thefatcyclist Posted September 23, 2012 Share Posted September 23, 2012 Hi,I'm new to the forum and till a week ago I knew next to nothing about lighting. I now know slightly more than next to nothing.The project I have in mind is for my son. He is going to go out with a solo Pink Floyd tribute show.! Just him and a stack of backing tracks which we have put together ourselves etc.We have the PA, and his own equipment, so obviously this show needs lighting. And it needs to be compact because this will definately for pubs and very small clubs. The basic plan is to use video projection, ambient and fixed lighting, and a light show. The project is as much for me as for my son, as I am wanting to learn a new skill, and this seems a good but challenging oppurtunity.I have many years of experience with music sequencers and therefore understand some of the terminology. I have done a bit of lurking here and on other forums, and I am sure I will receive calls to search the forum for many more tips, I'm not new to forums (** laughs out loud **). Anyhoo.I need software. We want the lighting to be totally run from the computer, no tap dancing on pedals, no lighting tech. I quickly came across DMXIS/Show Buddy, to be run standalone, not from within Cubase. Picked because I can load up tracks and sequence the lights, and it has a familiar feel. I now have looked at DASLIGHT, and Light Jockey, any comments on the others?I will need to work in previsualisation software, and can't get on with Capture, any suggestions. The rest of my questions will come out as we go along. Last point, is this feasible in a small space, and how to avoid cheesiness? Ta Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbuckley Posted September 23, 2012 Share Posted September 23, 2012 Can be done. I'd start by having a look at ShowMagic (linky), as it can do all of sound playback for your backing tracks, video, and is a decent lighting control tool, and I believe it all syncronised together, but I have no practical experience of this tool. Don't expect to pick it up in five minutes. After that it all gets a little harder, as you wont get everything in one package, so you then have to understand about the syncronisation methods to hold your audio playback and other entertainment technologies in sync. Syncronisation, one of my favorite areas of entertainment technologies... E2A - another all-in-one has popped up - VenueMagic (linky) E2A - know very little about visualisation, so cant help there! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thefatcyclist Posted September 23, 2012 Author Share Posted September 23, 2012 Can be done. I'd start by having a look at ShowMagic (linky), as it can do all of sound playback for your backing tracks, video, and is a decent lighting control tool, and I believe it all syncronised together, but I have no practical experience of this tool. Don't expect to pick it up in five minutes. After that it all gets a little harder, as you wont get everything in one package, so you then have to understand about the syncronisation methods to hold your audio playback and other entertainment technologies in sync. Syncronisation, one of my favorite areas of entertainment technologies... Hi and hello, thanks for the link,I got excited but £2K for AV plus interface is a wee bit on the high side. As for syncronisation, well that is what I was thinking about Show Buddy, a bit like adding samples to a sequence. Hopefully smpte, click tracks etc were all taken care of when we recorded the backing tracks. My main worry is latency, but I believe you can buy a DMX pludgin called DMX forall in a similar vein to ASIO forall. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbuckley Posted September 23, 2012 Share Posted September 23, 2012 Perhaps you might like to have a quick look at this recent thread, which has comments from the author of DMXIS, a product of which I know, well, zero. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thefatcyclist Posted September 23, 2012 Author Share Posted September 23, 2012 Perhaps you might like to have a quick look at this recent thread, which has comments from the author of DMXIS, a product of which I know, well, zero.Very interesting thread. I've already had contact briefly with Mr Brown and as I live 40 miles away, I hope to build up a dialogue. One thing I learned very quickly is that in this game, there are lots of badged product coming from the same outlet, and prices vary hugely. If I buy intelligent lights tho' I am sure I will be able to get away with 15 or 30 Watts, low mWatt lasers etc.With regard to automated vs busked shows, well apart from myself doing the programming and the, roadying, financing!!(dad can I get......) There is no money for a lighting person, we are going to be looking at £150ish a gig, that is why my son is out on his own not with a full tribute band or even bass and drummer. In East central Scotland gigs are drying up nobody can affor £500 for a band. Due to the backing track basis, there is not real flexibilty for the performance apart from varying guitar solos within the same time frame, so it will be a reasonable combination. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard CSL Posted September 24, 2012 Share Posted September 24, 2012 I have done a very large Pink Floyd tribute here on the island, and I used Daslight, much to the suprise of Daslight themselves. I find Daslight to be a superb tool,(not perfect) but for what you are trying to do it is ideal. Unlike it's expensive cousins it comes with full 3d visualisation for free. all the software is free I suggest you download and give it a go. Daslight has a very fast intuitive learning curve, the videos and the manual are written in logical english, and on a laptop over most other more expensive programs, you can use sound activation , and there is a timing function, you can also trigger the start of your backing tracks (on the same laptop) which means with a stop watch you can actually create an auto timeline function. Explained in the linky thread. http://www.daslight....opic.php?t=1227 I would steer clear of midi as there are some current bugs in the software which can cause frustration. The forum is really helpful and worth a read also there are many there that can help. As for the lighting itself definately 2 tee stands and some 30 led watt movers, maybe an aluminium circle hanging from a stand with the movers on it and a screen for the projection.. also just 4 led par 56 cans to illuminate your son. a haze machine set to perm on. low output. A chinese laser or 2. your biggest problem is going to be getting the pubs to dim the lights enough to make the show effective, so maybe worth considering some led bars to illuminate the pub, ie floor to ceiling washers that you can place in the room so the pub can turn all the lights off where your son is.This show was done with daslight. just to give you some ideas. