Sound proofing music rehearsal rooms

[Brian]

I thought we'd been here before....

[paulears]

Well I suppose all we can say is that it just depends on the materials you use and the care and attention you take. The other topic brian pointed to is somebody with a shed. Same problems really, but a light structure makes it much more difficult. If you are doing it yourself, then the best idea is to design it so that additional ideas can be tried. So maybe having layers on the inside AND outside of the inner room would help. What is for certain is that mass does wonders - and any lightweight areas you have in the loop will bite you! In mine, I have a small section of wall that is plasterboard and insulation board only - just one 600mm section with no horizontal studs, so if there was a fire, I could kick through into the small storeage part of the garage with the door. This section, when you go around with a mic, listening - is the weakest, but as this leaks into another sealed area, it's fine.

[jamesperrett]

thanks for that, very helpful indeed! In your opinion, do you think this will defo be enough to soundpoof the hardest of hitters and thrashers from the neighboutring properties? cheers

 

If the building that you are using is detached and as substantially built as you say it is (with double skinned brick walls) then it won't be hard to soundproof it sufficiently. You may well have more neighbour problems with people coming and going at anti-social hours. Bands have a habit of hanging around outside the studio talking loudly after a practice and driving off in noisy vehicles late at night.

 

Cheers

 

James.

[The Magus]

It's well worth consulting "Recording Studio Design" by Philip Newell, who has been designing studios ever since the early 1970s, many of them in places which have required many dBs of isolation. It's an expensive book, but a wonderful mine of information.

 

You will almost certainly find that the hard, rigid and heavy boxes you have created in order to stop the sound from escaping will sound very unpleasant on the inside, so some accoustic treatment will be necessary. Avoiding parallel surfaces (including ceiling) to minimise standing waves which can cause unpleasant echoes and resonances. Use of soft furnishing (carpet, curtains and settees) will help to absorb high frequency energy, but bass trapping may also be required to mop up the low frequencies.

 

Be careful when building your ceiling: don't let it be a weak point from which sound can escape, or all your work and the materials used for the walls and floor will be wasted. However you will need to make sure that the mass of the materials you use is adequately supported: work out what the load will be, and make sure that the beams you are using are strong enough, taking in to account the load and their span.

[mushy]

Just found this website, in any of your guys opinions, dyou think this sort of soundproofing detailed in wall, celiing and floor is sufficient for rehearsal rooms? http://www.rosewoodsoundproofing.co.uk/walls.htmlhttp://www.rosewoodsoundproofing.co.uk/walls.html

In addition to mass, you will need to decouple your inner structure from the outer one. Without this, the attenuation will be compromised.Therefore, your room within a room will need to float on heavy duty neoprene pads and not touch the outer structure unless it's via a flexible coupling.Simon

See where the inner room is detached from the outer shell, would I be leaving the gap as is or would I fill it with rock wool or the like? How do I actually get it in there if so? Sorry probs a silly question!

[Simon Lewis]

Just found this website, in any of your guys opinions, dyou think this sort of soundproofing detailed in wall, celiing and floor is sufficient for rehearsal rooms?

This is how flat conversions, new builds etc. achieve low noise transmission between adjacent rooms or between floors. This would certainly give you useful attenuation, however, such partitions tend a) to lose performance with decreasing frequency and b) may not deal with flanking transmission.

 

Effectively, you want the construction to stop sound (as the link page demonstrates) through a series of materials which provide acoustic discontinuity or provide mass. This is often achievable at reasonable cost in a domestic setting, but when you want to have a rock band playing, you need higher attenuation and to stop the floor / wall borne and indirect vibration too. Putting treatment on the existing wall and then building a fully floating 'room within a room' will achieve the best isolation. In this case, the acoustic treatment is augmented by an air gap and no rigid ties between the two structures. Exactly how much attenuation you need and how much attenuation you can achieve will depend on the existing construction and the type of bands that play.

 

The more money you commit to this project, the more you will want the advice of an acoustician who can state what performance can be achieved in your given situation, and ensure that the paper figure is realised in practice. It also means that any deficiencies between what a builder gives you (if you take that route) and what was specified are identified and remedied at the builder's expense.

 

Simon

[Jivemaster]

A good snare hit reaches 120dB and the neighbours will expect 65dB outside while they are waking but down to possibly 35 or 40dB while they are resting. Therefore you are in need of 55dB isolation for daytime rehearsals and 80dB for night time rehearsals. Also you will have to keep the outdoor noise down too as mentioned above.

 

These isolations are possible BUT (esp 80dB) at significant cost. As in the linked post above once the local noise abatement or environmental health people get aggitated by complaints then you WILL cease making noise or they will confiscate the equipment (at least).

[mushy]

Ok guys thanks, looks like this is slipping further out of reach, cost wise etc :-( .

 

[jamesperrett]

Ok guys thanks, looks like this is slipping further out of reach, cost wise etc :-( .

 

 

You haven't really given us enough information so most of the replies here are assuming the worst. Can you put up a plan of the building and its relationship to the neighbouring buildings somewhere?

