Hamilton without the rights...?

[Ynot]

I'm sure many of you will have seen the news clips or even FB posts about a performing arts school in Toronto who are SO taken by this phenomenon that is 'Hamilton' (and my mind is yet to be made up about the clash of styles there, but that's another story...) that they've produced a couple of scenes from the show at their school complete with a full lighting and set design which some have said bear a strong resemblance to the pro Broadway show...

Story

 

https://www.facebook.com/cbcnews/videos/10154351093029604/

 

Their hope, it seems, is that Lin-Manuel will see what a great job they've done (and yes, from the clip I saw, it does look slick and well prepared) and thus grant them the rights to produce the WHOLE show .

 

The problem with this of course is that this flies in the face of the standard copyrighting laws governing such things as it's not even finished on Broadway, let alone been allowed out into the wilds of pro tours or such.

 

I just worry that in the fit of stiff publicity this school hopes that the company will waive those restrictions - but what happens if ANOTHER quality school (or otherwise) says"hey - hang on - WE want to do this, too..." - where could it stop...?

 

Discuss. :)

[paulears]

I'd expect a cease and desist notice will follow quickly. So it's OK for schools and colleges to break the very laws that protect the kinds of products their students generate? Sounds damn risky practice.

[Junior8]

It is a damn risky practice and very stupid.

[alistermorton]

<devilsAdvocate>

 

Although it is perhaps ironic that in a recent case I saw reported it was claimed that without the ability to sample and borrow hip hop would cease to exist and so it should be allowed. Given this show's hop hop content, perhaps it should be expected that copyright would be ignored.

 

</devilsAdvocate>

[Ynot]

<devilsAdvocate>

 

Although it is perhaps ironic that in a recent case I saw reported it was claimed that without the ability to sample and borrow hip hop would cease to exist and so it should be allowed. Given this show's hop hop content, perhaps it should be expected that copyright would be ignored.

 

</devilsAdvocate>

Considering the speed that the Youtube clips of the school performance were taken down, I'd have to say that would NOT be the case. http://www.blue-room.org.uk/public/style_emoticons/default/wink.gif

(The clip I linked to is in a news report, and as such in and of itself it's possibly going to be judged to be in violation at any time).

 

Interestingly, the video was posted on the timeline of a US based FB LD friend of mine, with comments saying 'Wow! The power of Arts!' - Now whilst the sentiment is understandable - that these students got so invested in this allegedly one-off scene from the show that they just HAD to record their version and try and get Lin-Manuel to give them his blessing based on the obvious enthusiasm - it really doesn't cut it for me. I'm sure countless other students at other arts based schools & colleges have felt likewise enthralled at the likes of Wicked, or Rent, or Mormon, or any of the other big name shows but have had to be content to wait until rights are properly available.

 

It did give me a chuckle that one of the respondents to that thread on FB posted "Lin-Manuel, have you seen this?" with a link to 'his profile name' (He has yet to respond :) )

 

Another article on this one is here, which seems to ask the very same questions, and further suggests that doing this does not set a very good example at all to those students involved with regard to artistic integrity.

That article also supports the idea that rather than just the one number seen on the news article, the school actually recorded several more scenes from the full show, which would bring them much closer to being in full breach.

And it is hard not to believe this would be the case, considering the obvious time, effort and expense on lighting and costume...

[Jivemaster]

I had thought that this was a court case for publicity, but now I think that this is just some college (kids) demonstrating that they don't understand the issue of rights. Today's youth has grown up in a web enabled world and assumes that all web content is accurate and all web content is free to copy.

[alistermorton]

Considering the speed that the Youtube clips of the school performance were taken down, I'd have to say that would NOT be the case. http://www.blue-room.org.uk/public/style_emoticons/default/wink.gif

 

Quite, and I was being somewhat tongue-in-cheek playing devil's advocate. As Jive points out, there are many who think everything is (or should be) free for whoever wants it, because, well, internet, innit. I have a lot of sympathy with the problems around protecting copyright in artistic works, I wasn't condoning ignoring rights.

 

 

Edit: typo

[stagemanagement]

I wouldn't have thought it mattered what Lin-Manuel Miranda thought about their production; there will fat men in expensive suits sat in smoky, dark offices that decide on the issuing of rights and whether to pursue this school for breach - after all, they paid for everything!!

 

This may well be a good experience for their future module on copyright that will be added to their performing arts course.....

[Stuart91]

There's been a bit of a trend for these kinds of stunts. I remember reading about a town who got a huge number of musicians together to perform a cover of a Foo Fighters song in order to persuade them to play a gig in the town. That worked, but there's a big difference between playing a cover version and replicating a current broadway show.

[Jivemaster]

IMO this will be beneficial for schools and academies to follow this case (or not case). Realistically few schools and no academies get their rights issues correct. State schools get some exemptions but academies simply don't.

[paulears]

A long time now - but I spent months negotiations with Disney to allow a college production of Aida - and eventually got it - BUT - a concert version. Absolutely no costumes, set or props - which didn't allow proper grades so we gave up. Much as it's nice to do - it's completely and utterly wrong.

[Ynot]

That sounds similar to a statement on the Really Useful Group's position on adult versions of Joseph.

We could have had a go-ahead for an adult cast but ONLY on condition that there was no movement, no costume and no scenery etc.

[kitlane]

There's been a bit of a trend for these kinds of stunts. I remember reading about a town who got a huge number of musicians together to perform a cover of a Foo Fighters song in order to persuade them to play a gig in the town. That worked, but there's a big difference between playing a cover version and replicating a current broadway show.

 

You mean Rockin1000.

 

Dave Grohl loved it

[Jivemaster]

While and established artiste may like amateur playalong especially if it promotes the original brand, the grey suits who have funded the show build and rehearsal period will take a very dim view of copy performances being made that may devalue the brand.

[MikeH]

I had thought that this was a court case for publicity, but now I think that this is just some college (kids) demonstrating that they don't understand the issue of rights. Today's youth has grown up in a web enabled world and assumes that all web content is accurate and all web content is free to copy.

 

Very much this - although in some cases I'd suggest don't understand could be replaced with don't give a hoot about...

 

Slightly easier to control copyright with live performance, but this is exactly the attitude that has killed the business side of the record industry (although many may think that isn't such a bad thing, buut that's another debate entirely).