Millennium Stage Platforms

[paulears]

I don't quite get the problem with bolt-on parts. Sure - something like a bit of Steeldeck can't really be much simpler in terms of design. If there was a version of Steeldeck with variable height, then the only real options are telescopic legs or some kind of scissor joint, and have their own engineering problems. The bolt-on leg pockets are aluminium, the same as the deck frame. The plastic parts are simply filling in the extrusion voids.

 

I'm not quite sure why spares would be an issue. Certainly the need to replace the leg pocket is just as unlikely as on a piece of HD deck - unless you unbolt it, why would it need replacing. If the deck has been damaged, then risk assessment would probably suggest replacement rather than repair, starting again with a 3 year guarantee.

 

Litedeck is around double the cost of the Stairville/Millenium product - so that's a hefty price hike for the advantages mentioned. I just think it unfair to criticise a product based on no experience of it - that's all.

[top-cat]

I just think it unfair to criticise a product based on no experience of it - that's all.

 

I still think you're being silly about that. Does 'standing on it' really change everything? Standing on it might prove it's sturdy enough in use, it proves nothing about it's robustness and efficiency in transport or storage.

 

Besides, I am not criticising the product. I may not have experience with the product, but I have experience with the design, and it is only the design that I am criticising.

 

This is where I think you have your wires crossed.

 

I don't quite get the problem with bolt-on parts. Sure - something like a bit of Steeldeck can't really be much simpler in terms of design. If there was a version of Steeldeck with variable height, then the only real options are telescopic legs or some kind of scissor joint, and have their own engineering problems. The bolt-on leg pockets are aluminium, the same as the deck frame. The plastic parts are simply filling in the extrusion voids.

 

I'm not quite sure why spares would be an issue. Certainly the need to replace the leg pocket is just as unlikely as on a piece of HD deck - unless you unbolt it, why would it need replacing. If the deck has been damaged, then risk assessment would probably suggest replacement rather than repair, starting again with a 3 year guarantee.

 

Litedeck is around double the cost of the Stairville/Millenium product - so that's a hefty price hike for the advantages mentioned.

 

So how do you vary the height of these products without using telescopic legs? Of course, the other way of making steeldeck adjustable in height using screwjacks which are nigh on indestructable as well.

 

The leg pockets themselves look fine, and indeed should never really need replacing. But because they take a square leg, they have that little v-shaped part which pushes it into the socket. It is that part which, in my experience of this design, gets broken. The part is exposed and when the units are stacked, the corner is dropped onto the corner of the unit below which clips it and bends the bolt, rendering it unusable.

 

The other big plastic part on these decks is the little filler which joins them together. The problem with this part, though, is not so much damage; but just loss. They are loose and specific to the job, and in schools and such like, they do just get lost. They're not stored with the decks (as the decks usually end up in some storage somewhere) and just go missing over time. The benefit of steeldeck / litedeck is that it is a standard M10 bolt and you can get a bag of 100 for a few quid.

 

The spares issue with companies who just sell a bit of everything is they often don't have spares at all. They get the decks as complete units and because they're not manufacturing them themselves, don't hold spares. With Steeldeck / Litedeck there are no spare parts, as such. The only things which are prone to being lost or damaged can be purchased in any Screwfix over the counter.

 

As for the advantages mentioned, one which you may have overlooked is resale value; and used availability. Resale value being that, once you're finished with it, you can sell it on and get half of what you paid for it back - halving the price. The used availability thing is that cheap stuff like this seldom ever goes on the used market. However stuff like Litedeck and Steeldeck is very common, and perfectly good for school use. Thus, if through the school's buying arrangements, you can swing the funding to buy deck from rental companies at used prices; they can be had for cheaper than these Millenium things, and you get what is a indeed better product.

[the kid]

What are you using it for ? if its "I want a bit of deck to stand on" lancylen do a nice gate leg bit of wooden deck, its strong, might be a bit bouncy but a light one man carry. my old school used quite a bit of it.

 

If it is for MAKING a stage perhaps look at some other options, do have a call round see what people suggest or have on offer.

[Tregilibob]

looks a lot like this stuff http://www.gerriets.com/en/products/technic/PRAKTIKUS-Stage-Platforms-system which is what I have at work. I have a lot of an older style, with 1 section that is the same as the image on thomann..

pro - fairly easy to put up, can get/create your own legs.

handrails are find to attach, although I find the hand rails very heavy, but sturdy

 

con- fastening them together takes the biscuit. Wiggling connector blocks in, especially if you are slightly not level, and if they get stuck when you are trying to pull the stuff apart - nightmare (ended up using a very long metal rod to force one out!)

I use leg clamps on all of mine except at 1 ft height.

There are braces available for long legs (had mine at 6ft) but they are fiddly to attach, and it never seems as sturdy as litedeck.....

 

I have a small lift with a theatre space on 3rd floor, so the 2m length works well, but when I have had to hire stuff to extend, it just doesn't look right......

 

The section of the leg holder that clamps has broken on me, but not due to dropping, more due to twisting the legs as they are raised and lowered to change the height, or just over tightening.

[Giles Favell]

There are a few general points to bear in mind with decks.

