Skimble Posted April 5, 2011 Share Posted April 5, 2011 Hi, We're in the process of looking at a mobile access tower to get to our lighting bars in the school hall. I need to be appropriately trained to use this, but don't know if there are specific training courses that I should look to attend/avoid. Any suggestions? I'm in SE London, so something local to that would suit well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulears Posted April 5, 2011 Share Posted April 5, 2011 If it's a typical school hall, you might find a tall set of A-Frame steps or a zarges style ladder more useful. Scaff towers are a total pain, get in the way, take ages to assemble and are pretty inflexible things. As for the training - make sure you get theatrical training - ABTT courses, because building industry practice is quite different and many of their rules and working practices are not appropriate to us. You will also find that many suppliers of the access equipment can point you to suitable courses for their kit. Maybe now is the time to consider powered access - your estates people would also be very interested in this - perhaps being able to share the cost? If the school really want to ensure safety, then powered access is safer. Towers are, and have always been, awkward things to use for focusing and rigging - and take up great chunks of floor space. A-Frames and Zarges can get in quickly to quite respectable heights - and I'd rather use these any day! Zarges in particular are handy because they're variable height - which means you can use them on stage too (if you have one) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Lewis Posted April 5, 2011 Share Posted April 5, 2011 Without wishing to resurrect similar posts and debates, you should be aware that guidance states that access towers must not be moved when there are people on them, however tempting and time saving it might be! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramdram Posted April 5, 2011 Share Posted April 5, 2011 Certainly second the Zarges kit. Our village hall (for amdram) has a set. Very versatile...three separate ladders if needed so no lugging around unnecessary weight and easier storage (perhaps not so much of an issue in a school though), very stable in use and light enough for the lady set painters to move when tarting up the pros: http://essentialstagesupplies.co.uk/products.php?cat=114&gclid=COSnxNiDhagCFZBkfAodExZ_qQ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ImagineerTom Posted April 5, 2011 Share Posted April 5, 2011 Ironically it doesn't really matter one hoot which courses people on here suggest you go on; the school (their insurers or H&S person) will somewhere have a policy on what courses or qualifications THEY ACCEPT and that is the course you will have to do - and it useually bares no relation to traditional industry requirements or good practise. You could turn up with a certificate signed by god himself but if it doesn't satisfy their criteria it'll be worthless and they still won't let you climb anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kerry davies Posted April 5, 2011 Share Posted April 5, 2011 Firstly Skimble, well done you for seeking advice, lots of teachers appear "above" all that. Secondly the simpler the better hence people recommending Zarges, and thirdly I would suggest making the decisions in conjunction with the facilities manager (caretaker?) to see what could work for both of you (see Paul's post). Who knows there may be another budget you can tap into and whoever does general maintenance around the premises is likely to have more WaH experience than anyone else on site and be aware of policy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Lyall Posted April 5, 2011 Share Posted April 5, 2011 Clearly the simplest (and cheapest) solution is, as other posters have said, a zarges. If you were, for whatever reason, to go for a mobile scaffolding tower then look at the PASMA courses. Some will come to you to give training on your kit, some you go to their training centre. I'd recommend one where the training is going to be on the same model/type of kit you're going to get (or you've already got!) For the powered access route (so scissor lifts, booms, et al. ) then look at an IPAF course (with the appropriate class). Again same caveats apply as above. I've used http://www.kingfisheraccess.co.uk/ and found their training to be really good, although not specifically geared towards the entertainments industry! Simon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramdram Posted April 5, 2011 Share Posted April 5, 2011 Another thought occurs...if "you" were to buy a tower you could find some people would/could not be arsed to erect it, then do the checking thing etc, etc, and just get a table and a chair...whereas having a decent stable ladder to work from... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
willdoweuk Posted April 5, 2011 Share Posted April 5, 2011 We have a genie AWP at my high school. Really useful, when the one person with a license shows up... I would reccommend it if you have the budget for the unit and the training. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seano Posted April 5, 2011 Share Posted April 5, 2011 when the one person with a license shows up... <pointless de-rail of thread to address personal pet hat follows... > It isn't a licence. Regardless of what some companies or organisations with a vested interest in convincing people that their card is in some way a legal requirement may tell you, there is no such thing as a licence for one of those machines. Under PUWER you need to be trained and you need to be competent but you do not need any specific card, or indeed any card at all. <normal service will now be resumed, ayethangyew> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
willdoweuk Posted April 5, 2011 Share Posted April 5, 2011 when the one person with a license shows up... <pointless de-rail of thread to address personal pet hat follows... > It isn't a licence. Regardless of what some companies or organisations with a vested interest in convincing people that their card is in some way a legal requirement may tell you, there is no such thing as a licence for one of those machines. Under PUWER you need to be trained and you need to be competent but you do not need any specific card, or indeed any card at all. <normal service will now be resumed, ayethangyew> Sorry - poorly worded, I just mean that because it's a school, we have a strict site manager so he won't let anyone use it without a mewp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skimble Posted June 13, 2011 Author Share Posted June 13, 2011 Thank you all for your advice. In the end we went for an access tower because of the height of the hall - we have a Zarges system that reaches the lighting bars, but six metres is a long way up for someone whose job is not to climb ladders every day (I've been up it and wasn't happy!). We had a powered lift that wasn't properly maintained and ended up being condemned. While in theory the premises staff should be interested in reality they do nothing beyond a stepladder, so it's just for drama purposes. I'm now the proud owner of a PASMA card, along with a couple of colleagues, and we go up for the first time this week... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SimonTheSoundMan Posted June 13, 2011 Share Posted June 13, 2011 http://www.hse.gov.uk/falls/regulations.htm Working at any height you have to do a ladder course. Your local authority should organise these courses for you. Glad you got a PASMA card. If you're rigging lights at height, you should also have a riggers card. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kerry davies Posted June 13, 2011 Share Posted June 13, 2011 Which riggers card would that be, Simon? And there was I thinking that Chris had done well in taking the advice and getting some form of training on the equipment he is using which would have included ascending the tower safely. (Beats self with stick and vows to do better in future.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Lewis Posted June 13, 2011 Share Posted June 13, 2011 Sorry, but I cannot find any reference in the WAH regulations to "having to do a ladder course"? Appropriate training, perhaps but not a mandatory course.Also, if by "riggers card" you mean the NRC, then no - that qualification is not about rigging lights. Suspension of truss for entertainment purposes, yes. Rigging lights? no... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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