Cubase 5 + Elation DMX Operator Pro

[fallofknowledge]

Hi to everyone. I'm new to this subject so pls have patience. It was my understanding that there was a way to program Cubase 5 to send midi notes to my Operator Pro, triggering lights/sequences I have programmed into the Elation. We can't afford a lighting tech, so the idea is to have all our lights triggered by Cubase, in sync with the click. I'm clearly missing some piece of information (or several) because I can't get them to communicate with each other. Can someone PLEASE explain (in as much detail as you have patience for) how I program Cubase to send the appropriate signals to the DMX controller???

[paulears]

Well I don't know the elation, but I do know Cubase. It has many ways to send any kind of midi data you want. The external device that needs midi is the key. It will need either note on commands on a specific midi channel, or possibly programme changes or even some form of CC message (continuous controller). Once you know what it wants, you can then create an empty track, and then perhaps starting in the midi list editor, insert the various commands or notes. You can then use any of the editors to move these to the correct place in time. The list editor is useful for getting things in, and then tweaking the parameters - BUT not much use for moving things in time, apart from just roughly - but the others can be better (like the piano roll style edit window) for fine adjustment. Midi doesn't care what the data is at all - just the type, so note, pg or cc for the main. The exact process to get events in is a bit different for each version, but the list window works as a starting point for me for any control of external gadgetry.

[peza2010]

A post on the elation forum http://forums.elationlighting.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/4741036491/m/5321099903

 

Suggests that scenes have a specific midi note for each one which will be in the manual for the product...

 

Then you tell cubase where you want to output the midi to and you should be away.

 

So you would then programme up scenes as parts of the song, and line up the next midi note to hit when you want it to change.

[paulears]

If that's the case, then it's a really simple job. You could simply go to the normal piano roll style edit page, right click to selct the pencil tool, and then just draw in the note on the correct line, at the correct time. I'd probably just add a new track to each song on the correct midi channel number the control expects, and then enter the notes.

 

Do you load up each song as a separate song, or have you got them running in one long track which you start and stop?

[peza2010]

I wonder if it would need a constant note throughout the part to keep it in the same scene. Or would the controller just wait for the next midi instruction?

 

I don't know why im even asking as I'm trying to help the op... But you know. :)

[Nid]

I wonder if it would need a constant note throughout the part to keep it in the same scene. Or would the controller just wait for the next midi instruction?

 

I don't know why im even asking as I'm trying to help the op... But you know. :)

 

Basicaly no, but it depends on how the buttons (light scenes) are defined in Compu-Live (same as in Sunlite...)

If the buttons are set as Scenes, then as eace scene is turned on, it replaces any other active scene.

If the buttons are set as Switches, they can be switched on indipendently to other scenes or switches that may be running.

 

If the trigger command for a switch is configured as flash mode (ruther then on/off togle),

then yes, it would need constant note/trigger for the duration of that switch.

 

:)

[fallofknowledge]

Hi again everyone and thank you all for your responses. I've spoken several times to the ppl at American DJ who give 'support' for this DMX controller, and they seem to know less than all of you so I'm hoping we can come up with an answer together. They insist I should just be able to trigger the lights in the Operator Pro using regular midi, but claim to have no knowledge of Cubase so can't help further. Steinberg support says they have no knowledge of DMX Operator Pro or what language it requires to work (CC's, note on/off/ midi) so they cannot assist.

 

I've used the chart that came with this unit to find the corresponding midi notes in Cubase (note 23 in the DMX chart = A# -1 in Cubase Key Editor for instance) - and NOTHING happens. The midi channel is set at 1 for both Cubase and the DMX controller.

 

Nid: I don't know what Compu-Live or Sunlite is - on the DMX Operator Pro it's simply a matter of pushing the button to trigger a light. Each button has its own seperate function...very simple programming (1 button/fixture, 1 button/chase scene programmed in)

 

Paulears: I am using one long track for our entire set.

