Par Can wiring

[lightsource]

Hi all,

 

I'm sure this has been discussed before, but can't find anything suitable, on either the BR, or the Wiki.......

 

We've just obtained a large quantity of aged (well, actually bl00dy ancient) lighting gear, and how the original owner didn't kill himself is beyond me....

 

All lanterns have been condemmed untill fully re-wired (4 core mic cable with the screen as earth, and the cores doubled up for live and neutral. The screen was also only connected to the plug and not to the lantern! A 30A dimmer pack re-wired with 1.5mm cable.....and a knot in the cable, inside the dimmer as strain relief ..... it goes on ;) I could saturate the 'dodgy electricians' topic in Electrical And Power )

 

Anyway, rant over :) The lanterns in question are various PAR64 Long 1000w

 

Can anyone suggest a suitable mains cable. The cans are by various manufacturers, but all contain fully enclosed ceramic lampholders with internal screw terminals, ( no terminal blocks) so I am not really looking for a 'rewire kit', as I have suitable connectors for both ends.

 

I'm looking for about a 50m drum of cable, to re-wire the Par's, and the reason for this post, is that I'm a little unsure of the temperature rating required of the cable. So any advice appreciated.

 

I have a load of standard 1.5mm cable and heat resistand sleeving, but I don't feel this cable / sleeving would be suitable at the cable entry point to the can.

 

Also would standard cable entry strain relief grommets be ok as some need to be replaced, or should I be looking for a high-temp alternative.....

 

Also any ideas as to the operating temperature of a Par 64 1000w (long) can, in constant use?

 

I do have a suitable thermocouple to measure temperature, but unfortunatley the multimeter it connects to is broken at the monent

 

All replies apprecieted.

[Ynot]

Buy the proper wiring sets, complete with Parsafe sockets. All you then need is a box of 15A plugs and you're away!

[lightsource]

Sorry Tony, but as I said in the original post, I have all the connectors, all I'm really looking for is a 50m drum of suitable temperature rated cable.

 

And other peoples input as to weather standard cable strain relief grommets are ok, or weather a high-temp solution is required.

[csg]

whilst standard ho7 trs cable will not melt, the heat present in the lamphouse will turn the cable brittle and prone to cracking fairly quickly as the rubber dries out

 

so, you will need a high temperature silicone cable, 1.5mm, and you should be able to get this from AC lighting. It is expensive, but it is the proper thing

 

whilst your ceramics may be fully enclosed, if they still require single wire entry, then I dont think they would meet safety standards. Even on a purely practical level, the heat and mechanical stress of twisting the lamp holder causes insulation to fail in the back of the can - ive seen this too many times to remember

 

If they are thomas cans, then you can fit the rear cover / knob assembly, but I hate these with a passion as they constantly jam when trying to spin the lamp

alternately, AC will be able to sell you parshells which will include the cable tail

 

standard nylon cable glands will be fine

[Ynot]

Sorry Tony, but as I said in the original post, I have all the connectors, all I'm really looking for is a 50m drum of suitable temperature rated cable.

A|pologies - somehow missed that bit!

However, are the lamp-end connectors up to scratch? ie been upgraded to ParSafe or similar?

I've seen some pretty ropey par connectors over the years, usually on old/recon gear...

 

Just a thought.

[The Gaffa]

Have a number of Pars that need the ceramics replacing, mainly due to overheating / arcing.

 

The Pars in question are the Thomas ones which were supplied with the "Parsafe" thing.

 

Seems that I can't get the rewirable variety as my supplier has been told that they aren't CE approved, so I've got to get the pre wired type, which seem to have a slightly shiny heat proof cover over the supply wires from the outer sheath, which is HOR7 - 3G 1.5.

 

In answer to the "what temprature does the long nose Par 64 run at?" its about 350C at the bulb, observered by using a thermal imaging camera.

[KevinE]

For DIY rewiring I'd use silicone mains cable...however for a 50m drum you might want to check the price first!

 

cable

 

PS the link shows 1mm as an example

[Paul J Need]

http://www.10outof10.co.uk/acatalog/30423_detail_medium.jpg

 

This is what we use and supply - wired to 180 degree silicon cable, with parsafe attached. You just need to add a plug to put on the other end

 

If the cable gland is ok on the Pars you have - the whole rewire should take you you no more than 10 minutes.

