Attention: This establishment may contain strobing or rapid flashing lights' and surrounded it in red LX tape so it's clearly visible. I done it because I know a friend who likes to go to different clubs but has epilepsy. Some staff think its a bit OTT but I'd rather have OTT safety than someone on the ground in a crowded club and then me getting in sh :unsure: t for it by my boss. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SceneMaster Posted February 10, 2005 Share Posted February 10, 2005 Its polite, maybe mandated, to put a sign at the entrance advising that stroboscopic lighting effects and theatrical fog are in use within.<{POST_SNAPBACK}> Sorry if this is a bit , but it would nice to know the truth about smoke machines/hazers… Why does fog/haze need a warning? I agree with you that it is polite ect… and I have one many occasions warned people... but then was told there is no need to as all it is heated water with about 1% or 2% chemical so is quite safe even for people with respiratory problems such as asthma… in fact I was actually told it can even be beneficial to them... although I would be the first one to say I don’t enjoy breathing in smoke… Any thoughts…? :unsure: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vinny baby Posted February 10, 2005 Share Posted February 10, 2005 I find with smoke effects ect, even if people are ashmatic, they will cough for the sake off it, we all know that smoke is non toxic. A long study was carried out a while back, and the results showed that most peoples reaction to smoke was phsycosymatic. meening if they spotted smoke they would automatically cough. Im ashmatic and never ever been affected by smoke effects. but thats just me vince Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david.elsbury Posted February 11, 2005 Share Posted February 11, 2005 Um, maybe I'm just odd, but I quite like the smell of smoke... um, anyways... before I return to my corner, I think that both smoke and strobes should be used in moderation... and haze can often be used, water based haze at that, rather than smoke... but if you're after smoke, that's what you'll be using. :unsure:RegardsDavid Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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