First and most fundamental - if you want a lighter deck - get a smaller one - don't simply be seduced by 'lighter' materials. Lighter materials are generally weaker.......

 

A great deal of the weight of a deck is in the top. A good worthy deck has a good-quality ply top. The reason for this is that it is the best load-handling material. However, you can get other, lighter materials to accept a similar distributed load under ideal circumstances - but that's not the whole story. Point loads, impacts and moisture all play a part - and I've seen some extremely dangerous efforts sold once in a while.Even the TUV rating only covers the UDL (with imposed side load) and not the point load which makes that certification useless for access equipment.

 

Generally, a well designed deck, with a good quality 18mm ply will never have an unsupported panel size more than 1220 x 610 secured by screws around the edges, if it is to achieve a full performance rating of 7.5kNm2 (not talking about the supporting frame here...) If the panel size is bigger for the thickness, then the margins are reduced. A fully certified and compliant deck should of course have a 1.5 safety factor, and limitations of deflection etc...

 

Lastly, the depth of a deck in relation to the unbraced height is extremely important. The deeper the deck construction, the better it is able to withstand the 'falling-over' effect, and the shallower the construction the more relative strain is put on the corner sections of the deck if legged up to the same height. This makes the corner detail/construction extremely important with decks, and why they should not be used if they feel in any way wobbly..

 

Any deck of any description, if used within its safe parameters should have no significant movement.

[dsharp7th]

£229 for 2m² of millennium staging is not half the cost of £450 for 3m² of 8x4' litedeck.

[top-cat]

I assume you mean square metres not metres squared.Also, oddly, a 2x1m deck of litedeck is, on the AC Pricelist, the same cost as an 8x4! Despite the fact that, as you say, there is almost 50% more deck.So I suppose, if you are in the Market for 2x1m decks, litedeck is twice the price of Millenium! Moral of the story? Go imperial!

[dosxuk]

Wasn't somebody complaining the other day about small companies spending too much on over-engineered, over-priced equipment when there is cheaper, more suitable equipment available but just don't have the 'right' name?

 

Something to do with power distro IIRC?

[top-cat]

Yes, I was. Over priced I said, when the cheaper is just as good. Here, I am saying cheaper is not as good. So I fail to see any relevance and instead just see somebody trying and failing to be clever. Also considering how litedeck claims to be of a lower load capacity than mthe millennium ones, your definition over 'over engineered' could be considered a little off...

[paulears]

I came across a different version today with round legs and a big clamp. No idea what brand it is, but again, very similar product.

http://www.limelight.org.uk/rostra.jpg

[top-cat]

I do prefer that design, the handle isn't quite as prone to damage as the big plastic knob. Maltbury made a similar spring-closing design on one of theirs, I think. Although, unfortunately, if you manage to break the plastic handle, again the deck is condemned until you replace it. Which, if using a proprietary part from the manufacturer, might be a few days if they stock it, or much longer if they don't. The inter-deck joiners again, just prone to damage, and can't be picked up locally. That's my real dig with these, I'm sure the platforms are fine and I've always liked hexagrip deck over black painted ply. Although many I've seen don't have any internal support inside the deck frame, so I'm always suspicious when they claim 7.5kN / sq.m. I don't want people to think I just out it down because it's cheap, I do believe the design is flawed in many areas and in the long term may well prove to be a false economy.

[empyfree]

We use the last type of deck pictured, albeit with the older style clamps (a pair of beefy thumb screws per leg) and it holds up pretty well, regular used for bands, catwalks and corporate nonsense. We tried the plastic handled clamp on a single deck with a view to retro-fitting them to all our decks, our experience was that they were awesome, quick and secure...

 

Two years on we're glad we never got round to swapping them all, the plastic has fatigued horribly and the single deck with those clamps on is unusable. Legs just won't stay attached.

[Shez]

We use the last type of deck pictured, albeit with the older style clamps (a pair of beefy thumb screws per leg) and it holds up pretty well

Topdeck. I have some of that - it's light, pretty easy to assemble and all metal construction. And the hire company just up the road has a whole warehouse full of the stuff so we can very easily hire more as and when we need it. That was a very significant factor in selecting it - I guarantee the day will come when you find you need a bit more for a particular event.

[STCM_Tech]

Wow cheers for all comments. I asked and didn't give much detail because as a school it looks like we are having these decks long term loaned to us. But thanks for the comments and I will keep in mind what you have said particularly in terms of wear with the screw threads etc.

 

Cheers

[Stuart91]

We tried the plastic handled clamp on a single deck with a view to retro-fitting them to all our decks, our experience was that they were awesome, quick and secure...

 

Two years on we're glad we never got round to swapping them all, the plastic has fatigued horribly and the single deck with those clamps on is unusable. Legs just won't stay attached.

 

We've got stock of TopDeck, and the 8 most recently purchased decks have the plastic handle. Our crews seem to prefer them, but the handles have had to be readjusted a number of times, and of course it's sods law that they always misbehave at an inopportune moment.

 

I've always been quite impressed with the guys behind TopDeck - their factory is a good old fashioned metal-bashing shop and they've always been responsive to my suggestions. It'll be interesting to see what V2.0 of the plastic handle design looks like.