DMX total noobie

[Mark M]

Hi there, just signed up after reading through these forums for quite some time. I have very little knowledge of lighting which is why Im here and have some basic sound knowledge. So down to business;

 

Im after some LED cans for a very basic setup (its for jamming sessions in my drum warehouse to give it a bit of rock and roll feel) however I have absolutely no idea about anything DMX so all info is greatly appreciated.

 

If I were to get 4 LED cans I assume I would also need a lighting desk of some sort. There wont be any real need to upgrade anything other than maybe another 4 par cans.

 

I had a look on thomann at the led cans and they use 5 DMX channels So am I right in thinkin that if I wanted to use 4 independently I would need at least 20 channels on the desk?

 

Looking at the picture it looks like I need to run a power cable and a DMX, It has DMX in and out so does that mean I can run one from the desk to can 1 then link from 1 to 2 2 to 3 etc?

 

Think that just about covers everything but if anyone has any other info or links to good articles Im a keen learner.

 

Oh and forgot to add I'll be getting a hazer to put near near the stage for added effect

 

Many thanks, Mark

[Aaron-Hill07]

Firstly, Welcome to the forum and I hope you get the answers you need!

 

The Thomann LED Par's are very good build quality and very good price also!

 

They are 5 channels and you're right to think that you'll then need 20 channels on your desk if you wish to control each Par individualy. Although you can control all of the cans together IE they all turn on and change colour at the same time.

 

I believe the channels on those cans are:

Channel 1: Intensity

Channel 2: Red

Channel 3: Green

Channel 4: Blue

Channel 5: Strobe

 

You've got it almost down to a tee, you power them all up and simply daisy chain the lights together so cable from the desk into the first light, from the first into the second etc etc..

 

Quick question, is there a reason you've chosen LED Par's over standard Par's?

 

HTH

Aaron

[Wol]

I had a look on thomann at the led cans and they use 5 DMX channels So am I right in thinkin that if I wanted to use 4 independently I would need at least 20 channels on the desk?

 

In short : yes

In long: Depends what you want to do with them. Out of the 5 channels, dependent on the cans (I dont know the DMX spec off by heart), you might find that one or two are effects channels or something like that which you might not need to use, in which case you might be able to only need three channels per can (R, G + B), so use channels 1, 2, 3, 6, 7, 8, 11, 12, 13, and 16, 17, 18 on the desk, in which case a 12 channel desk would suffice.

 

 

Looking at the picture it looks like I need to run a power cable and a DMX, It has DMX in and out so does that mean I can run one from the desk to can 1 then link from 1 to 2 2 to 3 etc?

Yes.

 

Also have a look at the blue room wiki, or use the search function up in the top corner, as there's loads of info already out there which will be helpful to you.

 

HTH!

 

edit: beaten to some of it! My "in long" answer just needs to include the virtual dimmer now!

[Mark M]

Thanks for the quick reply, and the good news that Ive manage to work out some of it correctly already.

 

Re the LED cans, I thought using them would allow me change colours of them to give a better effect than just with 4 static colours on the standard cans. As I said in my first post its really just a bit of fun for who ever comes down to the warehouse. We had Mark Shulman (Pinks drummer) down a couple of weeks back and weve got Steve White (Weller) coming down in a few weeks and weve almost got the stage built so thought it would be good to get some lights in there too.

 

Do you think I would be better going with standard cans? Im happy to if you think they will do as good a job but I'll need a dimmer to go with them unlike the LED cans?

 

Just thinking about it actually, will the LED cans give me as much light as the standard cans will? I dont want to get it all rigged up and then find out that they arent bright enough.

 

Thanks again, Mark

[Aaron-Hill07]

Sounds like quite a nice little venue you've set-up there then, getting some good musicians in there too!

 

It completely depends what you want them for, if it's just to add colour to the studio then LED is fine but if you want to use them for washing the stage to see people then I would have thought standard Par's would be better as they are brighter compared to the Thomann LED's...

 

So in answer to your last question, no you won't get as much light from the LED cans you've chosen as they're budget. To get a descent intensity out of LED products you have to spend good money on them,

 

How big is the space your planning on lighting also?

