Rock Concert Lighting

[Ike]

I have got to agree with Stu on this one, if you borow kit for free you are not likely to gets enough movers and controle to make them realy worth it. While a rig full of mover can look inpresive a couple of movers is unlikely to give the show that wow factor that im asuming you want for a rock gig.

I would suggest going for narrow angle pars, smoke/haze and maybe even a few blinders (MoleFay etc).

[vinny baby]

the only reason I surgested, him not using movers, and fat frog, is because I dont know at what level he is at, within his knolege, (dont meen to be rude), alot of first time users, when it comes to programming movers, take a while to get used to the movement, and the over 360' of the pan. I for 1 found it very confusing when I was learning the trade, also maybe Ike is right, depending on your skill, and ability, it might be worthless to get just a couple of movers, and a frog, when you get an impressive result, with multiple pars, and yes maybe a couple off molefay blinders. Most rock concerts I have worked with, have used more generic based lighting rather than intelligent, but I supose if you want to improve your ability, get some intelligent lighting and have a play, but remember if your a new comer, then programming intelligent lights can be a timely, process, and just getting your head around the fixtures features could be enough.

[DSA]

Thanks for all your ideas.

 

1) School has only 1 P64 Can! Currently I use rest of rig (profiles and Small Fresnels) to make a show!

 

2) Last year I borrowed some floods (3 in a row on the floor things) and put them on lx stands at front of stage facing audience to work as blinders - worked quite well.

 

3) School dont like the use of fog machines. I dont know if this is really true, but they fear that they will set the fire alarm off (school building is about 10 yrs old), which calls out the brigate etc. etc. and works out quite expensive!! So they insisted when we HAD to use one for 'oh what a lovely war' that they taped up all the detectors and turned off the zone of the hall/surrounding area.

 

As you can see a lot of hassle!! It could be done-but is it really worth the problems??!

 

4) I currently am very confident in prog. with our sirius 24 - ive got the frog manual off the net, and it seems quite easy to get the hang of, but I take your point re first time and all that.

 

So what do you suggest?

 

David

[Stu]

3) School dont like the use of fog machines.  I dont know if this is really true, but they fear that they will set the fire alarm off (school building is about 10 yrs old), which calls out the brigate etc. etc. and works out quite expensive!!  So they insisted when we HAD to use one for 'oh what a lovely war' that they taped up all the detectors and turned off the zone of the hall/surrounding area.

Hmm can the school not remotely unlock certain parts of the building on a temporary basis from the alarm system? I know many theatres / schools etc use these sort of systems to allow smoke / haze to be used without setting the alarms off.

 

As you can see a lot of hassle!! It could be done-but is it really worth the problems??!

 

Oh yes. Smoke and Haze in a rock gig is worth all the hassle and problems! :)

 

Stu

[Guest lightnix]

There's no law that says you "have to" use PAR64s and movers to light a rock show. There's no reason why you shouldn't use what you already have, at least as a basis of a rig, with a few extras hired in; that's what I did at school. A fresnel, fully spotted, makes a lovely tight beam; put four or six of them in a fan (as Stu suggests) and...

 

From a cynics point of view, most rock 'n' roll lighting is about making pretty patterns in a big cloud of smoke (do make sure you get a small hazer in), with most of the rig at the sides and upstage to do this. There's usually a front truss, laying down washes and some follow spots to cover the artist.

 

As also suggested elsewhere, there is little point in building a huge rig, if you won't have time to program it. Think: Small Is Beatiful, Less Is More, Keep It Simple. A few big changes at the right moments and a few tastefully deployed chases will work far better than a rig that never stops moving and flashing.

 

You will probably find that for the price of a couple of movers, you can afford a whole range of other effects (i.e. Strobe, UV tubes, mirror balls, glitter cannons, maybe a flame wheel or two), which can add punch at certain moments and give you a "bigger" looking show. When you find a hire company, ask what "FX-y type things" they have lying around that they can "help" you with :) and then apply your imagination.

 

If you really want automation, check out static units like Martin Robocolour 400s and give groups of them the same address, so that they function as one unit and don't take up acres of space on the desk. A bar of six PAR64s with scrollers might make a good centre piece.

 

When it comes to colour, once again: Less Is More. I was shown that you can happily do any rock show (any many other kinds of show) with just four colours: White, Orange, Magenta and Blue (WOMB). From that I'd probably add cyan, red, lavender, yellow, green and congo blue (in roughly that order, on a blind spec.). Even so, don't forget that more than three different colours on at once generally makes the stage look like a fruit salad. Look at pictures of large scale shows and you will often see that although there are zillions of lights on the rig, they are producing simply coloured looks most of the time.

[Ike]

You will be able to get the same effect with a profile as you will with a par so that shouldnt be a problem.

To be able to see the light beams you will however require smoke or haze. You should be able to isolate the fire detector zones around the performance area quite easily and as long as you have members off staff or responsible students looking out for fires and who are prepared to help in an evacuation there should be no problem, just dont go home and forget to turn them back on.

