Upgrades for a College Venue

[dpham]

We are looking to do some equipment upgrades for a small music venue where college bands perform. Right now we are still budgeting, but plan to do some lighting upgrades.

 

Our current equip is:

Console: Leprecon LP-1512

Dimmer Rack: Leprecon VX 2400

Lights: 11 various lights, Par 64's with flood lamps.(These are unmarked, but have generally worked okay for us)

Console Cable: DMX-512

Stage Pins are 20A 125V, 15A 250V

 

Here are my questions:

1) We want to upgrade our console probably to just a 24 channel console. We are considering the Leprecon-LP1524 but don't really know what else is out there, any suggestions?

2) If we end up selecting a 24 channel console, can we still use our old channel dimmer? We'd like to keep this as we prob won't have the budget for it. Can we add a second dimmer (I.e 2 x 12 channel dimmers for one 24 channel console) later on?

3) Can we run more than 12 lights on the 12-channel Dimmer if we daisy-chain multiple lights to a single Channel?

4) Any suggestions on some new lights? We are gonna try to get 4 new lights if daisy-chaining works.

5) Any other advice is greatly appreciated - Thanks in advance!

 

Also we're in the US, not sure how much difference that makes...

[Dodgecaliber]

You can "daisy chain" lights, Use a "Grelko" to chain them together.(Daisy chain is not the correct term)

 

 

Your lighting desk should still be 100% ok with another dimmer (Asuming it's a 24ch)

 

 

• So yes you can run more than 12 lights on 12 ways of dimming, how many will depend on the wattage of the light.
  

 

• Yes you can link 2 dimmers together to create as many channels as you wish - See below,
  

 

• This is done by the desk's output going into the input of the first dimmer (The way it is just now), then the output of the first dimmer going into the input of the second dimmer :D Use a short DMX cable to "link" them together. Set the DMX address on the first dimmer to 1 and the second dimmer to 13. That way the first dimmer will control channels 1 thru 12 and the second controlling 13 thru 24 on the lighting desk
  

So remember - You have 2400 Watts per channel on your current dimmer.

 

 

2400 watts

= Number of lights you can daisy chain

wattage of the light

 

 

2400 watts

= 2.5. Which means 2x 1000watt Lights at full power or 3 at half.

1000 Watts

 

 

I should be a teacher :(

 

[Dmills]

Err, 3K off a 2.4K channel (even at 50%) is going to be a bit hard of the dimmer don't you think?

 

That kit (Looking at the desk and dimmers) is almost never seen over here, and stage pins are a peculiarly American perversion.

 

1: There are many, many choices, but you could narrow it down a little by giving a project budget. US and UK taste in consoles differ, so maybe someone over there could chime in?

2: Assuming it is DMX there should be no problem.

3: Yes, you can hang up to 2400W per channel, but you may want to be careful about the size of the dimmers power feed.

4: Add a few more pars (cheap as chips, possibly with some different bulb angles), if you are total power constrained then a few LED cans can be worthwhile (for floor cans and the like) and these do not take up dimmer channels as the y just plug into ordinary power and get wired into the DMX line for control, you will need a desk with more channels however (Each LED par is typically 4 channels) to control these in addition to the dimmers.

 

Regards, Dan.

[dbuckley]

You can "daisy chain" lights, Use a "Grelko" to chain them together.(Daisy chain is not the correct term)

 

In American, a Grelco is a "twofer"...

[DangerousMark]

2400 watts

= 2.5. Which means 2x 1000watt Lights at full power or 3 at half.

1000 Watts

 

 

I should be a teacher :blink:

:blink:

 

mind you I got lucky with my maths teachers, and paid for it by having a completely useless IT teacher (couldn't tell a PC from a burnt twig), so you'd probably be midway on the skills scale there as you were within 5% :blink:

It'd be 2.4 mate... and you could have 4 lights at half power... five if you really wanted to follow the definition of 2400/1000 as 2.5 or fancied testing the resilience of the system to being a few percent over-spec... If it had continual dimming you could have 3 at 75-80%?

