School Show Tech - Problem

[adamcoppard]

As you may remember from a thread a little while ago about hiring stuff in, we are getting ready for the technical side of this years show. This thread is a continuation (well, it's an addition) to problems raised in the last couple of days.

 

Housekeeping: Moving lights (or intelligent, call them what you will!) are mentioned in this thread. For a school production, yes I know. If you don't like it, then move along. If you can stomach that a school may use them, then carry on.

 

For the past couple of years we've spent anywhere between £2,500 and £4,000 on hire equipment for a week (LS9-32, 16 radio mics, speakers, amps, lights etc.)

 

This year, I've been put in charge of sourcing the quote (as well as running it, which I normally do), which I did. It was a nice quote, with a 24:4:4 anolouge sound desk (soundcraft gb4-24), speakers, amps, mics, truss, Robe 250's (6), theatrical lights, haze, desk (LeapFrog 96), the whole shebang, to put it on par with what we've been used too.

 

Today, after spending hours working on a design etc. I've been told that she has 'rethought' the whole idea, and is going stupidly simple, with a budget of maybe £500 for technical stuff.

 

Now, that would normally be fine, I would just cut back a lot, but, it needs to be on par with everything else, and to be honest, everyone has got to complacent with radio mics, etc, and expects themselves to be able to speak without it. So, how can I give them what they want, be in on budget, and may have something extra special?

 

Basically, I guess the question is stearing away from the technical side, and should I just sit back, and let it crash and burn, and then let them realise that it will all be needed, or should I go and work out what I can get for my new budget, or, the option has been given just to go ahead with this quote, with a bit of alteration (bringing it down to about £1,800) and spend another £2,000 next year.

 

The idea of using £500 as a budget this year really came up as it's our SM's and Musical teacher's last year next year, and we would spend about £5,000+ on a big send-off for them.

[PDD]

This is the sort of 'question' that can only really be answered by yourself and the director / budget holder concerned. If "she" is the director, then it's her prerogative to do the show simply or otherwise - although you do have some flexibility as the lighting/sound designer to bring ideas to the table. Express your concerns about lack of microphones clearly and with a reasoned discussion. Otherwise, you will have to fit the design to the budget. Every theatre in the country does it, however big the budget. I have to do it all the time.

 

Next year my budget is very tight ("due to the recession") and I only have one show budgeted over £3,000 - the rest are less - zero in one case! Use your skill and imagination to make a 'cheap' show just as special as a big-budget spectacular. Sometimes that's more fun and more creative! Never let the show "crash and burn" - it's not professional and will do you no favours, however much you may feel aggrieved by the situation. Raise the issue now with the person concerned.

 

Difficult to answer your post any further than that, sorry!

[mark_s]

Today, after spending hours working on a design etc. I've been told that she has 'rethought' the whole idea, and is going stupidly simple, with a budget of maybe £500 for technical stuff.

 

Now, that would normally be fine, I would just cut back a lot, but, it needs to be on par with everything else, and to be honest, everyone has got to complacent with radio mics, etc, and expects themselves to be able to speak without it. So, how can I give them what they want, be in on budget, and may have something extra special?

 

Such is life. Ignoring the sound and general technical elements of your issue, part of the job of an LD is to work within a budget to produce something which is compatible with the director's vision for the production. If your ideas and the budget don't line up, you'll need to rethink what you want to achieve and how to go about it. Go back to the basics - read the script, talk with the production team, attend rehearsals, and work out how you can produce something that supports what the director wants to achieve, for the money they want you to spend. As an example, I recently lit a small professional production with a budget of £100 (entirely spent on consumables). In an ideal world I could have done with £500 to achieve exactly what I wanted, but it wasn't an option. I went back to the drawing board, and in the end still came up with something the director liked.

 

Basically, I guess the question is stearing away from the technical side, and should I just sit back, and let it crash and burn, and then let them realise that it will all be needed, or should I go and work out what I can get for my new budget, or, the option has been given just to go ahead with this quote, with a bit of alteration (bringing it down to about £1,800) and spend another £2,000 next year.

 

'Sitting back and letting it crash and burn' is a pathetic response. These things happen in the real world too, and people work around them. Throwing your toys out of the pram will just get you a bad reputation. If they really want you to work to £500, have a rethink and then sit down with the production team and discuss it. Discuss what compromises you've had to make as a result, and whether it is something they'll be able to live with.