 

Hope this helps

 

Paul

[mutley]

When I used to work at a large UK holiday park, we had literally dozens of PAR64s where even the high temperature silicone cable had cracked through heat (however, they weren't PARsafe lamp holders, they were just the bare ceramic).

What we did was to sleeve the cable in a high temperature fibreglass sleeving such as:

http://cpc.farnell.com/CB11532/cable-wire-...pif240-2-100-ft or

http://cpc.farnell.com/CB02279/cable-wire-...equestid=245797

for the individual cores, or a slightly wider one for the outer diameter of the flex.

 

With this, even if the primary insulation on the cores breaks off, the conductor is still sleeved in an insulator. They are rated at 680*C and 450*C respectively, and have an insulation rating of at least 800V. ;)

 

These PAR cans were used daily for hours at a time, several times a day. We found that the standard cable clamps fitted to them break after a while too. While nylon glands can normally be used, because of the heavy use ours were getting, we used brass glands such as:

http://cpc.farnell.com/CB02132/cable-wire-...lec-50616m-llnc

 

As for silicone insulated cable, try these guys:

http://www.siliconrubber.co.uk/products/si...able/index.html

If you think you might want quite a lot, or might consider selling it on, you might also want to try searching for Chinese companies who make silicone cable such as:

http://www.made-in-china.com/showroom/senh...-amp-Cable.html ;)

(but make sure it is to an approved British/European standard!)

 

Hope that helps.

[lightsource]

Thanks for all the quick replies.

 

All the Ceramic lampholders are fine, it's just a cable and strain relief issue, hence the requirement for a drum of suitable cable.

 

ParSafes are not an option, as they won't fit inside most of the cans (have identified some of them as Pulsar, manufactured around 1983-85), but then like I said most of the ceramic lampholders are ok, so only a cabling and strain relief issue due to the temperatures involved.

 

Thanks Paul, and others for giving me an idea as to the temperatures involved. Though a supplier for a drum of the cable would be appreciated.

 

Mutley, if all you're info checks out, then thank you, that was exactly what I was looking for ;)

[tokm]

Would this be suitable?

 

Ceramic.. 3core silicon flex.. bit short but should be ok. From what I've read, it sounds like this's what your after.

 

HTH, Tom

[boatman]

..... Though a supplier for a drum of the cable would be appreciated.

 

Not a drum as such, but only £1 per metre including VAT from here:

 

10 out of 10 online catalogue page

 

Just scroll down until you find "1.5mm 3-Core Silicon", it's the cheapest source I know.

[lightsource]

..... Though a supplier for a drum of the cable would be appreciated.

 

Not a drum as such, but only £1 per metre including VAT from here:

 

10 out of 10 online catalogue page

 

Just scroll down until you find "1.5mm 3-Core Silicon", it's the cheapest source I know.

 

So Mr Paul J Need, it seems you may be a suitable suppler after all.....Will give you a call in the next couple of days!

 

 

You should have read the OP better, and then could have gone in for the kill!

 

A new customer awaits,

 

Speak to you soon,

 

Nigel T.

[dougmorgan743]

I have just used some of these from SLX

 

http://www.stage-electrics.co.uk/product.aspx?code=547-2075

 

Parsafe 2 GX16d Lampholder with 1m of Double Insulated Heat Resistant Cable for a PAR 64 Parcan

 

Cable is thicker due to the double insulation, we have a few thomcat cans in stock, and I had to replace the gland on these as the cable was too thick. Some of the deeper parsafes are a pain and you have a job to get the rear back on.

 

Free del on orders over £70 from the webshop

[lightsource]

I have just used some of these from SLX

 

http://www.stage-electrics.co.uk/product.aspx?code=547-2075

 

Parsafe 2 GX16d Lampholder with 1m of Double Insulated Heat Resistant Cable for a PAR 64 Parcan

 

Cable is thicker due to the double insulation, we have a few thomcat cans in stock, and I had to replace the gland on these as the cable was too thick. Some of the deeper parsafes are a pain and you have a job to get the rear back on.

 

Free del on orders over £70 from the webshop

 

Cheers for that, the only problem I have is I could buy a new Par 64 Parsafe can for little more than the cost of that wiring kit alone :)