Tallescopes

[jot100]

I did wonder how the college allows this working practice considering the large lawsuit they incurred from a previous accident! I will wait for the training to bring up the rest of my questions, I have a feeling the college will be in for a shock when it is completed.

[iZian]

I did wonder how the college allows this working practice considering the large lawsuit they incurred from a previous accident! I will wait for the training to bring up the rest of my questions, I have a feeling the college will be in for a shock when it is completed.

Does the college know?

I thought it would be common sense not to do work like that by yourself, thats asking for trouble.

[jot100]

Yes the college know as Im the only technician for the theatre and to be honest given the time scale to do things here I have to get up the tallescope to refocuss lights etc on my own otherwise we wouldnt have any shows. However the planning for next year looks to incorporate proper "production" time where the theatre is shut for rigging etc and hopefully I will be able to have extra staff.

[Guest lightnix]

I'd just like to echo that you should never, ever work at height alone and that there should always be someone else present in the room, preferably a member of your team. Also, that harnessing yourself / hanging on half way up the scope is a definite no-no.

 

I'd like to add that the Tallescope manufacturer's instuctions clearly state that a 'Scope should never be moved with somebody in the basket - that is not the way it was designed or intended to be used. The ABTT may well have produced a set of guidelines contradicting this, but from what I recall they say that there should be four people at the bottom of the 'Scope when moving somebody in the basket - something that effectively makes this practice impractical. The PSA have been in close contact with the manufacturers, who are horrified that anybody should try to find a "legitimate" way of getting around their instructions. It doesn't matter what your RAs say, or however else you've otherwise tried to legitimise a fundamentally dangerous practice; if the 'Scope comes down with somebody in the basket, you will all be in deep sh :D t, including the person in the basket, regardless of their injuries. Just because you were the one that got hurt, doesn't mean you will be immune to prosecution.

 

As for the idiot who broke his arms because he pulled himself along, it will be interesting to see how the lawsuit will turn out. I have a feeling he may be on shaky ground (no pun intended).

 

Drifting slightly OT for a second, the question of focussing from ladders has also been raised in this thread. As the new WAHRs cut in, surely this is another practice that will soon be confined to history. AFAIK, you must have three points of contact with a ladder when working up one: two feet and one hand.

 

Sorry chaps, but it looks like it's scaff towers, Genie lifts and cherry pickers from now on (with properly trained staff and RAs, of course). If you are asked / told to do something that you consider to be unsafe, then refuse to do it. If you feel that you are being pressurised / threatened / bullied, then report the person responsible. AFAIK, there doesn't actually have to be an accident for you to file a RIDDOR report.

[ant]

correction, make sure someone with half a brain cell is standing at the bottom. earlier today, I saw a guy with his safety helmet on backwards, leaning on a ladder, with a guy stood on the top of it, blissfully unaware of the half wit "safely" helping him at the bottom! :D

[DSA]

This isnt chit chat honest...

 

Yes I was at the top just repointing a dark spot, and when I saw I had a good old shout at him - letting him know that I was in charge! He soon sparked up, and the director took note....

 

He was slightly more helpful after that!

 

David

[Tomo]

I'd just like to echo that you should never, ever work at height alone and that there should always be someone else present in the room, preferably a member of your team.

Hear hear!! *applauds*

 

I've usually considered this to be something that goes without saying, but quite clearly it isn't if jot's college is expecting her to do so.

 

And let me just expand that to include:

 

Never, ever do the following alone:

• Work at a height (as already stated).
  
• Work with electricity.
  
• Use powertools.
  
• Move heavy objects.
  
• Etc...
  

If you have an accident and there is no-one about, that means there is nobody to administer first aid, or even to call the emergency services.

So unless you can crawl to your mobile phone, you're done for until someone comes in.

 

[edit]

Actually, to be honest I'd seriously wonder about being alone in the building.

[Stu]

Sorry chaps, but it looks like it's scaff towers, Genie lifts and cherry pickers from now on (with properly trained staff and RAs, of course).

 

As normal a top post from 'nix.

