scaryrobot Posted January 31, 2005 Share Posted January 31, 2005 Hi there, I've just been asked to work out some specs for the refurbishment of an old gymnasium at college into a dance studio. I'm guessing the dimensions are about 20m x 8m, and the department wants the lighting to be as 'versatile' as possible. I'm guessing 6 overhead bars, each populated mainly with par64s, and 2 side bars on the SR and SL walls. Maybe in the region of 6 profiles, 12 fresnels, and the remainder as parcans. There is no stage, it's just a floor space, and a few chairs will be brought in for performances. I'm thinking of going for 48 circuits using Strand racked dimmers, and a Fat Frog so we have the capability for movers in the future. I have no idea of the actual budget; I was simply asked to spec up the 'optimum' setup, and work from there. I'm not sure if I'm getting the proportion of floorspace to lighting wrong, as I've not had to rig lights for anything other than small stage space before. Also, any suggestions for specific dimmers or (more importantly) types of lanterns to use, and any need for pairing/patching? Any help much appreciated,scary Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benweblight Posted January 31, 2005 Share Posted January 31, 2005 what you say there sounds good you'll probably want some kind of remote panel so people can call up basic scenes when they are using the room for practices etc. or is this only going to be a performance space? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jivemaster Posted January 31, 2005 Share Posted January 31, 2005 Lots of back, top and side light, Several low lights floor stands, ladders, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
londonjim Posted January 31, 2005 Share Posted January 31, 2005 Moving Heads ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psl Posted January 31, 2005 Share Posted January 31, 2005 I'm thinking of going for 48 circuits using Strand racked dimmers, and a Fat Frog so we have the capability for movers in the future. I have no idea of the actual budget; I was simply asked to spec up the 'optimum' setup, and work from there. Also, any suggestions for specific dimmers or (more importantly) types of lanterns to use, and any need for pairing/patching? Any help much appreciated,scary<{POST_SNAPBACK}> You say you’re thinking of using stand Racked dimmers, are you thinking hard wired or sockets? I like to be able to patch dimmer channels so I would suggest using dimmers with sockets and the bars terminating in a patch next to them. I favor zero88 beta packs because there very versatile but then yours would be a fixed install so I guess some of that flexibility would be wasted. Pat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vinny baby Posted January 31, 2005 Share Posted January 31, 2005 Dance has to be lit from every possible angle, so I would go with what Jive says, and have as many points of light as possible, what about some MR16 batterns that you could place on the floor, it would also help to define the performance area vince Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gareth Posted January 31, 2005 Share Posted January 31, 2005 Moving Heads ;)Why? The OP gives an overall dimension of 20m x 8m for the space, of which perhaps about 2/3 will be audience seating so that's quite a small performance area. No indication of the grid height (and therefore lantern throw) is given, nor any clue as to availability of power or budget. And yet you steam in with "Moving Heads!!" as though a few moving lights are some sort of panacea, without giving consideration to all sorts of other, more fundamental factors. When your company advertises themselves as consultants (as they clearly did on that wonderful website! ;)), is that the sort of advice that you give? ;) Re. the original question - as I've said above, some indication of grid height and power availability is always really useful when suggesting possible solutions to situations like this. Is the space going to be flexible (i.e. used end-on, in-the-round, and various other configurations) or is it going to be pretty much fixed-format? Of the 20m x 8m space, how much of that is going to be actual performance space? With spaces like this, it can be a mistake to go overboard with the parcans - they're useful, but perhaps not as universally useful as you might think. Lots of decent fresnels is probably the key (mixture of 650w and 1200w perhaps, depending on the throw distances involved), with a good assortment of zoom profiles (SLs would be good, perhaps - zoom optics without being stupidly large or heavy). A dozen or so parcans would certainly be useful, but depending on budgetary and power restrictions it may not be wise to go parcan-crazy at the epxense of other lanterns. Assuming a primarily end-on format, plenty of overhead bars over the performance area, with a couple of bars FOH - all IWBs, perhaps 12 ways on each, and might be best to make them fairly easy to move around. Of course, if the room is intended to be an adaptable sort of space, which can change format from show to show, then you'd need to go for a fairly even spread of circuits throughout the room, perhaps on a grid with bars running left-right and front-back at something like 1m centres. Side bars are always good for this kind of space - and make allowances in your budget for some dance booms as well (half a dozen at a minimum, I'd say). HTH. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