[benweblight]

scans £25 (rotating gobos), maybe they can do better/free, ud have to ask them

 

if u are going to hire pars instead, you might want ot add some colur scrollers to get a nice effect

[P. Funk]

4 scans on a front bar would work well .add to that just lots of symmetry, and lots of saturated colours..

 

oh yeah, and if u have a cyc, make sure you have some red, green, and blue on it. from there you can get any colour, (in a rock show just the 6 combinations of the 3 colours at full works).' you could actually do the whole rig using that technique, but individual colours work better.

 

I would seriously suggest hiring 6/12 par64s for a full stage wash, and then use the rest of your rig to add patterns and colour as needed (a spotted down PC looks lurveely in smoke).

 

if you got enuff profiles, try some breakup gobos in them. they can really add something to a show, because you no longer get the monotony of a wash across the whole stage.

 

failing that, have you got any patt23s (silver or black things from the 80s, blobs with lenses at front)? u can put gobos in them as well and it would be quite effective.

[DSA]

I have a feeling that the drama dept may have just got a 'fog machine' - dont ask me exactly what - I saw it in their office when I popped in for something. It may have been on hire thou...

 

Even if it wasnt, it was very much a DJ sort of thing - would this be OK??? I know its not a hazer - but would it suffice, if placed well?

 

I am wary that there will not be much cash to spend. If the PA is £350 again then it would prob be non-existent, as we want to make a profit, only have about 3-400 in audience and dont want tickets more than a fiver!

 

So say max £50 to spend!!!!!!!!! ARGH

 

I am worried that with beam effects, the bands will not be seen without a fairly bright f/s on them.

 

I could use a 500W profile (our normal ones), but would this be bright enough?? Alternatively I have a 1000W fresnel on a perch at the moment. (or the Parcan!)

 

I would like some sort of effect - I will have to ask nicely on the fire alarm front. I expect that can be sorted.

 

We have one UV tube (other broke recently). I just have to find a flourescent fitting for it, and wire it up - but I cant put that through a dimmer can I????? So I have to run it to mains socket, and 'on/off' it.

 

A strobe could be effective. Would 500W floods work OK as blinders?

 

I'm hoping that wherever we get the PA from, they can bundle in something or other!

 

Alternatively we could do the PA ourselves and save money that way - is that a good idea?? - or would it work out just as expesive, hiring all the kit and that???

 

Sorry about the many complications,

David

[Stu]

Well a fog machine will never do a good as a job as a Hazer, but if you put a massive desktop fan behind it, you might be able thin out the smoke enough for it too work...

 

As for face light, you could focus a couple of profiles onto the stage, just to give a bit of basic face light if needed - however most gigs I've been too I've never been able to see their faces, but doesn't stop you having a good time!

 

500w floods can work as blinders, I did this on a show recently and looked good to me :)

 

I think perhaps you need to ask whoever is in charge of this to let you have a little extra cash for the lighting (say £100 even) as a PA rig doesn't make a show on it's own, you need a bit of everything! £100 would get you say 12-18 Par 64s, which, combined with your in-house rig would probably do a grand job.

 

How many lanterns do you have in total in your stock?

 

And do you (or your teachers) know anyone at a local school who could help?

 

Stu

PS. It's a shame I've not got round to buying myself some Parcans yet, otherwise I'd lend you 12 to help you out!

[peter]

Fog Machine - will look more like clouds of smoke than a Hazer. Depends on the effect you want.

 

F/S - You probably don't need a followspot if you set up a decent general wash and leave it on at 70% or so. If you do go for a followspot, DONT use the Parcan - they get very hot.

 

UV - Will need non dimmed power. You could probably get away with leaving it on all the time. Remember to place it so the audience can't look at the source - can't remember the exact rules on this tho.

 

500W floods work fine as blinders - don't overuse them tho - the lamps arent designed to be flashed as much as a Par lamp is.

[DSA]

I will effectively be in charge, along with supervision from the teachers and help from a couple of people in my year from the bands.

 

Dont get me wrong, we all want a great show, but we have to make money for charity at the same time!!!!

 

David

 

P.S. If I get round to it ill do a calculation later!

[peter]

Another consideration is how many dimmers you have - obviously you can only use what you've got, power wise.

[James]

Front lighting for bands?

 

What's that :)

 

Anyway,,,

 

Point your smokie at the back wall of the stage or stick it under the stage or under the drum riser or stick a baffle in front of it and fans...

 

If you have only £100 and this is a regular occurance then buy some (~4) P56s' from somewhere like CPC.

 

If you have 4 this time (Put them on the back bar fanned out, put your profiles on band members (low level) and use the rest of your profiles + fresnels gelled up from the back/sides. Then next time you do this you can have 8, then 12, then 16....

 

 

Just a thought.

 

Out of interest, what's your stage size, where are your bars and how many lights have you got to play with.....

 

 

James

[Ike]

A strobe could be effective. Would 500W floods work OK as blinders?

Yup, remember with strobes you should post warnings and give one verbally before the performance- it may be best to do this anyway if you are flashing blinders etc. 500W floods are fine as blinders and if you havenít got any somebody may lend you a work light or two (just donít tell them you intend using them as blinders). :)