 

How would I go about programming CC's or note on/off if that was the missing ingredient??

[peza2010]

I wouldnt look at trying loads of different things, before actually figuring out that cubase is "talking" to your controller.

is there any indication in the manual that says "when midi is being recieved the desk will show XXXXXX"

because if cubase isnt actually talking to the controller then everything you try is going to be pointless.

[fallofknowledge]

I wouldnt look at trying loads of different things, before actually figuring out that cubase is "talking" to your controller.

is there any indication in the manual that says "when midi is being recieved the desk will show XXXXXX"

because if cubase isnt actually talking to the controller then everything you try is going to be pointless.

 

 

No this manual is very basic and limited in information (crappy in other words ;) ). Cubase is transmiting midi signal because when I plug the same midi cable into my keyboard it plays the notes. The 2 units just aren't communicating but I've no idea why. Don't understand the whole CC idea, but willing to try anything at this point

[paulears]

in cubase, you can just insert a cc or pg event at the cursor position.

 

I'll try to explain - it's quite difficult in words. I'm using Cubase v5, but the previous versions and light versions are pretty similar.

 

Take your song file and create a new empty midi track. set the markers to the start and end positions and then double click in the blank area and an empty track block will appear. With this highlighted (single click on it) go to midi on the top line and select list editor. This might be set up to open automatically with a double click on the track, but this may not happen (on mine I have it set so double clicking opens score edit). You will have a blank panel on the left hand side. and a grid with bars/mins secs on the right. half way across the screen is a box that says insert type. This allows you to enter notes, cc and programme data with a left click at the point you want in the grid.

http://www.earsmedia.co.uk/cubase.jpg

In this image you can see I have added a note, a controller and a programme change. Things to watch - the note has two data fields - the note on time and the note off time - so if your control needs this it's easy to either drag the note with a mouse or type absolute times. The controller I double clicked on and typed in 11 which for a synth is expression - so if your control needs say cc 10 don't worry that this box suddenly says pan - pan is 10, easy to remember - panten! the box that has 0 in it sets the amount of the continuous controller - so your gadget might want cc10 at 127 to trigger it - hopefully you can find this in the manual somewhere. Programme is the same - but I forgot to drag the divider to the right - the midi channel column is hidden and I didn't notice - sorry. Don't forget the note/cc and pg events can be directed to any midi channel you like.

 

So getting data into cubase isn't that difficult - making the lighting controller respond will be the difficult thing, and I'm afraid I have no experience with that at all!

Paul

[fallofknowledge]

Thank you for the detail!! Most of this I already understand actually, but how do I determine for instance what CC number it requires?? What would the 'program change' be for?

[fallofknowledge]

Thank you for the detail!! Most of this I already understand actually, but how do I determine for instance what CC number it requires?? What would the 'program change' be for?

 

 

OK!! So... I've discovered using my keyboard that I must start the midi scale at C-3. So 0= C-3

 

Question: How do I program Cubase so that the key editor goes an octave lower? It starts at C-2 by default

 

Thank again Paul

[paulears]

Cubase will not display any notes -3 because in their interpretation of the spec that would be below midi 0 which cannot exist.

If you attempt to even manually enter notes lower than this it defaults to -2 in octaves below middle C. I suspect your keyboard/system is an octave adrift -2 is a LONG way below middle C and MIDI never needed to go past that, as it was musical, and any notes in the -3 range would have been pointless.

 

Transposing your keyboard, if it has that feature, also wouldn't work because you can't get lower than 0.

 

 

Worth noting with MIDI that there was never any agreement with the MIDI spec that it is 0-127 (128 steps) or 1-128 (also 128 steps) so when linking different brands of kit, especially older synths, there is sometimes a 1 step difference - especially common in programme data.

 

As to how this controls your lighting software - sorry, I have no idea at all. Doesn't the manual help you?