Which Lighting Desk?

[Suzette]

I have 3 grand to spend what shall I buy??

 

How about lots of beer and have a party!!

[timmath]

There is no desk that allows optimum use in both rehearsed theatre and on the fly corporate/rock n roll gigs.

 

Anything you get of of the desk is down to what the programmer puts in, and how quickly the programmer can get to what they have put in. If you know your desk well enough then you will find a solution to every challenge thrown at you.

 

All desks work differently, some are better at some things then others but at the end of the day the all do the same job (human to DMX interface)

 

There are lots of desks that will happily do a pre-programmed theatre show, and still be buskable enough for rock and roll. It's all about knowing the best way to achieve the effects you are after.,

 

Regards

 

Tim

[Benj]

I am now waiting on a number of quotes for a Strand 300 24/48!!.

 

Although I was very tempted with Suzette's Idea :(

 

Your comments have helped me get my boss round to thinking it is worth in the long run going with Strand :D :) :D (Nows its just down to the powers that pay)

 

Thank you all for your very very helpful comments. I will keep you all posted.

 

Cheers

 

A very happy chappie!

[Jimbo The Wiz]

I have to admit I have recently used the strand 300. I agree that it is very easy to turn lights on. Record subs and make a cue list. Where I found it fails to delivery is when you come to edit things. I did not like editing cues on it and effects are a nightmare to program on it compared to other desks. I admit it is easy to use for theatre stuff but if it was for a theatre application with even 2 intelligent fixtures I would much prefer to use something that was designed for use with moving lights rather that something that was made for theatre but had the ability to handle intelligent lighting. As with anything relating to lighting it is really up to what the lighting designer prefers and I would advise getting the different desks you are thinking of in for a demo so you can try them and see which you like the most.

 

As for as what desk you should get I would go for a hog Pc with wings if you can afford it but I’m not 100% sure how much it is. This is simply for its versatility for use with generic and intelligent fixtures and how easy it is to create both effects and cue lists. If not this I would go for the fat frog, an easy but good desk to use.

Hope that helps. :(

[Stu]

and effects are a nightmare to program on it compared to other desks.

Far easier on a Strand running Genius Pro than on an ETC desk, trust me!

 

but if it was for a theatre application with even 2 intelligent fixtures I would much prefer to use something that was designed for use with moving lights rather that something that was made for theatre but had the ability to handle intelligent lighting.

Actually I think the ML software on the Genius Pro desks is very good, and alot better than people give it credit. Again beats an ETC desk hands down.

 

As with anything relating to lighting it is really up to what the lighting designer prefers

IMHO, for most venues it's should be up to what suits the venue better, and in some cases what the operator/programmer thinks the best choice is. At the end of the day, for alot of shows the LD just reels off large amounts of numbers while the programmer 'translates' it into the correct info needed for the particular desk. Mind you it's probably different in something like Rock where the LD also programmes and runs the show. But this is a Theatre application we're talking about :(

 

As for as what desk you should get I would go for a hog Pc with wings... If not this I would go for the fat frog, an easy but good desk to use.

Talk about desks that are worlds apart!

 

Stu

[GridGirl]

It's a lot easier to program effects on a Strand than it is on a Compulite....I've spent quite some time over the last week trying to get my head round the Compulite Micron and I've found out quite a few things about it that I don't like. A Strand 300 24/48, in my opinion, is an ideal desk for a school or college because you get the manual and "go button" options. It's always seemed to me that Strand desks are very logical and easy to learn.

[propmonkey]

we just started programming last year. before the old light op just ran everything off subs, all that he knew how to do. im not sure what model of the 300 we have I knwo we have a 24/48 in out little theatre. I think its a 96 in the main.

[colinmonk]

The Compulite Effects Engine is quite advanced, and does take a bit of getting used to but is generally quite easy to use. Compulite desks follow a very simple syntax, but if your already used to the strand way of thinking you will find it hard at first to use them, as with many other desks...

If you want to learn more about the Micron then get in touch with Andy Stone ( a member of this board ) and im sure he will give you details of the next training day...

[vinny baby]

try and have a play with all the colsoles that have been mentioned, and then choose whatever feels right.

 

we can tell you what to buy, but at the end of the day a lighting console is very personal, and what is one technicians dream, its anothers nightmare.

 

im on a AVO shaddow at the mo, and its a fine bit of kit. its also good in the sense that I can program pallets, and other LDs or a technician can just jump on and busk it.

 

I use it as a moving light board at the mo, because my rig is fully intelligent with the exspetion of a couple of batterns and some blinders.

 

vince

[T.D.]

