Software

[mumbles]

I think the only thing we can take from all the above, is both solutions will do a job. PCStage may well be easier if you aren't familiar with MSC and programming larger scale controllers (though I'm not convinced given the information available on lowernab's website), and is a (slightly) cheaper option, but there is no denying that it is considerably more limited - you may not need features beyond PCStage, but should you do then you are scuppered.

 

I also can't see that either I'll convince Gerry and dbuckley why I feel option b is better, or that they'll manage to convince me that the same is true of option a...and as such there's little point continuing.

But, and this is a big thing that really gets at me, when professional choice tools are available at a very affordable price point, why would you choose something else.

 

"Professional" is an attribute of me and my skills and attuitude I bring to the job. The tools themselves aren't professional (or otherwise), they're just tools. Especially when the tools are software. If the right answer for what I did was SFX, then thats what I'd have. I choose the tools I use very carefully.

Though I will say I disagree here. I agree that the tools themselves aren't professional, as I originally said they are the choice of professionals (maybe it should read the choice of 'those with budgets to spec their ideal choice of equipment'). And I stand by my feeling that if there was a more appropriate solution, then it would have made its way into this environment. I will concede that, as you mentioned, these tools are more complicated to program, but given that, for the 2 we are centreing around, very good online tutorials and guides are readily available, if you are already able to use PCStage I would expect you to pick up with a little time and effort. And further, I would expect a new user to pick them up much much quicker than PCStage based on the woeful information provided, and as such still stand by my original gripe.

 

M

[dbuckley]

I think the only thing we can take from all the above, is both solutions will do a job.

Yep. They're just tools.

 

PCStage may well be easier if you aren't familiar with MSC...

Thats actually the only thing I'd argue with you about; if you're "familiar" with MSC then PCStage is a great MSC controller. Thats my fault, really. PCStage is a great MSC controller because I understand show control, and worked with the author to get the show control protocols added to PCStage. Call me biased, sure, but I'm not without knowledge in this area.

 

But, since I've got a professional on the line, I can ask some real questions. You've got your lighting console, and your Mac with QLab, what else do you connect into there? What do you do to go beyond merely making the two play together? What external hardware and human interfacing do you use?

[maxjones2000]

Just to throw another spanner in the works, what about SCS Platinum? As far as I can remember, it's around £200. It can cue sound, DMX, and midi as far as I'm aware. I've only played with the standard version for sound cues, and I really like it - it's very powerful, and I'd imagine it's pretty good for DMX too (assuming it uses the same UI and format for cueing DMX).

 

Just my 2p worth... http://www.blue-room.org.uk/public/style_emoticons/default/smile.gif

[dbuckley]

But, since I've got a professional on the line, I can ask some real questions. You've got your lighting console, and your Mac with QLab, what else do you connect into there? What do you do to go beyond merely making the two play together? What external hardware and human interfacing do you use?

 

I suppose it's rude of me to demand you show me yours without showing you mine :) So an example is called for.

 

My show before last was an intimate affair in a 50 seat venue, that had a narrator / guitarist / preshow and interval entertainer on a podium in front of the main stage. The rest of the band (keytar and electronic kit) were on stage as they only played in the show.

 

The guitarist is not unfamiliar with stage technology, so essentially she ran her own part of the show.

 

http://davidbuckley.name/pix/pcs_tssctl.jpg

 

For pre-show, when she was ready, she hit her go button, which killed off the canned music, enabled her lighting, recalled the mixer scene, and put her mic on. She then had a local mic control cough switch arrangemet. There's red and green cue lights for the normal reasons, and a tally light for mic muted state. Obviously she only had control at the moments when she should have, that Go button wasn't live except when it should be!

 

This was all implemented in a cuelist in PCStage, just three lines and a trigger filter.

 

My world for that show:

 

http://davidbuckley.name/pix/pcs_pp.jpg

 

Edited for speeling and content

[mumbles]

PCStage may well be easier if you aren't familiar with MSC...

Thats actually the only thing I'd argue with you about; if you're "familiar" with MSC then PCStage is a great MSC controller. Thats my fault, really. PCStage is a great MSC controller because I understand show control, and worked with the author to get the show control protocols added to PCStage. Call me biased, sure, but I'm not without knowledge in this area.

Now, that's not really a fair argument as I never said MSC wasn't implemented into PCStage, purely that integrating two separate systems with MSC would require at least a working knowledge of MSC, whereas using PCStage alone would not.

 

But, since I've got a professional on the line, I can ask some real questions. You've got your lighting console, and your Mac with QLab, what else do you connect into there? What do you do to go beyond merely making the two play together? What external hardware and human interfacing do you use?