 

Cheers

 

James.

[mushy]

Ok guys thanks, looks like this is slipping further out of reach, cost wise etc :-( .

 

 

You haven't really given us enough information so most of the replies here are assuming the worst. Can you put up a plan of the building and its relationship to the neighbouring buildings somewhere?

 

Cheers

 

James.

 

 

 

Ok, basically im now looking at an industrial unit which is adjoining another one which could eventually be leased by another company therefore I need to make sure theyre are hearing no noise whatsoever if someone was to move in. Therefore im starting out with an empty shell to build 3/4 practice rooms within. The neighbours arnt going to be a problem anymore as theyres none close enough in this new location to cause concersn I just need to make sure when I build these new rooms from scratch that they are totally soundproofed, not to cause concern to the potential neighbour. Ive put some prices together per room, dyou think this is feasible and will it be sufficent to keep the sound in? Also ventilation wise, how do I get round this?

 

Walls & CeilingNeoprene strip 18mtrs£105.00MDF 2.4x1.2m x 20$£540.00Plasterboard 2.4x1.2m x 20$£108.00Insulation board£400.00Fibreglass/Rock wool Insulation£115.00Wood 175 metres£130.00Total£1,398.00

 

[MarkPAman]

I've been told Auralex Sheetblok is good. I've been in a studio where it was in the walls apparently, but have no way of knowing what the result would have been like without this stuff!

 

Total soundproofing is pretty well impossible in your situation, however you can make a good attempt. I was involved in a similar project many years back with a studio & practice room in an industrial unit. IIRC our materials list was along the same lines as you. (James Perrett, is your memory better than mine?). The good bit was that our neighbors tended to work during the day, while we tended to be there at night.

[mushy]

I've been told Auralex Sheetblok is good. I've been in a studio where it was in the walls apparently, but have no way of knowing what the result would have been like without this stuff!

 

Total soundproofing is pretty well impossible in your situation, however you can make a good attempt. I was involved in a similar project many years back with a studio & practice room in an industrial unit. IIRC our materials list was along the same lines as you. (James Perrett, is your memory better than mine?). The good bit was that our neighbors tended to work during the day, while we tended to be there at night.

 

 

thanks for that, what was your end result on your project? would be good to know what you used and how it turned out? Is the studio that uses the Auralex pretty well soundproofed? Whats the noise spill like on the outside?

[MarkPAman]

We ended up with a space which we could use anytime of day. The next door unit could here some of what was happening if we were loud, but not enough to complain. (Of course a different set of people next door may have been er.. different)

 

The Auralex using studio uses it for isolation of vocal room from drum room & it works well. Isolation from outside is a more normal brick wall with gaps & various wooden layers inside that. Location is at the bottom of a long garden & noise at the nearest building is no more than next door's fountain makes.

[mushy]

We ended up with a space which we could use anytime of day. The next door unit could here some of what was happening if we were loud, but not enough to complain. (Of course a different set of people next door may have been er.. different)

 

The Auralex using studio uses it for isolation of vocal room from drum room & it works well. Isolation from outside is a more normal brick wall with gaps & various wooden layers inside that. Location is at the bottom of a long garden & noise at the nearest building is no more than next door's fountain makes.

 

Thanks for that, the majority of the practices will obviously take place at night, so if someone does eventually move in there itll most likely im hoping theyll be working through the day. But there will obviously be the odd practice through the day. I guess if I can plan it to make the rooms so theyre are the furthest away from their side that can help. Ventilation is a bit of a concern though, not sure how to go about this part of it without loads of noise spilling out.

[jamesperrett]

We ended up with a space which we could use anytime of day. The next door unit could here some of what was happening if we were loud, but not enough to complain. (Of course a different set of people next door may have been er.. different)

 

Thanks for that, the majority of the practices will obviously take place at night, so if someone does eventually move in there itll most likely im hoping theyll be working through the day. But there will obviously be the odd practice through the day. I guess if I can plan it to make the rooms so theyre are the furthest away from their side that can help. Ventilation is a bit of a concern though, not sure how to go about this part of it without loads of noise spilling out.

 

We actually had only one complaint from the neighbours as far as I remember when we had one particularly loud young (and slightly out of tune) rock band in there.

 

If I was doing it again I would do things a little differently and pay much more attention to isolating the internal structure from the outside walls - our old studio had a ceiling which was directly attached to the party wall (via neoprene) and I'm sure that this worsened the isolation. We also only treated the wall next to the neighbour - we really should have built a complete room within a room. I would also go for something like Camden partitioning (two layers of plasterboard and a layer of fibre board on studwork) or something similar all around. Do plenty of reading before starting on the project You can easily spend horrendous amounts of money on specialist products when everyday products used in a slightly different way would work just as well.

 

While you won't totally stop the sound getting out, paying proper attention to detail will probably give you a few more dB of attenuation which could well make the difference between happy neighbours and complaining neighbours.

 

Cheers

 

James.