Hog 500

[CharlieH]

Hi Guys,

Just a quick question - we are hiring a Hog 500 desk for our forthcoming production of Hairspray, and I just wanted to check what sockets it had on the back? I am aware that it can host a mouse & keyboard, but I couldn't find any pictures or specs of it to check whether these are USB or DIN?

 

Also, if anyone has any tips for using it, then they are more than welcome as I am slightly nervous about using a new desk <_<

Thanks,

Charlie

[Calder]

They are din, however if your hiring it should come with all the bits you need.

 

C.

[tokm]

A slight note, the mouse is on a 9pin Dsub (well the ones I've always used are), but as Calder said, if your hiring from someone reputable, the desk should come 'complete' (i.e. monitor, cover, mouse, keyboard, desk lights, etc..).

 

Question to ask though, you've not used the desk before, yet you chose to hire it? I'm sure there's a good reason, but to play devils advocate, why not pick a desk your familiar with or one that's up to the task for this show, but that's made by a desk manufacturer you have previous experience with, you at least have a chance of knowing where to start.

 

Sorry if that came off as a nag, just an observation <_<

 

Anyway, the manuals located here >> Link.

 

HTH and good luck,

 

T

[Calder]

If you are using movers make sure you read up on "Mark Cues".

 

C.

[dave_m]

get the hog2 offline editor, should teach you some of the basics.

 

I've never really found much use for the mouse on the 500/1000, though a second screen can be invaluable.

[CharlieH]

Hi Everyone, thanks for all the replies.

 

We are hiring it from our local, but we have a good relationship and I trust that they will give us what we need (having said that, a quick email wouldn't hurt! <_< )

 

We are using the Hog because it is the cheapest desk that the hire company we are going to could do. I know that I am probably going to get loads of stick for that last comment, but it is the truth! I asked for a Jester Ml48, and have swotted up on that - downloading the Phantom Jester, reading the instructions e.t.c. However, the powers that be told me that that hire company were too expensive and that they wanted to go to a different one, and this one didn't have the Jester.

 

So I didn't really get a say in the desk, but it is my first time with movers so I don't have a favourite desk, or make of desk - the only desk I have used is the school's Strand 200!

 

Thanks for the advice - and could anyone link to the offline editor? I couldn't find it anywhere when I looked!

 

Charlie

[paulears]

You have a bit of a learning curve to cope with! Hog operation is rather different from what you are used to. However, with the manual, you'll get to grips with it. I suspect it may not come with a mouse at all - this was an option and not all 500s have the option fitted - and it's not a drawback really.

 

Common set-up snags will be that the faders can be assigned as LTP or HTP and this is important when dealing with movers - or generics, if you load the last show and simply delete all the cues. It's easy to change, either globally or on a fader by fader basis.

[neilalexrose]

You have a bit of a learning curve to cope with! Hog operation is rather different from what you are used to. However, with the manual, you'll get to grips with it.

 

 

From my limited Hog programming experience, I'd also decide pretty early on whether you want to keep tracking on or off. If you've not used tracking before (and, with respect, it sounds like you haven't, please correct me if I'm wrong,) It may be beneficial to read up on how to turn it off. I know there are benefits to using tracking, and I must admit, I know the concept, but haven't really got to grips with it myself, but if it's your first time using the desk and using movers, it might be easier for you to keep track of what's going on with tracking off.

I only suggest this, as it can get a touch confusing if you plot a cue that's live on stage, go to play it back and there are either things missing or extras in the cues. I've done it myself on a hog trying to plot cues out of sequence, as I didn't really understand how and where to use Block cues, being primarily used to non-tracking ETC and Strand plotting. That said, the command line is similar to strand/etc and the benefit of having visual groups and palettes is very handy.

 

If you're happy to try plotting a show using tracking, then I would definitely suggest reading up on blocking cues, and how to stop things tracking forward when you don't want them too. The offline editor is definitely a first port of call, search the web for flying pig systems, then look under legacy controllers, then downloads.

 

HTH

 

Neil

[paulears]

Unless I've really missed this feature - I didn't know you could turn tracking off on a Hog 500? Blocking style cues are done by hitting ACTIVE and return, any channels active at this point will transfer to the programmer. This is a feature that ex-Strand users like me found a bit odd.

