Lapel Microphones

[paulears]

If you are going to hire the kit from a reputable company, then licenses are their problem. The reality is that there is no best number to have. None would be excellent and so much simpler. In practice budgets are never that generous, and if you want to run large channel counts with volume, then you need a decent PA but most critically an experienced theatre person to mix it. I'd suggest even a seasoned rock and roller would have real grief with a music the first time. So much to learn, and it can't be done from books, only your fingers and your ears.

 

 

The quantity of mics is found by reading the script. Somebody with just a single line is your problem. Are they really worth the extra hire charge, or could their single line be delivered standing close to somebody else with a mic - this works fine. Could you reduce channel count with swaps? That's what so many shows do - pro or amateur. You hear so many musical disaters where the blame is firmly on an inexperienced sound op out of their depth. The sound op in something like Oliver can be the busiest person on the show, having to concentrate every single second, no time to relax or even talk! Channel 69 can handle more than the new channel 38 systems, and lots of hire firms are downsizing their 69 systems in favour of the new ones, so always best to check if you are hiring.

 

Don't also forget to budget in for replacements. DPAs and the rest can easily add mega money to the hire rates when people break them - which they ALWAYS do.

[Chappie]

If you are going to hire the kit from a reputable company, then licenses are their problem.

Not really. A hire company has no control over how or where the equipment is going to be used and cannot be held accountable for the licencing. Most companies will be more than willing to provide licences for you, if you require them, but it is down the end user to take responsibility for it.

[Bobbsy]

 

Not really. A hire company has no control over how or where the equipment is going to be used and cannot be held accountable for the licencing. Most companies will be more than willing to provide licences for you, if you require them, but it is down the end user to take responsibility for it.

 

My experience is like Paul's. Generally the hire company will provide the necessary license and, if you use more than the ordinary, calculate an intermod-free frequency plan for you. Certainly, the hire costs should include any necessary licenses.

 

If they can't/won't, I'd try a different hire company

[Chappie]

My experience is like Paul's. Generally the hire company will provide the necessary license and, if you use more than the ordinary, calculate an intermod-free frequency plan for you.

Of course, but you shouldn't be of the assumption that the licences are "their problem", because if they haven't been discussed and sorted, then it will be the end-users problem should there be issues.

[paulears]

Sorry Phill, I understand what you mean but when I hire my equipment out it goes with a license, and when I hire kit in, I have never had to sort a license separately - which in my case would be very simple to do - but all the companies I deal with will not risk the equipment being used without the appropriate license which renders it as a device subject to seizure by the authorities. Perhaps you just have a different policy yourself, but my experience is that hire equipment comes ready to use - and if that means a license, then reputable firms provide it. In fact, it's probably even more important now with two systems in common use, with one due to become illegal next year. You can't really expect an uninformed user to even know what channel it operates in?

[Simon Lewis]

Perhaps this is the difference between channel 38 / 69 gear where one licence covers the kit and co-ordinated frequencies that need negotiating for each event at each location?

[Chappie]

You can't really expect an uninformed user to even know what channel it operates in?

Of course not, but when dishing out advice to the potentially uninformed on the internet, you can't just state "licences are their problem" as, technically, they aren't. Whoever is hiring equipment such as this needs to understand that it would be a mistake to make the assumption that the company providing said equipment has automatically provided a licence. A rental house house has no idea if the client has existing licences in place or if they are using them in venues that have exemptions, and whilst they should always ask about licencing requirements, they may not.

 

As long as they understand that licencing is required and ask for it if it hasn't been directly offered, then everything will be fine.

[ramdram]

Tricky issue this licensing malarky. We hired 6 rms for a show, some years ago I hasten to add. When I collected them the bloke helped me load the boot and then muttered, just as I was driving away, that if Ofcom appeared and asked about the licenses we were to play the Jimmy Green and plead ignorance (hah!).