For the most part we don't go beyond simply connecting sound, video and LX desks, with MSC commands (or in a few cases MidiNotes) programmed in to trigger each other as required. Am sure some shows have gotten involved in the kind of human interfacing that you have, but not ones I've been involved in - but as you've said earlier on with larger budgets and greater staffing we are rarely in a position where we would want to. I could imagine that this could be more useful in maybe modern dance, or live music, but for me currently midi is a simple and effective way of triggering cues across different control systems.

 

M

[dcsuk]

Just to throw another Software into the thoughts here - all be it a slightly biased opinion on it.

 

Have a look at Venue Magic Show Control - If you are only looking at controlling Lighting and Audio cues then Venue Magic Classic will be fine and costs£299 for the retail version (includes DMX dongle, cable and cd) here in the UK and is distributed by Advanced Event Designs - www.venuemagic.co.uk - the next version up DMX+AV adds a controllable video timeline to the equasion as well,

 

It's playlist/Cue List feature will let you mix lighting and sound cues in one list to be fired off by one operator during the show,

 

It's slightly different to most lighting softwares in that it is timeline based for DMX programming so if you are used to audio editing or video editing it uses the same principles for DMX editing/programming. Those timelines can then be saved and added into the playlist/cue list for running during the show.

 

It's also fully midi compatible fo all those who need physical faders and buttons for lighting control :)

 

I've used it on a couple of small theatrical tours and shows now and it's never let me down.

[dbuckley]

Show magic is the tool I reccommend to people who like what PCStage does but need "more", either more video feeds (PCStage only does one) or better movers support. I'm glad ShowMagic works for you, I've had one person report horrible experiences of it in terms of reliability, but generally, if show software is unreliable on a PC its cos the PC is stuffed full of junk.

[alistermorton]

I have never, yet, worked with an amateur theatre where a SM calls the cues.

 

Come to ours :-)

 

We use SFX 6.0 for the sound, and a strand 300 connected to it by midi. The lighting cues are set up on SFX in line with the sound cues, and complex sequences of sound and light cues with fixed delays an waits can be set up. SFX sends the control by midi to the strand desk. We can send commands over the network to another computer running a power point presentation so that the sound computer can also change "slides" for projection during the show. This means that most shows can, if needed, be single opped (although the current show doesn't lend itself too well to that so we have separate sound and light operators) with the SM calling the cues with the occasional "this is a visual, your cue" thrown in for good measure, usually when the SM can't see the action either directly or via the CCTV.

[dbuckley]

Going for a slight topic swerve...

 

Sounds a dreadful way to do things unless your first names Walt...

 

Why?

 

Walt (and his successors, and the other Florida and Hollywood based theme parks, especially Universal) employed (and continue to employ) show technical people, just like us, who worked hard at solving issues around reliability and safety of shows that run multiple times a day, seven days a week, with multiple casts, and with lots of variables. They came up with (and continue to come up with) some clever stuff. Most of which is seldom seen outside of theme parks. I'm assuming (but you know assumption - ASS U ME) that this is because theatre techs and theme park techs live in different universes. Seems odd to me.

 

As I've said for many years: anyone who has any interest in entertainment technology needs to get over to Florida and tour the parks.

[J Pearce]

Any standard workplace time management software ought to do.

Microsoft Project used to be popular but I'm not sure what became of it as I haven't heard of it recently.

[stratman57]

Sorry to resurrect an oldish thread, but this one came up while I was searching for ways to get MultiPlay to communicate with MagicQ PC. I use MultiPlay for all sound effects and music cues for the show I'm involved in, and have tried linking to my basic lighting desk (Soundlabs Scenesetter) using MIDI. Unfortunately the response to the MIDI messages is too erratic to be useable.

 

After further research, I found a handy little app, AutoHotKey, available at http://www.autohotkey.com, that allows me to send the GO command from Multiplay to MagicQ and step through the cuestack. It works by allowing me to create a script, which can be compiled into an exe file that can be run in a Multiplay load cue. this activates the MagicQ PC window, sends the Spacebar keystroke, then reactivates the Multiplay window ready for the next cue.

 

Regards, Simon.

[skdean]

My 2 cents worth. I use PCStage amongst physical consoles and also other software based systems. PCStage will do exactly wht the OP wants. In fact in Australia there are several professional companies that use PCStage, one companies exclusively uses it for all their shows and international tours.

[dbuckley]

Yeah, PCStage rocks.

 

But... It is Blue Room policy that MagicQ is the answer to any possible question on lighting and PCs.

[Gerry]

Another fan of PCStage here.

It doesn't have the flashy looking interface that some other packages have but it does the job it is designed for.

Cheers

Gerry

[Nicktaylor]

The odd thing about this thread is the need to have fairly skilled person to programme up technology, but then have no one to run the show. Its a pity any group has to go down the simple to operate route as over time they wont have anyone actually learning the lighting or sound trade. You can still use a manual fader desk for lighting and sound and just run sound in from a minidisc or pc.