[CharlieH]

whether you want to keep tracking on or off

Sorry, but this is my first experience with any sort of intelligent lighting. What is tracking?

[neilalexrose]

Unless I've really missed this feature - I didn't know you could turn tracking off on a Hog 500? Blocking style cues are done by hitting ACTIVE and return, any channels active at this point will transfer to the programmer. This is a feature that ex-Strand users like me found a bit odd.

 

 

If I remember, (and it's been a while), in the options for each cue stack there is an option to turn off tracking. I don't think it's obviously labelled 'turn off tracking',

 

Just found it in the manual. I'm fairly certain that if you de-select 'maintain state' in the cuelist options that acts as the tracking on\off for that cue stack.

 

As I said, it's been around 2 years since I've used a hog, and this was how I got around plotting out of sequence (It was one of the usual under pressure situations with not enough time, or manual to hand to learn the desk properly.)

 

Reading the manual properly, tracking isn't actually turned off, it's just suspended for that cue stack.

 

Neil

[paulears]

That doesn't make it work like a non-tracking desk though, does it. You'd have to remember to use the active button all the time when programming to get all the parameters into the programmer? Other wise, ch 1 on rec select, then ch 2 on rec select, would step from one to another like a chase on playback - rather than be an addition, unless you did ch 1 on rec select, then ch 2 on active enter rec select, which is a bit clumsy?

[dbuckley]

Sorry, but this is my first experience with any sort of intelligent lighting. What is tracking?

Ahhh....

 

You need to get a copy of Brad Schiller's "The Automated Loghting Programmers Handbook". Quickly. Run, dont walk.

 

There is stuff you need to know before you can make movers do anything at all, let alone anything useful, and this book will help you lots.

[neilalexrose]

That doesn't make it work like a non-tracking desk though, does it. You'd have to remember to use the active button all the time when programming to get all the parameters into the programmer? Other wise, ch 1 on rec select, then ch 2 on rec select, would step from one to another like a chase on playback - rather than be an addition, unless you did ch 1 on rec select, then ch 2 on active enter rec select, which is a bit clumsy?

 

Paul. I'm willing to stand corrected on my advice to the OP if it proves unhelpful, as I said it's been a while since I used a Hog. The situation I used it in was starting each cue from black, therefore building each cue in separation from the rest. There was a lot of "make this cue 1 and cue 5", hence the need for turning off 'maintain state'. I hadn't really got my head around tracking, so wasn't that confident I could make it work in that situation (having had a bad programming experience the week before using the hog). Turning off 'Maintain state in the cue stack options worked for me in that instance. It may work for the O.P?

 

 

I think I see what you're illustrating Paul, your example says that you need to make sure that everything you want to record has to be loaded into the programmer to record a cue, thus using 'active' 'enter' makes hard values appear in the rogrammer. ('active' 'enter' captures the output of what is on stage - including any thing being played back on a stack/sub, and everything that is at 0% - and loads it into the programmer.). Me turning off maintain state, means that if you were recording cues in sequence, and wanted to build on cues already written, you'd have to keep loading the previous cue into the programmer.

 

(for the OP. The hog uses a programmer to record anything. Therefore you have to select channels and input values to load them into the programmer, and thus give the desk something to record. It isn't like a strand/ETC/Zero88 where if you press record, the desk records whatever is shown in the output window.)

 

I think I will leave it to others to explain tracking, I'm not sure I understand all it's complexties myself, so will refrain from confusing any further!

 

Neil

[niclights]

Tracking applies to cue lists (stacks).

 

Imagine a simple list where cue one is position centre red, cue two is change to yellow, cue three is position audience and each cue only contains the required values.

 

On a non-tracking console if you fired cue 1 and then jumped to cue 3 you would end up with audience position in red which might not be what you expected. On a tracking console you will get the audience position in yellow even though you never fired the cue that actually contained the yellow data. That is because the console 'tracked' through the cues to give the correct output.

This is useful if you need to make changes since you do not need to worry about updating every affected cue. If additionally you had built the cues using palettes then editing can be very fast.

 

Of course if you are not using theatre style stacks then this won't affect you.

 

Use Hog2PC to learn how to do the things you need.