WiLL Posted February 7, 2013 Share Posted February 7, 2013 Hi all, I'm mostly a stage manager and lighting guy really but I'll soon be staging a production of godspell which has a few cast members who are quieter than they would be ideally. Radio mics on performers are out because there are more soloists then I have the budget for channels. Normally I would suspend a couple of overheads and try and make do. but there are a couple of issues. Let me clarify: The venue is a smallish community hall, the performing area about 20 feet by 25 feet. Audience banks on two opposing sides of the performing area with a band pit taking up a third wall. Basically I'm looking for some advice on how to mic the cast without picking up the band too much. I thought maybe a couple of shotguns suspended as shown?stage plan all comments (within reason) gratefully received. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuart91 Posted February 7, 2013 Share Posted February 7, 2013 Could you add some float / PZM mics on the stage anywhere? They'd probably be less work to deploy. If you are clever you could position them where the quiet characters are standing when they deliver their key lines. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WiLL Posted February 7, 2013 Author Share Posted February 7, 2013 the diffulty with that is that there is no set as such other than the band rail (a 3' x 15' flat) and some movable boxes. The ceiling is a peaked roof ranging from 12' high at the walls to 20' in the peak. And the cast roam the whole space ( as it is in the round). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ImagineerTom Posted February 7, 2013 Share Posted February 7, 2013 Unfortunately microphones don't make quiet people louder (in fact they seem to make them quieter as they think they don't have to try so hard) - any kind of floating microphone will indiscriminately amplify everything it picks up leaving you with an amplified quiet person still indistinguishable from an amplified background sound. The only answer to quiet people is either to individually mic them up so that you can control their specific levels or get the director to knock some heads together and make them speak up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulears Posted February 7, 2013 Share Posted February 7, 2013 Normally, I'm a firm boundary mic user, but I did Barnum in a real circus ring once and used 6 short shotguns spaced are around the ring. The initial tests were pretty hopeless, because the speakers were at the perimeter of the room facing the ring, and mics on one side of the ring looked straight at the speakers on the other side. In the end I used a small cluster flown over the ring pointing outwards (4 speakers, 90 degrees apart - 4 sx300 EVs, just for the vocals and it worked pretty well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GaryNattrass Posted February 7, 2013 Share Posted February 7, 2013 Personally I would put a third shotgun in the middle and possibly two more at either side backing off to the audience. Weapon of choice for me is the AT875R and I have done several video recordings of performances using up to five of them but appreciate your band problems so maybe just three at the front will give you enough scope. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sonicparticle Posted February 7, 2013 Share Posted February 7, 2013 Apologies if this question has been covered before. I am new to this forum and new to theatre production (I mainly work in TV/ Film). How do you guys calculate the phase when using multiple shotgun mics? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cedd Posted February 7, 2013 Share Posted February 7, 2013 I've literally finished Godspell today. How have they cast it? I went in to it expecting to get away with 13 radio mics (12 apostles and Jesus). Have you sussed that they all swap parts? Sadly (for me) the school I did it for decided to split all the parts between 33 kids. The room was difficult to say the least - circular hall, domed wooden roof. Longest reverb time and most seperate audible reflections I've ever heard - boundary mics just don't work. I managed to get everyone who spoke on 20 radio mics with swaps. I could probably done it with less, but as I had 20 mics available, I didn't bother. It's an easy show to do swaps in - it's just a big gaggle of people on stage with lots of movement, so the odd one nipping off doesn't really get noticed. What I'm trying to say is if you take some time to go through the show with somebody who knows who's saying what, you may find you can make it work on relatively few radio mics. You really will need radios for the songs, some of them (particularly "All For The Best") are loud, busy, difficult and need amplification. All that said, it's a great, really fun show. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulears Posted February 7, 2013 Share Posted February 7, 2013 We don't calculate phase at all, as with moving subjects, it's a bit pointless as delays are constantly changing. It's an accepted fact of life that multiple shotguns will produce comb filtering artefacts, hence why for stage edge mixing, PCC boundaries tend to work better. For PA purposes, I guess we just live with the fact the amplifying weak voices usually means you are on a hiding to nothing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GaryNattrass Posted February 7, 2013 Share Posted February 7, 2013 As Paul says I would also not bother with phase calculations for a given area of coverage, I would however check that all mics are in phase with each other before placing them! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peza2010 Posted February 7, 2013 Share Posted February 7, 2013 the topic title made me think that you were thinking of shooting someone. that may still be the case because this is probably gonna be "one of those shows" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobbsy Posted February 8, 2013 Share Posted February 8, 2013 If you really mean shot gun mics, superimpose the polar pattern over your drawing. There will be far more dead areas on the stage than covered. If shotguns are the only way to go, you'll need a lot more plus a board op capable of mixing line by line. Without having seen the staging, I'd be thinking in terms of 4 or 5 cardioids suspended over the front row of audience on both sides (so total 8 or 10) with the shotguns used to cover any specific problem areas. Oh year, and the same really good board up mixing line by line and mic by mic. Or a cast that can project? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WiLL Posted February 8, 2013 Author Share Posted February 8, 2013 Or a cast that can project? Welcome to amdram baby :) Thanks for the replies chaps, some food for thought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nicktaylor Posted February 8, 2013 Share Posted February 8, 2013 Me thinks the poster with twenty radio mics having a laugh at the expense of the op.I would have thought from his comments about the venue, money was an object! I would go for a combination of dangleys on wires and maybe boundary mics. All facing away from the band as much as is possible. The director will have to take on board shortcomings and block accordingly! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WiLL Posted February 8, 2013 Author Share Posted February 8, 2013 well seeing as I'm directing, designing and performing I guess it's my responsibility all round. Was just seeking some more experienced ideas on micing solutions aiming to get as much stage cover as poss while avoiding band. EDIT: I avoided answering the 20 radio mic 'solution' as I originally stated there certainly is not the budget for it. Thanks for the input guys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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