I use Hog II and Hog PC all the time, but I'd advise against Hog PC (although it hurts me to do so) as it is really a moving light desk with generic capability. Fantastic as it really is exactly a HogII and you can even buy 'wings' and touchscreens to give you the hardware. It will do great theatre shows but the complexity of it can make a simple show a bit scarey unless you know what you're doing. (oops am I running a macro?).

 

I use the Jands desk when freelanceing and they are great for corperate stuff but limited when you get to large numbers of generics (100+) and a bit fiddly for movers. A great compromise desk

 

For theatre I really would recomend Strand, especially for training. I don't use them much myself (although I learnt on a strand MX) but they really are the industry standard. I don't know how much the 520 is but look at them and considder spending a bit extra as the desk is one thing you cant add to (you can always buy more lanterns later).

 

Frogs - make me jump. Lots of the guys I work with loath them. They're fine for amateur stuff, but programming moving lights properly is a sod, and the dual preset concept whilst great for begginers is not really the way you work in pro theatre. Try to head down the command line approach if you are going to train people to go into the profession.

 

Mind you, don't be afraid working on a tight budget. It's not going to be any help student knowing how to program the best desks in the world and then leave school not knowing the basic principles and hence not being able to work simpler desk where you have to do a bit more of the work the hard way.

 

Enjoy

 

T.D.

[lightbulb789]

You could spend £1500 on a desk and give the rest of the money to us smaller theatres who have trouble finding money. I have a small idea who they could be... ME :** laughs out loud **:

 

Just an idea.

[gareth]

I use Hog II and Hog PC all the time, but I'd advise against Hog PC (although it hurts me to do so) as it is really a moving light desk with generic capability. {snip} It will do great theatre shows but the complexity of it can make a simple show a bit scarey unless you know what you're doing.

I'm afraid I beg to differ. Anyone who's used to programming a 'traditional' theatre-style desk (e.g. Strand, ETC) will feel at home fairly quickly programming generics on a Hog2. As long as said person is able to get their head around the concept of tracking (which isn't really that difficult) it's a great desk for programming dimmers in a theatrical 'stylee'.

 

For theatre I really would recomend Strand, especially for training. I don't use them much myself (although I learnt on a strand MX) but they really are the industry standard.

Yes and yes.

 

I don't know how much the 520 is but look at them and considder spending a bit extra

Unfortunately, for a budget of £3k a 520i is a complete non-starter. A basic 300-series, perhaps .....

 

Frogs {snip} They're fine for amateur stuff, but programming moving lights properly is a sod

Absoultely. Fine for very small rigs in a situation where the demands on the programmer are low. But you get what you pay for. And the inability to program palettes on a parameter level sucks.

 

Mind you, don't be afraid working on a tight budget. It's not going to be any help student knowing how to program the best desks in the world and then leave school not knowing the basic principles and hence not being able to work simpler desk where you have to do a bit more of the work the hard way.

Yes!! Absolutely! You've got to learn to walk before you can run. It's all very well students at LIPA (just picking this as a fairly random example - flames from LIPA students are not necessary) coming out of there after 3 years knowing how to program the Hog3 that they have there because High End are trying to win over the equipment purchasers of the future - but they're going to fall on their arses big-time when they suddenly find themselves taking a show into a venue which has some sad, tired 15-year-old console that they've never come across and which requires a bit of back-to-basics programming. You might be able to make a Hog3 sing and dance, boys and girls, but can you make an Arri Imagine do multi-part crossfades when the focus has taken an hour longer than it should have done because the local crew are numpties, you've still got half a show to re-light, you can't turn the workers off for plotting because the chippies are still finishing putting the set together, and it's doors in 30 minutes? Where's your Hog3 training going to get you then?

 

Don't get me wrong, it's great that colleges these days have access to the latest and greatest kit - but there's a lot to be said for locking it away in a cupboard from time to time, and making students light shows with T-Spots and a Gemini 2.

[paulears]

Gareth is making MAJOR sense here.. Look at this picture - what's lurking in the background? So there isn't really an excuse for anyone at this uni not knowing how to work a 'industry standard' desk

http://www.eastanglianradio.com/LIPA.jpg

[Light Console]

This is not a Flame!

As a graduate of RBC, I have to say that we learnt on a lot of desks. From 60 year old Light Console, Arri, Zero88, Compulite, Avolites, to a preview of Hog 3 when our tutor wrote the manual! However, Strand slipped the net for me. I have only recently understood what the popular 200/300 posts refered to.

I think I would be able to get something out of any desk I was plonked in front of, what I hate is the different standards for naming things, and their starting points!

[T.D.]

<T.D. adds the word "Numpties" to his favourite words collection>