 

(j/k)

[StNic54]

look up a dimmer doubler, see if that is something that might prove useful. You can buy lightronics dimmer packs from four to 12 a pack if you need something further, and all can be addressed to fit your board. Oh, and stage pin, twist lock, and edison cables are uniquely american, just like eating cheeseburgers, getting fat, and using toothpaste :blink: Don't put 3000 watts on a 2400 watt dimmer - you don't know that someone else might crank it up to full, and check all of your plugs - odds are that most of your plugs might be rated at 15amps, so if that's the case, you can only run that many amps on a cable. Running 2400 or even 3k on a cable like that will melt those connectors - I doubt you've spent the money on a heavy duty connector, unless british connectors are tougher than our peculiar american stage pins :blink:

[JDLX]

look up a dimmer doubler, see if that is something that might prove useful. You can buy lightronics dimmer packs from four to 12 a pack if you need something further, and all can be addressed to fit your board. Oh, and stage pin, twist lock, and edison cables are uniquely american, just like eating cheeseburgers, getting fat, and using toothpaste Don't put 3000 watts on a 2400 watt dimmer - you don't know that someone else might crank it up to full, and check all of your plugs - odds are that most of your plugs might be rated at 15amps, so if that's the case, you can only run that many amps on a cable. Running 2400 or even 3k on a cable like that will melt those connectors - I doubt you've spent the money on a heavy duty connector, unless british connectors are tougher than our peculiar american stage pins :)

 

Bearing in mind we run on 240V mains in the UK so 2400W is only 10A :) Anything the dimmer can take, a 15A rated cable and plug will take with ease. Not sure if the OP is from the UK or not though.

[Guest lightnix]

...we run on 240V mains in the UK so 2400W is only 10A :)

I'm sorry to drag this up again, but that isn't strictly true.

 

The old standard for UK mains voltage was 240V ±6% (i.e. a range of 225.6 - 254.4V)

 

That was replaced on January 1st 2004, with a standard of 230V (-6%, +10%), 50 Hz (±1%) - a range of 216.2 - 253V. The change was made to harmonise with European standards.

 

So, although we often more than 230V coming out of our sockets in the UK, it is incorrect to simply say that, "the UK runs on 240V"

[JDLX]

...we run on 240V mains in the UK so 2400W is only 10A :)

I'm sorry to drag this up again, but that isn't strictly true.

 

The old standard for UK mains voltage was 240V ±6% (i.e. a range of 225.6 - 254.4V)

 

That was replaced on January 1st 2004, with a standard of 230V (-6%, +10%), 50 Hz (±1%) - a range of 216.2 - 253V. The change was made to harmonise with European standards.

 

So, although we often more than 230V coming out of our sockets in the UK, it is incorrect to simply say that, "the UK runs on 240V"

 

Yes you are of course right, I'm sure he got the jist though :)

[Guest lightnix]

Maybe, but my background point is, that by calculating for 240V, you potentially underestimate the total current. 2400W @ 230V = 10.43A.

 

Surely it can do no harm, to err on the side of caution and calculate for 4.35A or even 4.5A per kW, in order to give yourself some overhead

 

Please correct me if I'm wrong *dons tin hat*

[revbobuk]

But there's surely another element here. A 1000W lantern is rated at 1kW and a specific voltage - say 240V. Run it at 230V and the current flowing would be less (assuming it behaves as a 57.6ohm resistor, which it doesn't). Run it at 250V and more current would flow. A 2400W dimmer can cope with 10A at 240V - it can almost certainly cope with 10A at 230V (2300W) and 10A at 250V (2500W) - but at 230V the 1000W/240V lantern (if it were a resistive load) draws 4A, rather than 4.2A at the full 240V.

 

What I mean is that the lantern power is not the fixed point in this calculation. Awkwardly, neither is the filament resistance, as the resistance changes with the current flowing, and the consequent filament temperature.

 

Or so I think. Ready to be corrected!

[J Pearce]

Indeed. A far more succinctly put version of what I was trying to say in a thread earlier this week.

[Sound In Gloucestershire]

Also we're in the US, not sure how much difference that makes...