Flying

[a917917]

Hi all,

We are doing a show at a small venue and need to fly a person out (upwards). But the venue has no above stage space. Any suggestions on how to do this would be great.

Thanks in advance.

[smalljoshua]

If there is NO space above the stage then I have a feeling this would be impossible because the actor would be seen after they had been lifted up as they were moved off sideways.

 

You would also need to see if there are appropriately rated points for rigging the effect to. Which I doubt if there it no space above the stage.

 

Josh

[bruce]

Easy. You contact a suitably qualified, experienced and insured professional (see this thread for links to the usual suspects in the UK) and ask their opinion.

 

What you do NOT do is take advice from an internet forum. B-)

[Ben]

Hi all,

We are doing a show at a small venue and need to fly a person out (upwards). But the venue has no above stage space. Any suggestions on how to do this would be great.

Thanks in advance.

 

Wings, only way to fly with no space above stage and no rigging points, you can try red bull for this the ads claim it works...

 

but on a serious point if you need to ask how to fly a person in this situation you need to get in a person or company that knows exactly what they are doing and are insured etc as flying a person is inherently dangerous and in many situations the only way round this is dont fly the person

[Piers Shepperd]

Stagelink - List of UK Suppliers of Specialist Performer Flying Services

[Bobbsy]

If you have no space above the stage and no rigging points then, frankly you need to be looking at creative alternatives. I once did a show that solved this with a jump, a carefully timed black out, a sound effect and some video projection. If you're open to considering things like that then it's worth saying so and seeing where this thread goes.

 

However, as several people have already said, if it MUST be "flying" then your only option is to consult a professional from the links already posted. ANY flying--even the old "just a few feet up" or whatever should never be attempted by the unqualified.

 

Bob

[a917917]

thanks to all for help. I have found a solution

[iamchristuffin]

Could you tell us what it is? Could be interesting to know.

 

Chris

[a917917]

Hi,

Thanks for all the help and things. I spoke to a structural engineer and they said it was impossible to do. So we are going to use a mixture of UV and pyros to obtain a good effect.

Thanks to all,

a917917

[PDD]

Not related to the above, but off the top of people's heads, would a floor-based hydraulic lift be more or less expensive than a person-flying system do you think?

[AndrewR]

Not related to the above, but off the top of people's heads, would a floor-based hydraulic lift be more or less expensive than a person-flying system do you think?

 

Depends!

 

But I have seen (and worked with) a flying car effect that was floor based and far cheaper than any 'flying' effect. (That said, it wasnt anywhere near as impressive.)

 

You will be getting what you pay for, but it can be done.

[ImagineerTom]

There's some major safety issues and concerns that you have to address when using hydraulic systems to lift people - they're all fixable but expect a lot of paperwork, a lot of sums and the need to spend a lot of time convincing various people that the system is safe and appropriate.

 

There's also the huge physical size, power & noise issues relating to hydraulic systems all for an effect that is incredibly mechanical and not in the least bit magical looking.

 

Generally speaking in any proper performance environment (ie where there is structural rigging points) wire flight is always going to be cheeper & less hassle simply becuase it's more common and so there's less exposition to do with all the people involved. A properly designed and choreographed flight sequence will look genuinely magical and theatrical.

[AndrewR]

There's some major safety issues and concerns that you have to address when using hydraulic systems to lift people - they're all fixable but expect a lot of paperwork, a lot of sums and the need to spend a lot of time convincing various people that the system is safe and appropriate.

 

There's also the huge physical size, power & noise issues relating to hydraulic systems all for an effect that is incredibly mechanical and not in the least bit magical looking.

 

Well, if you are looking at big bespoke systems then yes. But this is not the direction I was advocating. (And hydraulic is just an option, I'm talking about floor based mechanical systems in general) There are many ways you can acheve a usefull effect, but you have to be quite clever and creative if you are going to do it on a small budget. As well as very realistic as to just how limited the effect will be.

 

Generally speaking in any proper performance environment (ie where there is structural rigging points) wire flight is always going to be cheeper & less hassle simply becuase it's more common and so there's less exposition to do with all the people involved.

 

hmmmm^TM.... sorry, but I'm going to have to disagree with you there. Wire based systems are avalible off the shelf and are well known/supported I agree... but there are options that a small production could use that are far less expensive. And I'm talking about the kind of production where a couple of thousand to spend on wire-work is just impossible.

A properly designed and choreographed flight sequence will look genuinely magical and theatrical.

 

Absolutely. It will always be the more effective option! Where there is the budget for wires I would always support it, but there are other options for productions that cannot use wires.

 

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[ImagineerTom]

erm, YOU proposed hydraulic as an option, then in your response castigated me for dismissing it? There are some very very significant and major problems involved with hydraulic systems- both practical and legal.

 

 

As somone who designs and works with a wide variety of flying and levitation systems on a day to day basis (on budgets everywhere from £00's to £000,000's 3dimensional invisible wire flight systems) I can safely say I've never yet seen a home-made/low-budget flight that looks like anything other than a low-budget bodge job.

 

Get a pro in - hell at least one of the "big name" UK wire flight companies will rent a full 2D rig for just £600/production week so cost really isn't an issue.

[andy_s]

erm, YOU proposed hydraulic as an option, then in your response castigated me for dismissing it? There are some very very significant and major problems involved with hydraulic systems- both practical and legal.

 

 

As somone who designs and works with a wide variety of flying and levitation systems on a day to day basis (on budgets everywhere from £00's to £000,000's 3dimensional invisible wire flight systems) I can safely say I've never yet seen a home-made/low-budget flight that looks like anything other than a low-budget bodge job.

 

Get a pro in - hell at least one of the "big name" UK wire flight companies will rent a full 2D rig for just £600/production week so cost really isn't an issue.

 

£600 - peanuts to you, the entire props budget to someone less fiscally well-endowed....

 

and (although I'm sure he doesn't need anyone leaping to his defence) Andrew R didn't introduce the concept of hydraulics, he quoted someone else who did....

 

I've seen flying sequences that worked when noone's feet left the floor.Similarly, I've seen skating scenes where there's no ice and no skates..imagination and a bit of (cheap) smoke and mirrors can be a very effective storyteller. not always right for a particular show, of course.

 

My own opinion - someone hanging off a bit of wire almost always looks like someone hanging off a bit of wire. Maybe it's something to do with the centre of gravity. Sometimes this is perfectly acceptable; sometimes (for me at least) it spoils it.