Ben Posted August 20, 2003 Share Posted August 20, 2003 This is to make sure that all who are joining us at Central in October know that the equipment lists are not completely correct. the main thing that comes to mind is that it only says working shoes are needed, there MUST be steel toe capped asd you are not able to work in any of the spaces during production time or in any of the workshops without them.also the hard hat that you have been asked to get is not needed on site as you are only meant to use the site helmets provided. any questions about the equipment needed or about the place in general please feel free to ask Ben Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Robertson Posted August 20, 2003 Share Posted August 20, 2003 Hi Ben, Don't want to start an argument here, but... Are steel toe capped boots not supplied by CSSD? I too work in education and as an employer (a student is an employee) it is up to the employer to provide safety equipment that is required. I am sure this is not your call, but maybe you could mention it to your course leader. Unless the students are being given money through there grant or loan for this, I don't see how you can insist on them providing their own. A freelancer has to provide their own safety equipment but employees have theirs provided.I hope this can help some of the poor students. Kevin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Posted August 20, 2003 Share Posted August 20, 2003 Moderation: Topic moved to Training Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rachel Posted August 20, 2003 Share Posted August 20, 2003 Hi Kevin, I'm also studying at Central, so I thought I'd reply. No, steel toe caps aren't provided by the college. I'm not sure what I think of the situation really. They insist that anyone working in the spaces during fit-ups, or in the workshop etc. much wear a pair, including designers. I don't think the college can be expected to pay for 70 pairs of steel toe caps for each year group (or maybe they can?), so maybe it's a case of where do they draw the line? I know that not everyone in my year owns a pair - many did a cost/benefit analysis and decided that it would be easier to just borrow other people's if the need arises. I'm studying Technical Management, so for me they're fairly essential, as, I would argue, they are for Production LX, and probably Production Sound and Stage Management. To be honest, the concept of the college paying had never crossed my mind. Maybe it's because, as students, we're expected to pay for everything else (tools etc.), and so I considered steel toe caps part of the 'equipment' I would need for the rest of my career. I don't know if I've contributed anything useful to this conversation, but let me know what you think! Oh, and while I think of it Ben, I think they're changing the equipment list for this year to specify steel toe caps. Rachel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peter Posted August 20, 2003 Share Posted August 20, 2003 Just wondering... whats the situation at other drama schools? RSAMD: YesCSSD: No next? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Robertson Posted August 20, 2003 Share Posted August 20, 2003 I'm also studying at Central, so I thought I'd reply. No, steel toe caps aren't provided by the college. I'm not sure what I think of the situation really. They insist that anyone working in the spaces during fit-ups, or in the workshop etc. much wear a pair, including designers. I don't think the college can be expected to pay for 70 pairs of steel toe caps for each year group (or maybe they can?), so maybe it's a case of where do they draw the line? I know that not everyone in my year owns a pair - many did a cost/benefit analysis and decided that it would be easier to just borrow other people's if the need arises. I'm studying Technical Management, so for me they're fairly essential, as, I would argue, they are for Production LX, and probably Production Sound and Stage Management. To be honest, the concept of the college paying had never crossed my mind. Maybe it's because, as students, we're expected to pay for everything else (tools etc.), and so I considered steel toe caps part of the 'equipment' I would need for the rest of my career. I don't know if I've contributed anything useful to this conversation, but let me know what you think! Oh, and while I think of it Ben, I think they're changing the equipment list for this year to specify steel toe caps. All our venues and workshops are steel toecap areas. We supply all new students and members of staff with these boots. (the students get cheap ARKO ones, the staff get a choice...) We also supply masks to all students as well (For use in the workshop, paintframe and props making rooms). This is because students are considered to be employees and as such should not be expected to pay for safety equipment. Any freelancer that comes into the academy is expected to supply their own safety equipment. This may be a Scottish thing and not UK wide, I'm trying to find out. I should know more tomorrow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben Posted August 20, 2003 Author Share Posted August 20, 2003 to back up rachel I know alot of people who dont have them and yes, maybe not everyone one should need them, however they are not provided as we are not employees and are students. simple as that, I wish what I paid for was my choice,.. unfortunatly the admin seem to think its not :unsure: to be honest we all need them for any external work we do so having a pair is really a good idea anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peter Posted August 20, 2003 Share Posted August 20, 2003 to be honest we all need them for any external work we do so having a pair is really a good idea anyway.Unless you're being taxed under PAYE and thus are an employee of the company... To be honest, as drama schools are about teaching you the ways of the industry, I think it is inadvisable for them to not provide you with steelies. As much as anything, they take a little getting used to - if you don't wear them at college, you'll be uncomfortable for the first few weeks when you leave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob Posted August 20, 2003 Share Posted August 20, 2003 All our venues and workshops are steel toecap areas. We supply all new students and members of staff with these boots. (the students get cheap ARKO ones, the staff get a choice...) We also supply masks to all students as well (For use in the workshop, paintframe and props making rooms). Do you have to give the Steelies back after you finish? If not, great. Otherwise, it's an essential item for most production students, and almost certainly worth shelling out for as a part of your toolkit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Dave Posted August 20, 2003 Share Posted August 20, 2003 IMHO surely ALL educational establishments are responsible for the H+S of their students and so if they inorce these rules (as they should), its their responsibilty! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben Posted August 20, 2003 Author Share Posted August 20, 2003 no its not, they can enforce in the same way they can say you have to be there they dont have to pay travel. I agree with rob, its a part of the tool kit, you are in a situation where to get the full benifit out of the course you need thenm so you get them. its not the same as a lplace of employment if it was then the degree would not count as you cannot be employed as part of the degree, if we do work in a placelment arnd are paid for it the placement ois void as it cannot be employment and has to remain education, thats why they dont have to provide them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul J Need Posted August 20, 2003 Share Posted August 20, 2003 Hint of nanny state seems to spring to mind again. When I went to college in 1983 - we were informed that we have to supply: 1- Tape Measure1- Hammer1- Work clothes1- Stanley knife1- Decent pair of working shoesetc. Tools of the trade indeed - and if you have to buy your own tools (or steel toe boots) you will look after them better than if you were handed them when you walk through the door on your first day - You lose you hammer - you go buy a new one! University students have to pay a fortune on books, stationary, a computer (if not already own one) - so a pair of boots hardly seems unreasonable! I know, I know........ I am turning in to a Victor Meldrew!!!! :** laughs out loud **: :unsure: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest lightnix Posted August 21, 2003 Share Posted August 21, 2003 Out in the "real" world an employee can be expected to provide their own safety equipment as a part of their (written) contract. The payback is that they can then claim the cost as a business expense against tax, just like self-employed freelancers do. I'm not sure of what benefit this is to students, I just thought I'd mention it. If the college has to pay for it, then surely it will be reflected in the fees, so it won't actually be the college who pays for it in the end. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Posted August 21, 2003 Share Posted August 21, 2003 Sorry to go slightly off topic but out of interest (Ben, Rachel, anybody) when does the new term start at CSSD? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rachel Posted August 21, 2003 Share Posted August 21, 2003 1st year enrolement is Thursday 2nd October, term officially begins on Monday 6th October. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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