ontoprigger Posted March 18, 2016 Share Posted March 18, 2016 Don't get me wrong mark I am all for reducing a genuine risk but when it gets to a point where things can no longer happen or something is so sterile because the artistic content has been removed, not for genuine health and safety but to reduce the insurers exposure to something that the underwriter feels could be a risk. often due to the increase of 'no win no fee lawyers' and many dubious claims that are often down to the claimants stupidity. Not all risk is bad if managed correctly and our industry is often not total understood by those that write the rules and set the terms of insurance, we are fortunate not to have the same level of negligence and naivety (or just plain laziness) that appears to be in some other industries that use the same or similar equipment but now days its all driven by ass covering. my comment was really referring to 20 years ago my experience would have been sufficient to install something suitable (there are still many things that I installed working fine and I am not aware of any of them falling down even when pushed beyond the designed capacity). But now I need a team of 'qualified' experts to tell me what to install, and often they will have to go over the top with the spec to protect themselves and their personal liability, as there is the possibility someone may claim for someone else's negligence in overloading a system. Anyway that's getting off the original topic, anyone installing a permanent suspension system for loads above people will need to seek advice from someone who has the relevant letters after their name to advise on what and how it should be installed, they will also need to put suitable signage of the systems capacity and schedule an inspection program once installed to ensure the ongoing suitability and integrity of the system. I would strongly recommend you don't just wack up a few bits of scaff as that's all the client wants, even if the construction of the walls is suitable to take the load you would also need to know if the beam supporting the pros arch can take the extra load imposed by the grid, another reason why you will need to ask somebody who understands these things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulears Posted March 19, 2016 Share Posted March 19, 2016 Last week I was in a drama space in a school. The room had a theatre quality tab track all the way around, and four drops of Bolton twill on the usual runners. One game the yobs students play is to gather the four drops, jump on them and the other kids then speed them around the room like a race track. Dynamic loads, vastly higher than the estimated load anybody sensible would have calculated. A new build, with stud drops from the steelwork, so strong, but already loose. Schools now spend lots of money hiring in clever equipment, and these people may have a very different view of what is strong, maybe assuming something that weighs a lot unloaded will of course have special chemical fixings or similar to keep it up. They won't know a few two inch screws in wall plugs were used because it will never be loaded. One engineer told me that long spans between end supports don't just need the vertical supports to take the weight, they are also used to stop the bar deforming and pulling the bar out of the end mounts, as the bend pulls the end in. I suspect the maths is far more complicated than it seems. If I was put in the position of having to do something like this, uncertain if I could guarantee the load rating, I'd use ground supported truss, and brace it against the walls with standoff, because then I would have a freestanding structure that the specs would make sense. Assuming of course, the ground was not a problem, but is that a different story? Sadly I think we have frightened him off with out tales of doom and gloom. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david.elsbury Posted March 19, 2016 Share Posted March 19, 2016 Point... Your story reminds me when I was (hired in) to do audio for a high school show and the student "head of lighting" had arranged lighting hire separately. On de-rig the students were swinging Tarzan style from cable looms that were going from dimmers up to the roof and lx grid... Just taped up there I think. Hmmmm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ontoprigger Posted March 19, 2016 Share Posted March 19, 2016 But isn't 10 raps of lampy PVC good for a tonne and 10 raps of Audio PVC good for at least 1 1/2-2 tonne...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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