londonjim Posted January 31, 2005 Share Posted January 31, 2005 Point taken; I have used moving heads in that sort of space (admittadly they were these little cheap Acme things) - they were not real problem. Maybe a bit of a silly comment............... If I were you, I would have parcans on T bars either side with split gels of purple and orange - and any other colours you feel fit the mood as it were. Depending on the dance, its always a good idea to have a straw, red and blue wash - even if its just in case. When I light dance excluding larger dance where I use movers; I use a blue/red/ wash, and add in the split gels - and have Codas with colour correction in behind. Is this a better idea? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sam.henderson Posted January 31, 2005 Share Posted January 31, 2005 Hiya, I have a few points to make however I think if you want even more helpful replies some more information could be useful for example exact dimensions, grid height, power etc. etc. IWBs are always very helpful (as mentioned earlier), have been rigging in a small venue recently and there is no multicore, no IWBS and all the patch panels are stage left or stage right against the walls of the wing, its imposable to get in there with the tower because of the drapes and other factors so you have to get a ladder out to plug the lanterns in and run loads of cable etc. etc.- Think you get the idea, its a nightmare!! For amature dance shows the plotting and rigging time is often very little especially if you have got lots of groups to get through so scrollers can be helpful, as horrible as some people think they are (i.e. scrolls coming off, noisy etc. etc.) they are useful when you have got a lot of groups to do and save on the number of lanterns you have to rig. In regards to the par cans make I would get, if budget allows, a few different types of lamp for them so you can create narrow beams and create a sort of ACL type look (look at Stu's recent post in Show your Show) as well as wide ones. RE Dimmers don't forget that Zero88 do a good range of dimmers called the Chilis. Less expensive than Strand and good quality. Don't forget when you get asked for a rough cost to include cable, it adds up and it is annoying when you go to venues and they either have very poor quality cable, not enough etc. etc. HTH Sam Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomLyall Posted January 31, 2005 Share Posted January 31, 2005 Well, in my opinion, I would suggest spending more of your budget on installing things such as rigging points, some decent power outlets, installed dimmers and patching, etc. As well as a good stock of lanterns. Again, its just my opinion, but money spent unnecessarily on expensive moving heads is money that could have been better spent on a better infrastructure, and supported with hired equipment. Don't forget as well, that by hiring things like moving heads you have access to a wider range of lights (ie: not being stuck with what you've got), and you'll save on maintaince costs, including relamping (which is bloody expensive). Tom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
londonjim Posted January 31, 2005 Share Posted January 31, 2005 Thats some good advise, but............ I did a panto this year/last year - and I found that one mover (a Mac500) did the work of 15 Source 4s. Source 4s each would of been £12 each for a week £180 the mac cost me £160ish a week. But thats just my expereince. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sam.henderson Posted January 31, 2005 Share Posted January 31, 2005 If you are paying £160 quid for a Mac 500 your getting ripped off!! Even from Stage LX you can get one for £100 and they are not the cheapest supplier!! http://www.blue-room.org.uk/index.php?showtopic=335&hl= have a look at that thread, different scale and circumstances but some of it may still be relevent to you. There are also various other threads like that, that are more lighting specific if you have a search. Sam Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gareth Posted January 31, 2005 Share Posted January 31, 2005 If you are paying £160 quid for a Mac 500 your getting ripped off!!Abso-flipping-lutely! Someone really saw you coming, Jim! ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
londonjim Posted January 31, 2005 Share Posted January 31, 2005 ok, thats good to know! The Mac500 costed £80 a day; and this company has a two day week - so £160. Hmmmm, something that needs looking at no doupt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomLyall Posted January 31, 2005 Share Posted January 31, 2005 Sams right, you really were getting ripped off at £160! Anyway, you may be quite right, and that a moving light may be better than loads of generics in some cercumstances, but (in my opinion at least) that would be another advantage for hiring, you can choose what you want for each job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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