fire place flame effect

[JTilling]

Hi all.

 

I am helping with the lighting on a small scale production. We have a fireplace as part of the set on stage which needs to have a fire effect. We are looking to step things up this year and use something other than just a painted on fire or silks stapled on etc.

So far I'm looking at hiring in a Martin DC2 Flame effect or

A cantata Profile with a flame animation with a motor for the animation disc along with a long control cable.

 

Neither of these are particularly expensive which is fine. I have a budget all be it a fairly small one. but what I'm asking is if anyone else has any ideas or opinions. The fire place will at some point need to be able to have a log thrown in to it to appear that someone is putting a log on to the fire etc.

So what else is out there?

Other thoughts I've had is a TV screen mounted to the back of the set with a perspex guard and a fire effect on the screen or similarly trying to get hold of a piece of projection material and projecting on to it a fire effect but I know that both of these can seem quite flat plus the obvious problems with anyone walking infront of the projection etc.

 

any help would be great.

Thanks

[Jivemaster]

ebay will likely supply you with a dvd of fire effect which may even auto loop.

 

I like the idea of lots of little fluttering silks. I've seen it done well before, LOTs of small ones looks better than a big one. Maybe you could add some progressively as the fire builds then change things when the log is put on. Will need lots of attention to light separation or the FOH will just white out the silks or the projection screen

[rob_cheese]

We have a fire effect made up from the "Glowing coals" bit canibalised from an old gas fire, plus some silks arranged over an array of PC cooling fans. It gives a good glow, with a hint of movement which works well as an effect, but probably wouldn't look effective for your log-on-the-fire moment. Maybe you could develop something along those lines? If you have a computerised desk, you can even program in a dithering effect with a red and orange lamp inside the box (Or, just sit there hitting the flash butons on a manual desk...)

 

The monitor showing video would be more effective, but getting the fire to flare up on demand (without seeing the join..) is likely to be tricky on a showstring budget - although video's not realy my thing so I may stand corrected!

[timsabre]

The most effective fireplace effect I've seen is just some red foil crumpled up under the logs. Looked very convincing from a distance and was not screaming out "Look! I'm a fire effect!"

Silk flames can look a bit cheesy and distracting. Never seen a video screen fire used on stage but I would think you would struggle to get enough brightness on the screen for it to be even visible, unless the set is very dark.

[mr_towers]

We've made a variety of fires before using a grate, bits of gel and architectural lamps. Gives a lovely glow. Add a wee smoke machine (something like a tiny c07) and it's probably the best you'll get without actually setting something on fire.

[Jivemaster]

The act of throwing on another log needs care. Usually there will be some sparks and then smoke going up the chimney before the new log starts to burn. MOST of this effect seems to rely on keeping the fireplace free of stage light so that flame colours can be added easily.

[Don Allen]

I saw The Mouse Trap when it toured in Australia and they had an lcd monitor for their flames, had to look very hard to see it was not a fire.

 

I use a strip of 40W lamps, four have flouro starters wired in series so the orange and yellow lamps flicker, the centre one is an always on red for the coal glow. Leave a gap behind the fire grill so the log can be thrown to the back of the fire. You may need to put a guard on top of the lamps. Use a chase with overlapping fades to project the flame effect onto the set or actors using small fresnels.

 

For a late night fire effect I have used a Patt60 500W flood in the fireplace as the sole light source on the front of the actors. You need to analyse the effect a fire has and what atmosphere you want to achieve as each fire place will be different.

[Marineboy63]

I had success with the following:

 

8 domestic light bulbs, different shades of red/orange, different wattages on four circuits ( four pairs).

 

Make up three or four random flicker/fade/snap chases of at least eight steps. Run all the chases simultaniously on random.

With a bit of fiddling with base levels and top levels this was very convincing.

[kitlane]

The monitor showing video would be more effective, but getting the fire to flare up on demand (without seeing the join..) is likely to be tricky on a showstring budget - although video's not realy my thing so I may stand corrected!

 

Actually, this would be one of easier video transitions. If the effect of adding the log is an instantaneous flare of flames, smoke and sparks then a straight cut will do. Screenmonkey and all the other usual suspects would manage it. Probably even Powerpoint, these days.

[vinntec]

The monitor showing video would be more effective, but getting the fire to flare up on demand (without seeing the join..) is likely to be tricky on a showstring budget - although video's not realy my thing so I may stand corrected!

 

Actually, this would be one of easier video transitions. If the effect of adding the log is an instantaneous flare of flames, smoke and sparks then a straight cut will do. Screenmonkey and all the other usual suspects would manage it. Probably even Powerpoint, these days.

Except speaking as an LD how can I light someone standing in front of it without swamping the effect or putting a shadow on it? Shadows on a "real" fire are fine of course but won't look the same on a flat vertical screen (stands back to be flamed - get it?)

[alistermorton]

In Deathtrap last season we used a cluster of birdies with various ambers, oranges, reds etc on a random multi-step chase to light the painted wood embers in the grate, and for when the script was thrown on the fire there was a minim hidden behind the coals with a yellow colour which briefly lit quickly then faded to give the impression of the sheets of paper flaring up.

 

However I appreciate that, given that this was all concealed in a wood burner, and we were simulating the paper script flaring rather than a log catching and burning this might not be exactly what's needed, but it could be a starting point for ideas.

 

We also had a flame effect disk on a patt123 which was projecting the flickering effect on to the wall opposite to given the impression of the flames illuminating the room. Mixed with the overall lighting this was quite subtle.

[afrobob]

Ive found that putting a flurescent strip light starter accross a red, yellow and orange 40w bulb (one per bulb) gives a random flickering effect and gives off the realistic look of a fire. Add a log fire crackling audio track over it, then your sorted!

[alistermorton]

Ive found that putting a flurescent strip light starter accross a red, yellow and orange 40w bulb (one per bulb) gives a random flickering effect and gives off the realistic look of a fire. Add a log fire crackling audio track over it, then your sorted!

 

Across, or in series with?

[delicolor]

Strand Electric used to make a flame flicker assembly for the Patt. 123 which was quite effective if used carefully.

 

Ive found that putting a flurescent strip light starter accross a red, yellow and orange 40w bulb (one per bulb) gives a random flickering effect and gives off the realistic look of a fire. Add a log fire crackling audio track over it, then your sorted!

 

Across, or in series with?

In series with. Across will blow fuses or trip breakers!

[alistermorton]

Strand Electric used to make a flame flicker assembly for the Patt. 123 which was quite effective if used carefully.

 

Indeed - you have to be careful with the levels (too much and it really looks false), and we have a gel with multiple strips of reds and yellows for the colour effect.