Maximum effect from minimum lanterns

[nicfar]

Hi

I have the age old problem of too small a rig for my imaginative design ideas. I am 16 and the principal lighting designer and operator for my school and have been for a few years now. At the school we have a fairly small rig which is quite hard to design around.

 

Having recently joined the site I was wondering if anybody has any useful tips on how to produce a professional effect from a smaller rig.

 

many thanks

nic

[JimWebber]

A distinct lack of information me thinks? What are you aiming to do? What sort of "Looks" are you trying to get?

 

A couple of points as I see them....

 

Always try to allocate some lanterns for back light or side light...It gives "sculpture" to the scene.

 

If you use a neutral front/face light, any atmosphere can be added through the use of top light/back light - in this way, several covers may be achieved with fewer lanterns.

 

Having said all that, It is pointless striving for fancy effect, if it means that the rest of the show is poorly lit! ie get the basics right first!

 

And as the great Francis says "One light in the right position is better then untold lights in the wrong one!"

 

Just my 2p

 

Jim

[woody74]

I'll second everything Jim said, and add an additional "use backlight".

 

And, you will probably get better results if you define what a "small" rig is to you. For some of us, 100 lights is a small rig, for others 10.

 

-w

[nicfar]

Hi again,

Sorry about the lack of information previously given.

The rig is about 18 lanterns and is used 2 light a space bout 15m x 10m if that helps.

The rig consists of 6 parcans, 4 profiles and 6 fresnals. Forgive my lack of knowledge of the rig but things are taken down and put up without me knowing due to it being a school performing arts centre and constantly being used.

 

and thanks for the tips previously given

 

nic

[paulears]

You have a stage 15, wide and 10m deep - strewth - what kind of place is it - your quantity of kit are going to struggle if you need more than a few colours. We still haven't enough info. How about a stage plan showing us what is on it.

 

Not being funny - but if you are "principal lighting designer and operator" and don't know what kit you have,or where it is, or what it's being used for - this doesn't sound much like any lighting designer role I have ever come accross. Sounds like a job title in exchange for hard work/dogs-body duties.

 

 

So for us to help you with a design, we need to know the brief, the exact kit available, a plan of the space, a plan of where people and 'things' will be and what you are trying to achieve.

[Ynot]

Hi again,

Sorry about the lack of information previously given.

The rig is about 18 lanterns and is used 2 light a space bout 15m x 10m if that helps.

The rig consists of 6 parcans, 4 profiles and 6 fresnals.

15 metres by 10 metres?????? That's 50 feet by almost 35 feet!!! that's a HUGE space - are you SURE that's the size?

Because even for a well equipped school space that's one HECK of a stage area!

And your 18 lanterns are most certainly gonna look pretty lost on that! :o

You'll be lucky to cover the FRONT let alone any sides or backlight.

 

(Point of order - it's fresnEl, not fresnAl... :unsure: )

 

EDIT:

Beaten to the punch in a way by Paul!

To add, though, an idea of what circuits appear where would also help, though if it IS 15x10m, your options are VERY limited.

[nicfar]

Hi again,

 

Very sorry about previous information given as it wasn't very accurate and informative at all.

 

As you can probably all tell I'm not very experienced at this area at all which was my main reason for joining this site so I could learn a lot more. I am only 16 and still in school so only do the school drama productions which totals only one a year maybe more if I'm lucky. Seeing as I am the only student in the school who has offered a genuine interest in the area I was put in charge of the design and operation of the lighting. Now obviously still being a student means finding time to know my kit better and use it is hard. This results in my knowledge of the kit, the size of the auditorium and other things being fairly limited.

 

So please forgive my lack of knowledge and please continue to help me as these tips are extremely valuable to me and will help me an awful lot in the future.

 

Now for what I do know...

 

The stage size is approximately 10m across and I would estimate 8m deep. I know this is not very accurate so please excuse my lack of knowledge of the space.

 

There are approximately 20 lanterns including 6 par cans and then a mixture of profiles and fresnels.

 

Regarding questions about scenery and the brief. At the moment I am asking for help on a purely general basis as we are not currently putting on a production as I do not have time considering I have GCSE's in little over a month. This is why I am asking for any general help people can give me.

 

Many thanks and once again please excuse my lack of knowledge and I will appreciate any replys to this post.

 

nic

[paulears]

Right then! First stop is the school library. If it's any good at all it will have some books by Francis Reid. Francis and a few other authors write really well and will take you through the basics - there are plenty of other books that go into advanced techniques, but the fact that Francis's have been about for so many years is testament to the content - I read his material at your age, and it was good advice then, and very little has changed!

