numberwrong Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 I have a problem. I am envolved with a festival that needs a huge about of things lit (all outdoors), all the lighting has to be coloured and there is a tiny budget. I posted before about putting gels on 500w halogen floods here - I tested the wooden frames and they oozed sap after a few hours, and were not at all acceptable due to the fire risk. I have been told that standard PARs and Codas will be ok outdoors as the heat will evaporate any rain. I am concerned that as the lighting will be off during the day, if it rains and then they are switched on it may cause problems with electrics (and I wont be popular) Any one had experience with the wet outdoors and non exterior lanterns??? any suggestions for a solution welcome! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonyMitchell Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 any suggestions for a solution welcome! Respectfully decline to quote for the job. Kit used outside must be suitably IP rated. "huge amount of" for "tiny budget" work about as well together as your water and electricity will. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxjones2000 Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 Sounds daft, but why not stick to tools that are made for the job (500w exterior floods), and attach gel onto them using Black-wrap? I've done this many times (granted onto the front of Patt 23's!), but I'm sure there's no real problem with this as long as the floods are made for outdoor use. It would be best for someone on here to confirm it first, as I've never done anything outside so this could be a complete widow-maker! http://www.blue-room.org.uk/public/style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
numberwrong Posted March 27, 2012 Author Share Posted March 27, 2012 I am not going to turn down the job, I've been involved with the event for a number of years. Using generics outdoors was suggested to me by a reputable lighting company that are potentially going to supply the kit. I didn't like the idea, I just wanted to see what the community thought and if anyone could offer a solution to this problem. The budget is not actually that small but when you consider the cost of hiring exterior CMY or RGB fixtures at £30+ each and times that by 150 the budget looks tiny. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
themadhippy Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 max as youve never done it you wont be aware gel attached to the front of a 500w flood tends to melt quicker than a crew moves at last orders and did you miss the bit in the op I posted before about putting gels on 500w halogen floods here - Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
numberwrong Posted March 27, 2012 Author Share Posted March 27, 2012 I have experimented with halogen floods, the main problem is that they get dam hot and the gel really needs to be a good 4" from the glass without almost catching fire! they need to be on for 8hrs a day for 4 days so anything to save the gel (if going down that route) will help. I want to maybe try and get a metel work shop to fabricate some kind of adaptor that will accept a gel frame but this will again be expensive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulears Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 The Minack in Cornwall, have been using non-IP lighting equipment for years.http://www.minack.com/company/Topofgully.JPGThey are very helpful people, and a phone call could link you up with somebody who can explain some of their precautions - which generally seems to be the connector type. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gordontech Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 Indeed, or if you ask whever is in the scoop in london at the moment. Last time I was called out to there they have a good few VL1k's outdoors, all fine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxjones2000 Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 max as youve never done it you wont be aware gel attached to the front of a 500w flood tends to melt quicker than a crew moves at last orders and did you miss the bit in the op I posted before about putting gels on 500w halogen floods here - Oh, I hadn't thought of that.... You mean quicker than the crew can get down spoons and order a breakfast at 10.59am?! http://www.blue-room.org.uk/public/style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif (God, haven't done that in ages..) Sorry, I didn't see that bit in the OP - my apologies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr_towers Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 Agreed. Biggest issue here will be the electrical installation and safety of such. Up here the tattoo has many many PARs on 16a outside for the entirety of August (and a good bit of July/September too) without too many issues. And the VL5s which have been doing it for years as well. So yeah - very feasible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J Pearce Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 Another trick is son lamps, very effective for architectural lighting. Stocked by most hire cos, including my two regulars; Drax in Dunstable and Impact in MK.I've heard good things about painting the glass of cheap floods with metallic paint, but I'd experiment before using them on a gig! PARs are generally fine in an uplight position as the ceramic and its connections are shielded by the lamp. 16A connectors are advised. Codas may be more problematic, I suspect the R7S lamp base would arc if wet, mine at work arc in the dry... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
numberwrong Posted March 27, 2012 Author Share Posted March 27, 2012 Another trick is son lamps These are MBIs right? so far I've been quoted £20 per unit for 400w/150w MBIs which are still a little pricey for the quantity I need. I still have about 30xMBIs in the spec I just need something PAR Can price to make that budget stretch! So far there seems to be good evidence that PARs will work outside but I really need floods as well... I will experiment with glass paint and report back although I'm pretty sure the glass in halogen floods aren't that easily removed for replacement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J Pearce Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 Don't forget to account for power. 30 PARs all on full is going to be a lot of heavy cabling. 30 son lamps will be easier and quicker to cable in and the cable will cost less. If you are paying for generator diesel you will notice the difference! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
numberwrong Posted March 27, 2012 Author Share Posted March 27, 2012 Don't forget to account for power I was planning on using CP88 (500w) lamps in any PARs to keep power down. There will be loads of power avalable on site, the festival will host 20,000 people this year.Good point though, I haven't thought of angling for more budget based on lower fuel costs. Isn't it something like 1kwh = 1 ltr of Diesel (very roughly) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GridGirl Posted March 28, 2012 Share Posted March 28, 2012 How many units are we talking about? Is it feasible to go round after the show has finished and the units have cooled, and chuck a rubbish bag over each unit to prevent rain getting in? As an aside, I managed to set off a sprinkler with a Selecon Pacific (don't ask), and when my lighting op came in the next day he told me to switch the unit back on to dry it out - yes they're mostly plastic, and the lamp had blown (it was on when the sprinkler went off) but we re-lamped, switched it on and it was none the worse. And it hadn't just had a few spots of rain, it had had a deluge! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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