[gareth]

I can only echo what Mark has just said.

 

Budget cuts happen. That's life. You may have already planned what you're going to spend your £4k on - but that's now irrelevant, as your budget is £500. The school has entrusted you to come up with a way to obtain maximum result from the available budget - if you don't feel that you can work with what you've been given then you should step down and let someone else do it. You can't spend what you don't have.

 

Throwing a benny and "letting it crash and burn" would, I imagine, be a pretty successful way of ensuring that you don't get asked to do the job again.

 

The bottom line would appear to be that you only have £500. This may not be enough to achieve what the teacher in charge would like to achieve - but ultimately it's their problem, not yours. You may well be in a position to let them know that there's a discrepancy between what they want and what they can afford - and you should do this ASAP if it's an issue. Let them know that their preferred solution will cost more than they've budgeted for, and outline to them what they can get as an alternative using the available budget. If you can't come up with a package to fit the budget which will go some of the way towards achieving what they want to achieve and can be presented as a possible (although not ideal) solution to the needs of the production, then you're the wrong person to be doing the job. After that, it's up to them as the responsible member of staff looking after the production - not you, as the pupil assisting them. They must decide whether to scale back the ideas and go for the lower budget solution, or to find some extra pennies in the coffers and up the technical budget a bit in order to enable you to hire more/better kit.

[Davethsparky]

Basically, I guess the question is stearing away from the technical side, and should I just sit back, and let it crash and burn, and then let them realise that it will all be needed,

 

No, don't do that. If you feel that you are unable to do the job then hand it over to someone else, don't spoil the show for everyone else just because you didn't get what you want. If you can't light this show properly is there really much chance of anyone wanting you to light the next one if it is supposed to be a much bigger production?

 

It is perfectly possible to produce amazing lighting on a shoestring budget. It is a true test of a lighting designers abilities. You will have to start again with the design but you will surely benefit from the experience.

[Rozztech]

All you can do it get the best out of your money , rule out things like movers if you dont need them , use all your lanterns old and new they all do the same thing!(well not really but you get my gist). and if your planning on hireing of a cue system or cans normally amounting to 100 pounds make a network with laptops or make your own for less than half the hire cost.(provideing it is safe to do so). you really have to just stretch it out as far as you can and even thow it may be stressful you will reap the rewards when you see the show and see where all your work has gone And yeah

maybe next year you can put your feet up!

 

Sam

[adamcoppard]

Thanks for all the quick replys.

 

First of all, I must just say that I did get the budget to do what I wanted (and more!) to begin with, which is why I am a little annoyed (or was when I wrote the orgininal post).

 

As for thorwing my toys out my pram, and the crashing and burning, I mean, wait until tech week, and then when they say, ooh we need this mic here, and this here (like they are used too), I can just say, well, I told you so (well, not exactly that, but say if we'd done this, then we could do Y).

 

We are having a meeting tomorrow to talk about this, hopefully a nice conclusion can be met, one that both sides are happy with. I will of course explain that these things cost a lot of money (for a decent quality), and running some nice mics through our old beat up (almost broken) Mackie PA system which as a few H&S problems, isn't going to give you the best results.

 

If anyone else has any ideas (not that there is anything wrong with what I've got so far!), I'd love to hear them.

[sleah]

I agree with all the above replies, however I don't have anywhere near the experience of some BR members. I do work in a school and have to deal with teachers who want everything but don't have the budget.

 

I'd firstly come up with some kind of balance to present to them between lighting and sound. Find out which is most important, lots of mics or lots of lights. It is up to them to decide on the minimum number of mics they can cope with. If it isn't enough, then it's not your problem. You can later turn round and say "That's what you asked for, cough up the money if you want more" - or words to that effect

I think with £500 you will have to forget movers :unsure: , I guess it is somekind of music based production... so a shed load of PAR's will give you more to play with (colour washes, chases etc).

 

In the past I've managed to do very basic (but effective) chases on a simple 2 preset desk!! (flash buttons) so although running the show of a simple desk may seem daunting, it can be done. Simplifying the design is the way, and given that 'she' has decided to go 'stupidly simple' then it fits well. Turn it round and say you are keeping the lighting simple to fit in with her 'simplified' ideas B-)

 

If you're after rock'n'roll type effects, instead of movers, why not look at some cheap basic disco effects, such as moonflowers? These should be cheap to hire and with a little haze can look quite effective if placed carefully, such as in the set somewhere.