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n3oca1tIJ5Yhttp ://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KqQR6XPg99o&feature=related This show was done with 12 cheap soundlab scanners and 8 moving heads, and 10 led 56 cans. remember scanners are lighter than movers and if they are only facing forward they do 180 side to side and 90 up and down. Ideal keep us posted of your progress Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greenalien Posted September 24, 2012 Share Posted September 24, 2012 For a very good video / media server, check out Screen Monkey - http://www.screenmonkey.co.uk/DNN/default.aspx - it's very capable, can handle both audio and video, and is free to download. If you want to control it from a lighting desk, you'll have to spend a little for the Pro licence, but even that is very reasonable £145.For lighting control, I'd recommend Chamsys MagicQ - it's very popular on this forum, and once again the software is free to download - you can get basic DMX use from it for just £10 with their Magic Dongle, although it's worth investing in their Mini-Wing if you want better control of cue launching. MagicQ will link to Screen Monkey, so you can call up video, music and still photos just like selecting lights. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard CSL Posted September 24, 2012 Share Posted September 24, 2012 For a very good video / media server, check out Screen Monkey - http://www.screenmon...NN/default.aspx - it's very capable, can handle both audio and video, and is free to download. If you want to control it from a lighting desk, you'll have to spend a little for the Pro licence, but even that is very reasonable £145.For lighting control, I'd recommend Chamsys MagicQ - it's very popular on this forum, and once again the software is free to download - you can get basic DMX use from it for just £10 with their Magic Dongle, although it's worth investing in their Mini-Wing if you want better control of cue launching. MagicQ will link to Screen Monkey, so you can call up video, music and still photos just like selecting lights. the OP asked for a visualiser and stated he could not get on with capture.Magic Q is superb software, but learning curve may well be a problem, no audio triggering without buying audio interface, no midi triggering without buying midi interface. Daslight one interface one laptop , job done. I thought compact and simple was the order of the day? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulears Posted September 24, 2012 Share Posted September 24, 2012 I'll leave the software element to others, and look at the lighting. The biggest hurdle is simple scale. Floyd and David Gilmour are big on spectacle, but when you break it down to me it's simple components, so your idea of a video screen for background and compact lighting makes sense. In pubs, the real issue is likely to be lack of proper blackout and the small footprint you have to work in, so I'd also suggest that where the screen isn't, it should be black. You could even do a Gilmour and get him to wear black. Then you can have silhouette against the screen, and concentrate on face light and bare arms. I've been impressed with cheap LED bars I bought from Thomann two years ago and their narrow beam angle would make one top, one bottom, and the two sides on some kind of frame useful to light him, but not the screen. Maybe some MR16s to light the face, possibly on short standoffs to get them out just a bit. My change of heart on sequencer controlled light shows means I'd strongly suggest using the sequencer for lighting control if your setup is small and compact - every song would be the same, every time. For the audience you can add some LED movers and blinders, and still run off a 13A plug! You could even be crafty if you have a specific set, and incorporate video. You could shoot him playing some of the solos, close up, and then have these on screen, as if live? Lots of clever stuff like this can be done. How about a fake lipstick camera on the headstock for those look down the strings shots (against a black background) and then these too can be played in as if live. The only thing I can thing of that's negative is simply that a one man pink floyd can be pretty dull. I'm a bit of a fan, but as a band, they stand still, or sit, so just one bloke will be a bit dull - so you need the video and lights to be interesting - so the more you can throw in the better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard CSL Posted September 24, 2012 Share Posted September 24, 2012 Just a starter idea have a look at these selections.http://www.thomann.de/gb/basket.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peza2010 Posted September 24, 2012 Share Posted September 24, 2012 Just a starter idea have a look at these selections.http://www.thomann.de/gb/basket.html That wont work for anyone else other than you unfortunatly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thefatcyclist Posted September 24, 2012 Author Share Posted September 24, 2012 Hi,Thanks for the enthusiastic responses. I knew I'd picked the right forum!! You have all caught the essence of the project and the possible pitfalls, scale being not the least of them, and projecting avoiding the pool rules and pictures of football teams, and the only way to the gents being past the lasersetc.Thanks also for the fixture suggestions. We hope to vary the show by using some songs with just projections, some with just lights, a couple or three big productions. There is also scope within our backing tracks to add a bass player, drummer etc every now and them by deleting tracks. One of our main considerations is whether to back or front project the vids.. We are going to "adapt" a small trampoline replacing the bouncy bit with screen material. It would be good to rig round it with mini spots and use it for blinding as an extra, but that may be a later addition. One other opinion that would be useful is to whether there is too much vibration from the pa speaker stands to make them dual use for rigging the LED Pars as well either vertically or on some kind of T. Lasers... can't do this without them, what power will I get away with if I project the air ones towards the audience without a health and safety risk?CheersJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldradiohand Posted September 24, 2012 Share Posted September 24, 2012 My fave Pink Floyd tribute band http://www.aussiefloyd.com/en/ there's some good videos that might give you some ideas about what you're trying to do on a smaller scale. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david.elsbury Posted September 25, 2012 Share Posted September 25, 2012 For lasers to be effective you need something in the air for the beam to be visible - smoke or haze machine. Is that something you'd factored in? Also some venues may not allow smoke/haze due to their fire alarm systems... David Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thefatcyclist Posted September 25, 2012 Author Share Posted September 25, 2012 Yes factored in a hazer, and have researched the proper thing and not a fazer. A must for this stuff. I know at least 3 of the potential venues allow smoke, as my son ha played in them previously. One of the down sides of the smoking ban :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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