gnomatron Posted October 9, 2011 Share Posted October 9, 2011 I've been asked to look into the practicality of having musicians performing on movable rostra. As far as I know the idea is for them to move into a few predefined places during the show. Now, for the most part radio mics make this pretty easy, and for monitors I can just dot wedges about at appropriate places - don't want to use in-ears for various reasons - but when it comes to percussion and keyboards the only solution I can see is to just chuck a wee multicore with a nice long cable on the rostra. Does anyone have any bright ideas or helpful tips? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cedd Posted October 9, 2011 Share Posted October 9, 2011 How many channels are we talking in total? 16 channels of wireless is very do-able, more just at the minute with the ch69 and ch38 availability, though watch intermods. You could very easily get your drum mics plugged in to a transmitter, as long as you can get phantom power when needed. Maybe look at in ear monitor transmitters instead of using beltpacks, again as long as you can get power somehow. Batteries and inverters maybe? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Alcock Posted October 9, 2011 Share Posted October 9, 2011 I would have thought a multicore would be the most practical solution if you're using more than a couple of mics on the kit. Are radio mics in use by the actors? If so, that's going to diminish the number of channels that could be available for your moveable band rostra (MBR?). Also I can't imagine radio mics being able to cope with the levels of close up drum mics without messing about with attenuating pads. Would need care taken over how the cable is routed, especially so that it doesn't get caught beneath the wheels of the MBR. I recall seeing cameras at TV Centre with sort of "shoes" round the castors so that cables get pushed out of the way, rather than run over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J Pearce Posted October 9, 2011 Share Posted October 9, 2011 Dave Rat has an interesting post on his blog about how he achieved audio lines to Blink182s spinning lifting drum riser. I'd go with a long cable (maybe digi multi and cat5 to make life easier?) and someone to look after it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Robinson Posted October 9, 2011 Share Posted October 9, 2011 Would there be any option to sub-mix the band and then transmit the sub-mixed stuff wirelessly? Alternatively, you could have a digital stagebox and then use wireless routers/ access points to get the signal to you at FoH? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GridGirl Posted October 9, 2011 Share Posted October 9, 2011 I did a production of Guys and Dolls where we had two keyboards and the drummer on individual trucks being pushed around the stage (with the bassist wandering along behind them!). Batteries, inverters and radio mics (and IEMs) were the solution we used; over an 11-week season we didn't have a single issue. We did double-mic the keyboards in case one dropped out, but they never did. Weirdly, when we first switched one of the keyboards on it would sound odd for a couple of minutes, make a noise like the Concorde taking off, then sound perfectly normal - never did it when plugged into the mains and we never figured it out. We also had a wireless "bullet" camera on one of the keyboards as it was the MD playing so we needed conductor cam - this was the only thing which we had any trouble with; the LD had his laptop hooked up to the desk wirelessly in production week and that interfered with the camera, and some spots on the stage seemed to be black spots for the camera's RF as it would go fuzzy, the truck would be moved about 20cm and it would come right. I'd certainly have no problems going wireless again as it worked really well for us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mackerr Posted October 9, 2011 Share Posted October 9, 2011 Alternatively, you could have a digital stagebox and then use wireless routers/ access points to get the signal to you at FoH? Really? What has been your personal experience with this? What wireless router did you use to get the bandwidth needed for multichannel audio? How did you power the electronics on the band carts? To the OP, this is done all the time in commercial theater. Make some cable bundles with the right sized audio multi, power, and speaker cables, and have someone page the cables as the carts move. I'm sure you'll have better places to use up wireless frequencies than replacing the cable on mics that are easy to wire. Mac Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gnomatron Posted October 10, 2011 Author Share Posted October 10, 2011 cheers for the advice people! I don't know all the details as yet, i.e. channel count etc; it's a circus show so there won't be any/many other mics onstage. It looks like a multicore/cable loom is the most sensible solution, from the consensus here. I don't think the budget would stretch to masses of radio channels so I doubt I can use them for channel-heavy stuff like percussion, and I prefer the simpler solution as it's a smallish touring show running for a few months. The director might end up changing his mind before the show goes out anyway...! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Robinson Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 Mac, I don't have any experience of doing this and never claimed to do so. However, it could have been something to investigate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billy jim Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 If I'm not mistaken, digital multicores use an entirely different protocol to Ethernet, and just use the Cat5 cable as a carrier. Therefore the wireless access point etc probably wouldn't work- as Matthew says though, it could be worth investigating (for other applications as the OP seems happy with the easier option of a nice long cable...) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Robinson Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 My flatmate seems to know quite a lot about ethersound, and from speaking to him it would appear that it is possible to route it via a network. Thus it would appear to make sense that it could be routed via a wireless network. Obviously, this does require desks/ multicores to use ethersound, which I'm not sure if they all do? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mackerr Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 My flatmate seems to know quite a lot about ethersound, and from speaking to him it would appear that it is possible to route it via a network. Thus it would appear to make sense that it could be routed via a wireless network. Obviously, this does require desks/ multicores to use ethersound, which I'm not sure if they all do? Ethersound absolutely can be sent via a network, as can several other digital audio protocols. It is the relatively low speed and need to resend packets in a wireless network that make it unsuitable for audio. When you have successfully used multichannel audio like the OP needed via WiFi in a production environment, let us know how it worked out. Mac Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kerry davies Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 Matthew, this is a small scale, touring circus, the OP is going to have his hands full ensuring the drums stay on the rolling rostra. Macker is right that looms are the way to go unless the scale reaches something akin to Cirque Soleil. Even with C.O.K.E. the only thing with radio were the guitarists and that was simply because the swine were using an Olympic sized trampoline at the time. K.I.S.S. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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