Well positioned and plotted simple effects can have as much (if not more :o ) WOW! factor than intelligent effects :D

 

Good luck with sorting it all out, and please let us know how it pans out!

[paulears]

Sometimes a lower budget than usual is a good way to see what impact these things really have. Lose the movers, use generics instead. Maybe consider organising time so that when they do the songs, mic-less, and can't hear anyone you have plan B ready. Tracking. Pre-record the stuff and let them mime. Once the producer realises that if she wants to hear them, she has to either turn down so the float mics or whatever can hear something, or track it. The critical thing is to have a plan B - that way, you have at least tried. If this isn't received well, then the show goes on with poor sound and they need to live with it. When people complain, tell them about the budget cut and they'll understand.

 

Nobody can blame you, let them deal with the complaints. maybe next year money will be found???

[Simon Lyall]

As others have said, you have to work with what you've got. You'll get this all throughout your life. You don't need lots to make a good job of something, in-fact, sometimes money can be a hinderance and not show ones true potential. Look at the kit your venue owns, look at what really absolutely doesn't work, and hire in replacements. Talk to the director about teaching the actors to project due to not having any microphones. It can be done, many many venues and schools work with much smaller budgets for kit.

 

One of the lighting designs I'm most proud of was done with no money, was done with an ancient lighting system and used a grand total of 10 dimming channels. I'm far more satisfied with that rig them I've been with any of the rigs where I've had 60+ parcans, a few dozen miniscans and more. Mainly because it was a challenge to use the limited kit, and thus every individual light had to be put to really good use. In some of the larger rigs, I sometimes feel like I can't give such attention to each light... mainly due to time restraints!

 

 

Simon

[karl]

Try looking at it as a challenge. Almost anybody can produce a good show with a big enough budget, but it takes somebody with creativity and imagination to produce something special with a pocket money budget.

[adamcoppard]

paulears, the backing track idea is definitley becoming a reality, but, the ridiculous thing is, voice may end up that was aswell (gulp).

[smalljoshua]

You have it lucky. I have been working to a £500 budget for sound and light for a good couple of years for both amdram and school shows.

 

Try changing the Leapfrog for a Jester 24/48. Using every lantern you can find in the school, even if that means spending time fixing/cleaning them. Use a couple of pickups instead of radio mics. Find any desk you can in school and daisy chain them for more channels. Use radios (The School Should Have Them) instead of Cans. Try and find mic cables that the school has packed away somewhere even though you may have to fix them.

 

Josh

[Ynot]

Well, there has indeed been a lot of common sense posted in answer to your original question.

 

The only thing I can really add is to suggest you look closely at what you have already got. If yours is a school which might expect to pay 3 or 4 grand on the technical hire for a single show, then I suspect that you may well already have some reasonable basic kit in the venue, yes?

 

If so, then take stock and look at what can be done by spending NOTHING. Produce a design for your lighting that costs absolutely nothing to execute.

 

THEN start to look at how that might be improved by adding additional kit that falls within the budget. Ask yourself (and the director) what soecific effects are essential to the design that you feel can't be achieved with the house lanterns, then look at options on how to get to the effect with the minimal of hired equipment.

 

Do the same with sound, although that may be a little more difficult. In my experience two or three radio mics on a school show are worse than a full set of (eg) ten. With only a couple of the main leads mic'd and the supporting cast not, you get a huge imbalance that just can't be worked out!

 

Once you've approached the production from that angle, you may come to realise that this is exactly how it's done in the real world ALL the time! It's been said MANY times here that proper design is NOT a case of "What toys can I hire in" then fitting the design to the toys but "What do I need to do?", and then "What do I need to have to achieve that?".

 

 

 

 

 

A concurrent post has been automatically merged from this point on.

 

However, sorry, but this...

Use radios (The School Should Have Them) instead of Cans.

... is never a good idea...

 

Another conversation that's been had here many a time is that good communication between departments on a show is essential - and you can NOT get good comms over a half-duplex radio setup.

[smalljoshua]

But it is better than having no comms at all. I'd rather get cues over a radio than over a PC. It also works better than a PC can.

 

Josh