New venue

[Bobbsy]

I'm not an architect and have no axe to grind on their behalf. I can only say that pretty well all the examples of things going wrong noted above are the fault of the client, not the architect. Building a new theatre (or heavily renovating an old one) is a massive undertaking--and the only people who understand what's needed are the people who work there. To not tell the architect--in detail--what's needed then blaming him when things aren't right is an inaccurate exercise in finger pointing.

 

I think a major part of the problem is that theatres are almost always the property of either local authorities or educational institutions. Both of these always seem to me to put bureaucracy above function. It seems all too rare that the people who will use the facility are involved by the men in suits in County Hall (or City Hall or University Admin or whatever). None of this is the fault of the architect though--unless you consider it their job to say "nah, I'm not doing this--you're not telling me enough".

 

I'll admit that I've been lucky in the past to work for and with companies that knew the importance of getting it right. For the biggest job the company actually gave me an assistant to take on my day to day stuff for almost 18 months so I could work pretty much full time on the move. They also let me allocate two senior engineers to the project (released by freelance infill). Finally, they also appointed somebody else to oversee the non technical parts of the job (offices etc.). We, working as a team were deeply involved right from the start, including the selection of the architect and the main contractor. It'll sound like bragging but we finished 2 weeks early and right on budget over an 18 month schedule.

 

Lastly, I'll say that the architect was worth his weight in gold. He'd take our raw spec and turn it into a building that also looked good with ideas that we'd never have thought of.

[MarkPAman]

I started working there when a build was almost finished, but...

 

"The walls look nice with just the wooden panels, we don't need the tab track or tabs as well..." The architect had specced them, but they were a cost that could be cut. At least I fixed that one after only a couple of years fighting.

 

More worrying perhaps, was the assumption that reducing the room width by 10% at a late point during the planning stage, would only reduce the seating capacity by 10%. Fire exits and doorways do not just reduce by 10%, nor could we manage with 10% off the performance area (which was really too small to start with) so the effectively the front row of seats had to go too. Thus the number of seats is actually down by about 30% from the original design spec.

[ClaireL]

As a tech SM curently touring on small/mid scale opera, my ideal venue would have the following (I know, or guess, that some of these are impossible, impractical, or unecessary for 90% of shows that any theatre might have performing. They're just what I'd like, on this tour :-) ).

 

Level access direct to stage from lorry height.

A scene dock where we can store flightcases etc, that isn't full of half-built panto scenery

A short walk to stage from the lorry

A flat, black, unraked stage, that actually is flat, and that we can screw stuff into

A pit on a hydraulic lift that is large enought to fit an 11-piece orchestra including percussion, and that can be parked at any specified height, including stage, auditorium, and lower levels. If it can be only parked at the bottom level which is so deep that the conductor is on a 3' rostrum, this is less than ideal.

13amp and dimmed circuit outlets in the pit

Up/down wing masking on tab tracks, with blacks in sections, not one full piece

Lots of hard and soft masking available

Wings that are minimum 3m wider each side than the prosc.

Blues all around the stage, that are switchable in banks, eg SL/US/SR

Good working light in all areas, that isn't a couple of floods rigged on an LX bar, so you lose your workers when you drop the bar to rig on it

C/W or proper powered bars, and plenty of them. No hand or drill winches, thank you

Hard power, dimmer circuits and DMX outlets all around the stage, at floor level as well as fly floor

A prompt desk that is large enough to put an opera score, a notebook, pencil case and a bottle of water.

A stage view screen for the DSM that is large than 4x5" and doesn't go white/blobby in anything brighter than working light.

Working wireless cans

Backstage show relay and calls (that preferably doesn't go "bing bong" when you press the 'talk' button)

Lots of dressing rooms on the same level as the stage, or with lift access if not possible.

Natural light and plenty of 13amp sockets in dressing rooms

A laundry room next to the dressing rooms, with 2x industrial washers and 2x industrial dryers (or higher spec domestic machines with a quick wash programme), a sink for hand wash, and somewhere to hang drip-dry handwash. A separate washer and dryer elsewhere for FOH/cleaning staff, so you don't have to wait till the bar laundry has finished before you can do your show washing.

A green room with sofas, table for eating food, fridge, microwave

[gareth]

Good post, Claire! So many of the things in your list are items which many would consider essential, but which are lacking in lots of touring venues (smaller ones in particular).

[top-cat]

I like a lady who knows exactly what she wants http://www.blue-room.org.uk/public/style_emoticons/default/smile.gif

 

A pit on a hydraulic lift

 

 

Out of interest is there any reason you have specified it should be a hydraulic lift - as opposed to the other options for driving pit lifts there are out there?

[david.elsbury]

Seriously?

[top-cat]

Seriously?