 

If you don't have a show to light, then it's all background info you need. The net is not a good place for the kind of info you need - so hot foot it to the library and see what they have. If the school library doesn't have it then it's a rubbish library - almost all schools should have it in stock as it is recommended in many of the exam board publciations.

[Jivemaster]

Lights are only as "bright" as the ambient light lets them be. a 5K Arri will only just fill in the shadows in a full sunlight shot, so Light what you want to be seen and keep the stray light right down. That way at least you will make best use of the luminaires that you have.

 

 

 

edit for spling

[Ynot]

The stage size is approximately 10m across and I would estimate 8m deep. I know this is not very accurate so please excuse my lack of knowledge of the space.

Now THAT'S more like it! :o

Regarding questions about scenery and the brief. At the moment I am asking for help on a purely general basis as we are not currently putting on a production as I do not have time considering I have GCSE's in little over a month. This is why I am asking for any general help people can give me.

No worries, although it's VERY hard to give general advice, as it ALL depends entirely on what even you'll want to light, how the stage is expected to be used and what the director actually wants to achieve.

 

Best bet would be to start asking those in charge of the event for their input then coming back here to ask specific questions.

And as Paul says (darned slow typing!!) read a few good books on the subject - many have been mentioned on the BR before - check the Wiki for details.

 

And welcome to the Blue Room, by the way!

:unsure:

[nicfar]

Thank you very much for all your help

 

Whilst I am here I thought I might ask what peoples thoughts are on buying in a moving head light (excuse my lack of technical language) against buying larger number of new lanterns for my school. I only ask because, with the start of the new financial year, the school a.v technician has asked for my ideas on new kit that I would like.

I am not even sure that the budget would extend to a moving light but I thought I may as well ask. :unsure:

 

nic

[Ynot]

Whilst I am here I thought I might ask what peoples thoughts are on buying in a moving head light (excuse my lack of technical language) against buying larger number of new lanterns for my school. I only ask because, with the start of the new financial year, the school a.v technician has asked for my ideas on new kit that I would like.

I am not even sure that the budget would extend to a moving light but I thought I may as well ask. :unsure:

I may well get beaten to the punch again, but here goes...

 

If you search the BR you'll find MANY threads about this.

In short, especially in a school environment, you'll be FAR better to ask them to invest in a decent stock of basic conventional lanterns. Movers are all very nice, but for decent kit VERY expensive.

For the cost of just two mac 250's for example, you could probably equip the space with a couple of dozen good quality ETC profiles/parnels/pars which will give you a huge advantage for the vast majority of events.

Movers will only really come into their own for a small section of school productions.

PLUS you'd need to invest in a decent desk to drive them.

 

What desk/dimmers do you have at the moment??

 

TD

 

Afterthought:

Do you have a local theatre? Am dram or pro...

Best bet would be to contact them and ask if one of their experienced lighting techs would mind coming in to school and look at what you have, and make recommendation on what might be best to invest in to suit.

Not sure if any Blue roomers live/work around Shrewsbury, but that's also an option.

[nicfar]

At the moment I'm using a Zero 88 Alcora mark2 desk (the 24 channel option)

 

As for dimmers I am again not totally sure on what we have (I should really make a list of the kit when I'm back at school). I know we have 2 DMX (if thats correct) box's which I think have 16 channels on each.

 

As for the need for a new desk if moving heads are purchased, I have previously had one moving head operating on the last 6 channels and used the other 18 for fixed lanterns for a production of oliver!. However, this proved to be quite restrictive and if I were to hire in a moving head/s again I think there would be the need to hire in a bigger desk as well.

 

In reponse to the afterthought. There is a (fairly) local company called Starlight who fitted out the school's performing arts centre. The guy in charge of the company regularly comes into school and does all my focusing and rigging for me (damn health and safety). He is very helpful and taught me all I know about lighting so far. Im pretty sure the schools a.v technician will be in contact with him as it is probably him who will supply the kit.

 

nic

[Paul J Need]

Perhaps get away from "general" lighting..... think cross light, think back light, think of FOH purely as tiny amounts of fill. Be bold!

[Andrew C]

Whilst I am here I thought I might ask what peoples thoughts are on buying in a moving head light

Don't. To look half good, you need lots of the bggrs. Then they are noisy (or ££HUGE) and require a skilled person to keep them all working. Hire them in if your future designs and budget work out that way.

 

This has been covered quite a lot. Have a look at the FAQ & Wiki.