Radio Mics for Schools

[will the mix]

Hello all,

 

I have a few queries regarding radio mics in schools.

 

 

If a school has 2.4gHz or Ch70 equipment, is it correct that they require no licences whatever to operate this?

 

Also if hire equipment on channel 38 is used in a school, is it the responsibility of the hire company to have the necessary licence?

 

Lastly, can anyone recommend a decent radio mic system for a school? The school in question has a good performing facility with a reasonably decent sound system - it needs to be fully rack-mountable and ideally have facility for remote aerials as would often go with the stage boxes in a room next to the stage so would need the aerials mounted in the stage area. Obviously being a school it needs to be fairly robustly built, and decent sound quality would be an advantage too! I had been looking at the Trantec S5.3 system but don't know if this is OTT for the application?

 

I really appreciate the help people are prepared to give on here, many thanks in advance.

 

Will

[paulears]

No, not over the top, but before dozens of people zoom in and tell you not to (as indeed a topic only recently had happen to it) the key thing here is that in a school, where wi-fi is everywhere, eating a big chunk of it with wireless audio won't make you friends with the computer people. Channel 70, again is busy - but depends where you are. You could find it totally unused, and therefore reliable enough - or you could have places around you where DJs, theatres and other organisations are already using it close enough to you to cause issues. Perhaps unlikely, but possible. Hire equipment will normally be licensed by the supplier - but a license is cheap and gives you more channels and flexibility. 2.4GHz and ch 70 are license free bands, but of course very busy ones.

 

My pet concern is simply staff. Radio systems are a pain for the staff to keep working, and manage when they're being used. They are not set and forget devices, and a sensible set of fingers is needed to avoid continual feedback, pops and bangs. So if the show is two hours long - that's a sensible person, working continually. Students are students - you hopefully know yours, but few I have found have the subtlety and experience to mix radio mics without messing it up.

 

A budget for replacements and batteries is also necessary - mics are disposable, and last a very short while - occasionally minutes! Schools often use budget mics sourced from people like CPC, who they often have accounts with.

 

It's very useful to have radio systems in schools, but many get consigned to the junk pile, others get worn out very quickly. Only you can tell. Trantecs have a good reputation. As do Sennheiser and Shure.

 

Aerial wise, paddles are popular, as are dipoles. Decent feeder lets all these work pretty well.

[sam.spoons]

TBF Paul, that other topic was with regard to the purchase of 4 x wireless mic systems for a budget of £200 http://www.blue-room.org.uk/public/style_emoticons/default/smile.gif

[sleah]

The slightly cheaper Trantec 4.16 system is great for schools too. They are pretty much plug & play especially if you purchase a 'Racked'n'ready' system. But as mentioned, if using headsets, get the cheap £40 ones from the likes of CPC. I've had some last a good 30 performances, so they are not garbage, although I've also had them fail by the interval from new at curtains up!

[chelgrian]

If a school has 2.4gHz or Ch70 equipment, is it correct that they require no licences whatever to operate this?

 

Correct both are license exempt. However while many people swear by it 2.4GHz equipment will either interfere with or be interfered with itself by WiFi. There are only 3 or sometimes 4 non overlapping WiFi channels available in the 2.4Ghz band and in a dense deployment you have to use them all for access points in adjacent rooms. If you have WiFi deployed across your school you are likely to have such a deployment.

 

Since being further deregulated channel 70 is busy and unless you have special circumstance, such as being located in the back end of nowhere, it's not a good idea to rely on it for theatrical use. Also without relatively expensive equipment you can only get 4 mics in it without intermodulation problems.

 

The channel 38 license is cheap and you can run up to 12 mics in it without intermodulation problems with the right equipment.

 

Also if hire equipment on channel 38 is used in a school, is it the responsibility of the hire company to have the necessary licence?

 

It's your responsibility to ensure you are are probably licensed. However this may be achieved by the hircos holding a channel 38 license and delegating it to you along with the hire. This depends on the hireco some do, some charge extra and some don't and expect you to have your own license.

 

Lastly, can anyone recommend a decent radio mic system for a school?

 

- How many channels

- How many extra might you want to hire in

- Beltpacks or handhelds or both?

- Do you have people who can look after the system and continue to look after it in to the future?

- Are the school willing to budget for running costs in terms of mic head replacement and the inevitable beltpack failures after being dropped or sweated out.

- What do local hire companies have in the quite likely event that you need to hire a way of radio temporarily when one of yours breaks and needs to be sent for repair at an inopportune moment.

 

On the subject of sweat I highly recommend a set of these

 

http://cpc.farnell.com/stageline/txs-10belt-sw/girdle-belt-radio-microphone-holder/dp/DP30836

 

to go with your beltpacks.

 

I had been looking at the Trantec S5.3 system but don't know if this is OTT for the application?

 

In terms of radio mics there is very little that is over the top until you get to systems which are many thousands of pounds a channel. The more relevant question is the kind of money the school are willing to put on their recurring capital expenditure budget. Depending on how much abuse they get the working life can be really rather short. I think ours are budgeted around every 8 years but obviously will get deferred if they are still in good repair.

[will the mix]

Thanks everyone for their replies. I should have said before, that the school actually don't do a great deal of drama, and at the moment only want 4 channels with handheld mics - the music department is much more dominant... So the option to use belt packs at a later date with the same receivers would be highly useful. Comments noted also regarding using cheap headsets, thank you.

The option to expand is a very valid point, so from that point of view maybe the ch38 option will be better - I will sound it out with the school. 2.4gHz is almost certainly out as the whole school is wifi covered.

On the control front, I don't expect too many issues as they will mostly be handhelds at the moment. But a number of students are pretty good sound operators, and I often go to the performances to lend a hand. (ex student who got far too involved in sound and lighting for his own good while at school, and then got roped into the committee for advising/planning the new build stage area.... ;-) But on the upside, at least we have resulted in a very good facility for the space available - sorry off thread..)

Once again thanks for your responses, it is much appreciated. Please keep the the helpful ideas coming!

Thanks, Will

[Jivemaster]

For many purposes you can't beat a SM58 for being OK sounding and rock n roll resistant! You can buy two SM58s with stands and mic clips and cables for the price of one half decent radio mic. Do first review whether you need wireless.

[cedd]

You mention a few different bands in your first message, but don't mention which one you want the new mics in. If channel 70 is ok then CPC have some of the condenser S5.3 systems for sale at a very cheap price (cheaper than the dynamic) at the minute. My only experience is with the dynamic ones (which I like) but the condenser is supposedly their higher level product, so one can imagine it'll sound even better.

I like Trantec's S5 range a lot, and have 16 channels of their belt packs and a couple of handhelds. One AA battery for 10 hours of operation is pretty incredible, and they do behave really nicely.

[TonyMitchell]

The Trantec S5 beltpacks are very rugged and one of the best features of the S5 series.

 

We had 24 channels of S5 (12 xS5.3 and 12 x S5.5) and never had any problems with the beltpack TX or the receivers.

 

IMO the handhelds are the only thing that lets the S5 system down, in particular the ultra-flimsy battery compartment and the unintuitive mute switch and power LED.

 

 

 

[graemeftv]

Pauls comments are so well written,

 

Its good that people are now looking at other options for headsets and mic capsules but its taken 15 + years for people to look!, but I hope sometime soon people look outside the box when it comes to ant cable, antenna, Antenna distribution. power supplies antenna splitters. All of which are cleverly priced by the manufacture! some of the items are not far short of daylight robbery. I cant help but think the us british people are so led by brands more so than other countries