 

I personally agree with him, I would be quite happy to take a grinder to our 'scope tomorrow and take it down the knackers yard. I hate the things and the sooner they are gone the better.

 

Problem is changing the views and opinions of technicians around the country. Various discussions with fellow crew at my venue, and the occassional visiting technician has revealed alot of people think they are fine and it's all how you move them / operate them etc. Which is a load of old toss I think. Same goes for the management, if they won't spend a few quid on something simple then they aren't going to be happy about spending out some obsense amount on a new access tower etc. Not that there should be a price on peoples safety, but it seems there is these days.

 

I'd love to ban 'scopes for ever and anon, but I seriously can't see how you could change the attitudes of the majoritiy.

 

Any comments?

Stu

[DSA]

As the new WAHRs cut in, surely this is another practice that will soon be confined to history. AFAIK, you must have three points of contact with a ladder when working up one: two feet and one hand.

I don't doubt for a minute this statement, however where does this leave us. We have three forms of access equipment (extension ladder, scaff tower, tallescope). Now this is fine for getting to the lx bars attached to the ceiling, but for the perches which are attached vertically to the wall we will have a problem.

 

We clearly cant use an extension ladder now as you need both hands to rig a light/focus, and a tallescope is out of the question as the basket will not go low enough....

 

so that leaves the scaff tower - do people consider that it would be safe to rig a light/focus off the tower with this sort of setup? Because if not, we are going to have to pay for a genie to come in, and I dont know how much that would cost....

 

As I said, I dont doubt the fact that it would only be 'completely' safe off a genie etc., but the school are unlikely to see it that way - they think, its always been done off a ladder quite satisfactorily, why cant it be done like that now.... Whether you think that is right or wrong, I can assure you that that is the side they will take.

 

Also I cant help but think that as regulations like this come in, the cost of productions is going up and up, to the point where at sometime the director will have to call it off because it is too expensive. And that would be a real shame. I agree that you cant put a price on someones life, but you have to draw a line somewhere.

[iZian]

Just to re-ask Daves question about what we can use to focus a lamp on a side perch where you need 2 hands to point and focus, yet you must have 3 points in contact with a ladder, and a tower seems a bit extreme if its just 2 lamps.

[Stu]

Do you have a FOH bar or is the slip position the only 'FOH' lighting position you have?

 

If you do have a FOH bar why not consider keeping a permanent rig on the slips, which are permantely locked off - say in a general stage wash. Then the only changes you can make are to the colour (easy to do with one hand) and simple shutter cuts to set.

 

If it is so difficult to access this position every time you have a show it might be wise to think about making life easier for yourselves when in this situation.

 

Stu

PS. Remember, if this isn't your only FOH position, you don't have to plug a light into every consievable position when you do a show. We have literally hundreds of different places we could rig a light and plug it up but some never get used for weeks or even months!

[Dave]

Nick,

 

I wasn't aware that WAHR required three points of contact, although I do know that it discourages the use of ladders. Are you sure that this is the case?

 

If so, it would mean that you couldn't do do a huge number of common tasks with a ladder, including changing a light bulb when you need one hand for the holder and another for the bulb.

 

Dave (not the one mentioned above - he's 18 years younger than me!)

[iZian]

Stu,

 

There is a small problem that when there is a music concert in the main hall it isn't on the stage, so if you can imagine 3 vertical bars with lights on the sides of the hall, one front one middle and one near the rear, these are the optimum lights to use and they have to be re-pointed to point to the centre of the hall. For this reason the bars cannot be permanently rigged.

The lights ont the ceiling just give too much top light from a steep angle.

The problem we have is that it is a school hall used for a wide variety of events.

[gareth]

Moderation : posts from this topic dealing with the question of what constitutes 'high' voltage have been split off to their own thread in General Tech Chat. This thread is about Tallescopes - please keep it on-topic.

[Stu]

The problem we have is that it is a school hall used for a wide variety of events.

 

Hmmm fair enough. Was just trying to think of a way to improve the safety of the focussing etc...

 

Stu