 

yes?

 

there are pros and cons of each. that's why different ones exist. genuinely interested if there is a reason hydraulics are preferred by SMs.

[andy_s]

Seriously?

 

yes?

 

there are pros and cons of each. that's why different ones exist. genuinely interested if there is a reason hydraulics are preferred by SMs.

 

my guess is that most touring SMs don't give a flying **** about the engineering practicalities of the pit lifting mechanism so long as it works by pressing a button* as opposed to having loads of blokes in hard hats spending 4 hours juggling bits of decking and adjustable legs or lengths of scaff tube

 

So I imagine "hydraulic" in this example is being used as a generic term similar to "hoover", which I dare say is used to refer to a dyson on occasion...

 

*or possibly 2 buttons simultaneously

[top-cat]

Seriously?

 

yes?

 

there are pros and cons of each. that's why different ones exist. genuinely interested if there is a reason hydraulics are preferred by SMs.

 

my guess is that most touring SMs don't give a flying **** about the engineering practicalities of the pit lifting mechanism so long as it works by pressing a button* as opposed to having loads of blokes in hard hats spending 4 hours juggling bits of decking and adjustable legs or lengths of scaff tube

 

So I imagine "hydraulic" in this example is being used as a generic term similar to "hoover", which I dare say is used to refer to a dyson on occasion...

 

*or possibly 2 buttons simultaneously

 

My guess is the same... but I don't think it's about "hydraulic" being like "hoover".... you don't refer to it as "the hydraulic" do you, you refer to it as "the pit lift".

 

I would say referring to fire curtains as irons is more like calling vacuum cleaners hoovers.

 

So the question still stands if she comes back, I appreciate when she said hydraulic she may and probably did just mean one that moves.

[andy_s]

I really don't want to enter into a long debate about an essentially trivial point, but I have certainly come across the use of the term "hydraulic" used in a non-specific sense by people with no need for specialist knowledge to mean something that moves by mechanical means.

 

my point really was that our contributor was more interested in specifying the function than the means of achieving it, and in my view it's fairly clear that no preference for hydraulic compared for instance to a rack and pinion or a spiralift type mechanism is implied. To go into specifics of this nature is probably off topic, whereas Claire's wishlist is completely on-topic.

[top-cat]

To go into specifics of this nature is probably off topic, whereas Claire's wishlist is completely on-topic.

 

It's not off topic per se, in fact there are options available and if the new venue in question were to consider moving platforms (which they definitely should) then they might like to consider how the movement is achieved.

 

 

 

I don't know why you've taken such offence to this, it was a simple question aimed at somebody else and they're still at will to say "no preference", no idea why you feel you have to do it on their behalf.

[Seano]

FFS David, she's a stage manager. Of course she doesn't give two hoots whether it's actually hydraulic or not, as long as it can be moved reasonably quickly and efficiently with a load on it and parked at any height. Still, thank goodness you were here to derail the thread with nit-picking trivia, or we might all have forgotten for a moment that this is the blue-room.

[andy_s]

FFS David, she's a stage manager. Of course she doesn't give two hoots whether it's actually hydraulic or not, as long as it can be moved reasonably quickly and efficiently with a load on it and parked at any height. Still, thank goodness you were here to derail the thread with nit-picking trivia, or we might all have forgotten for a moment that this is the blue-room.

 

erm, what he said.

I'm loathe to go into further debate as the thread is an interesting one when it stays on topic.

[ImagineerTom]

I'll add an important one to that list that gets too often overlooked....

 

An office, backstage, for the visiting company manager / production manager / tour manager / production staff to use. Yes you can sort-of-make-do using one of the dressing rooms but it's far from ideal. I'd trade a tiny pokey office with a couple of proper desks & chairs, decent net connection & a direct dial telephone line over a 1000 sqr ft dressing room with stacking chairs, make-up tables and having to stand on one leg in the corner of the room because that's the only place a wifi / cellular signal actually gets in. It also needs to be "our" room, not one shared with venue staff or with paper-thin walls so that we can talk without worrying about overhearing or being overheard.

[chelgrian]

There is one point here. Most mechanisms that you might install for moving a stage are quite noisy. Having had a company once which wanted to move such a piece of staging during a show and having to come up with the world's most over engineered thunderstorm sound effect to cover it there is the question of if any staging moves reasonably silently or not.

 

A stage view screen for the DSM that is large than 4x5" and doesn't go white/blobby in anything brighter than working light.

 

I've yet to come up with a good solution for this. Our current stage relay camera is a moderately expensive model with auto iris designed as a day/night security camera. However it still whites out under the dynamic range presented by theatre lights.

 

Does anyone have any recommendations for cameras which they know can cope the range of conditions that theatre presents?