 

My reply was along the lines of if Ofcom appeared they would be bounced over to him in very short order. Any licence required was strictly his problem. Turned out when I returned them only four of the six were "in band"...I have no idea either.

 

So yes of course the licence should come with the kit. Amdrams don't buy "a" licence on spec.

 

When we hired smoke machines we expected the fluid to be included. When we hired lanterns we expected a selection of spare lamps bundled in. When we hired rms we expect spare headsets to be supplied.

 

In other words we hired kit that, by definition, would simply just work out of the box and we expect to buy batteries too so simply provide them; nobody wants to play hunt the shop which sells AAs or PP3s an hour before the up.

 

Yes, of course we expect to pay for the service.

 

(And, slightly OT, if kit "needed" a PAT then it should have a PAT sticker. Never mind this nonsense about legal requirements...if a venue we toured insisted on an "in date" PAT sticker then that's what they want to see.

 

Seeing as how there is some confusion on the issue of PAT, and how often, venues can and do impose their own rules. We don't expect to have an argument with the folk in charge of the venue over hired in kit.)

 

We don't expect to go ferreting around for smoke fluid or spare lamps or spare headsets, similarly a licence.

[nb705]

In my experience the degree of service varies greatly between providers. Some providers will send you intermod free frequency lists for the location of your show, batteries to last the duration of the hire and full licensing for all of the kit along with spare everything. Others provide none of them, and there are many that go half way and provide channel 38 licensing, one shows worth of batteries and leave you to it to find intermod free frequencies. Of course, the greatest indicator of the service you can expect is cost.

 

Paulears, I expect that you charge a fair amount on top of the radio hire cost to cover consumables, license cost and the time spent prepping the gear. However, if one goes to dodgy Dave the Dj and gets a bunch of Trantec or worse for a knock down price (cash in hand wink wink nudge nudge) then to even expect fresh batteries would probably be optimistic!

 

As so often occurs in life, you get what you pay for.

[Rob_Beech]

I think the terminology used is what is confusing here. To say that it is "their problem" is simply not true. However I don't think this is what was implied here in it's basic form.

 

I hold the relevant license for my hire stock and when you hire from me you get to use my ch38 (and for the remaining time ch69) license where necessary. This is generally how it works. However, for most people I will have the stuff tuned for them to frequencies that are intermodulation free and within my license. Some clients often wish to sort their own frequencies out as they may have some units of their own that they wish to use alongside it. This is also acceptable. Providing they are aware that the following criteria is met.

 

My license only covers my equipment.

My equipment can be used in whatever channel you want, but if it is outside of my licensed range then you must deal with this yourself

If you do not wish to deal with it yourself, ask in advance and I'll sort you a temporary license out on the frequencies you want, for the relevant fee.

 

I work on the principle that the units go out with batteries that turn the unit on and will generally work ok for testing purposes. The chances are they'll be nearly new. But I do also supply batteries to many clients as it's easier for them to get it all at the same time.

 

If you are BUYING wireless systems. Bear in mind that many of the components are fragile, expensive and very high maintenance, consumables in many cases. Be prepared to be replacing jack / mini XLR / < insert you choice of fiddly rubbish connector here> quite often.

 

if you are HIRING wireless systems. Bear in mind that many of the components are fragile and expensive, and you will likely receive a bill if something gets broken on your watch.

 

Can you hire 16 channels of 5000's series with mke2's from me? Yes, yes you can, Can you hire 16 channels of G3 with a budget alternative lapel or headset? Yes, you can, and it'll be less than half the price to hire, and much cheaper when someone drops a beltpack down the toilet or does a quick costume change and ripped the cable for the mic.

 

 

 

Finally, Aaron, how do you find the UHFR stuff then? You only mention the UR4 which is the generic term for the receiver, succeeded by S or D for single or Dual, but are you a user of the UR1's and UR2's we have some of the UR2 for when it has to have a Shure badge (with sm and b58 b87 and ksm9 heads) but we don't have the UR1's.