 

Cheers,

Aaron

[Mark M]

The stage is pretty small, havent got the exact measurements yet as I told the joiner it had to be big enough to fit a small band on but I imagine it will be "cosey" should we ever get a five piece on there Im heading up later to check the progress but I'll take some pictures and get some exact specs.

 

If I went down the standard cans/dimmer route I suppose I could always add more cans in at a later day perhaps side fill and some on the floor even if I havent got the desired "look" depnding on the desk of course.

[Aaron-Hill07]

Yeah pictures and dimensions would help simply because trying to wash a stage 20m x 10m x 10m for example will be a real challenge with 4 LED Pars!

 

Yeah you can always add more parcans, if you chose Standard Par 56's and get a Showtec Multidim Dimmer Pack from Thomann you can run up to 8 par's from one dimmer if you pair them...

 

Also, you can then run 8 par's from a basic 4 channel desk!

[pritch]

Don't forget though, if you're going to go with traditional parcans instead, you're going to need a bit more power available to you. That said, six or so 500W cans will run happily of a single 13A socket, but we're still talking a much heavier draw than a bunch of LED fixtures.

[Mark M]

Yeah pictures and dimensions would help simply because trying to wash a stage 20m x 10m x 10m for example will be a real challenge with 4 LED Pars!

 

Yeah you can always add more parcans, if you chose Standard Par 56's and get a Showtec Multidim Dimmer Pack from Thomann you can run up to 8 par's from one dimmer if you pair them...

 

Also, you can then run 8 par's from a basic 4 channel desk!

 

Its probably nearer 5x2m's to be honest and that has to have room to fit the speakers on I'll get some pics of the warehouse though as one thing that has just crossed my mind is the position of the lights, they may have to be quite some distance from the stage as the ceilings are way to high.

 

 

Don't forget though, if you're going to go with traditional parcans instead, you're going to need a bit more power available to you. That said, six or so 500W cans will run happily of a single 13A socket, but we're still talking a much heavier draw than a bunch of LED fixtures.

 

Ah yes power, we only have 13A sockets in the building so anything would have to run of that. I could look at getting something bigger in I suppose but until I see if it works and can help bring some money in then were stuck with 13A for the time being.

[Aaron-Hill07]

Yeah rigging is another thing you'll have to think about, you could have floormounted pars or put them on T-Bars in front of the stage?

 

You can happily run 4 500w traditional parcans on one 13a socket so that's not a worry

 

EDIT: My typo!

[james.sealey]

You can happily run 8 500w traditional parcans on one 13a socket so that's not a worry

 

Forgive me if I have missed something here, but 8 x 500W = 4000W, which at 230V roughly works out to 17.5A?! I know there are various electrical factors that mean these figures are subject to change which I am not so knowledgable in, but I'd like to think I know enough to know that 8 x 500W Parcans cannot all be used at the same time off one 13A supply...

[Aaron-Hill07]

Oopsy, didn't proof read that one! I meant to write 4 but obviously had the number 8 on my mind..

 

Apologies, 4 will safely run as will 6

[Mark M]

Dont really want to have them on t bars to be honest, we have a mezzanine floor in the warehouse so hopefully I can rig the cans off there (I'll have to take the usual safety precautions etc as the public will have access to it on occassion)

 

I cant see us running anymore than 8 cans to be honest unless it really takes off but even then it would be unlikely unless it was making a lot of money and could warrant spending more money.

 

I know there is a seperate electrics forum but would 8 cans running 300-500w bulbs and a PA be ok on the same circuit? The PA were running is a DB Opera Compact (1Kw ish)

 

Edit - just spotted your typo will stick to 6 cans then.

[james.sealey]

Oopsy, didn't proof read that one! I meant to write 4 but obviously had the number 8 on my mind..

 

Apologies, 4 will safely run as will 6 ;)

 

Glad we cleared that up! I thought I'd been missing a trick for a moment there! Isn't six a bit to close to the limit as well though?

[Mark M]

Oopsy, didn't proof read that one! I meant to write 4 but obviously had the number 8 on my mind..

 

Apologies, 4 will safely run as will 6 ;)

 

Glad we cleared that up! I thought I'd been missing a trick for a moment there! Isn't six a bit to close to the limit as well though?

 

Perhaps with the PA?

 

Im happy to go with 4 @ 500W and maybe use some LED cans for floor spots?