dutcy de dalston Posted March 30, 2008 Share Posted March 30, 2008 HI, Just wondering if any one has any ideas about how to make balloons explode on stage. The balloons will be bouncing around on stage, we need them to explode randomly but eventually most of them exploded. There won't be any people on stage with them but after they have exploded people need to be able to dance in the space (barefoot!). Cheers for any help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jivemaster Posted March 30, 2008 Share Posted March 30, 2008 Even burst above the floor the balloons will leave rubber sheet pieces all over and a rubber knot. None of which will find favour with barefoot dancers. Can you consider hanging the balloons from the grid using something really fine like fine wire to both suspend them and pass firing current to burst them. And hang them from something that will allow them to bob up and down. The sort of laser that would do the job probably isn't retail, and air pistol pellets over the floo..... Added;you could use a network of cable on the floor to fire each balloon if you wanted them to sit firmly on the floor or use helium filled latex balloons for them to float slightly. You would of course have to pull any floor cables off before the feet came on. Well I like the idea Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dutcy de dalston Posted March 30, 2008 Author Share Posted March 30, 2008 Thanks for your reply jivemaster. The rubber being all over the place is a aparently managable, the balloons have to be free of any wire though. I have been looking at lasers, a few available retail but all the demo videos seem to show stationary balloons with the beam focussed on a single spot... One possibility is that the balloons pop in only specific places, where dancing won't be happening but even with the balloons happily bobbing over drawing pins or barbed wire they usually don't pop! Part of the set has barbed wire (even the most fragile balloons don't always pop when they encounter a barb!) so it may be possible to incorporate something sharp into the set? Ideally the balloons would magically be popping as they head towards the left, right and down stage areas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jivemaster Posted March 30, 2008 Share Posted March 30, 2008 Can you have a fine 26swg wire across the stage on the "curtain line", half a balloon height off the floor, and draw it off between balloons and feet? I may have access to a suitable laser if that is your only method! It does come with operator though, and it does NOT run off two lithium cells. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dutcy de dalston Posted March 30, 2008 Author Share Posted March 30, 2008 Yes we could have wire accross the stage and then draw it off, there wouldn't be any one on stage while the balloons drift around (assisted by fans) exploding randomly. The performers entering after that. Can I pass a electrical current along the 26swg wire? Is that what you were suggesting?(I'm not coming from a technical background, I'm the director! I have technical staff but I have to do as much of the logistics as possible) The production is on a tight budget. How much does the laser cost? There is a budget but it needs to be spent very wisely... What does the laser run off? the performance will be in standard theatre spaces, can we plug it in? Thank you! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jivemaster Posted March 30, 2008 Share Posted March 30, 2008 If the balloons will / can be forced to travel downstage then yes one plan is a nichrome cheesewire running at just enough current to bring it to just below dull red. That way it costs £50 for the wire and a car battery to run it off, MUST BE LOW VOLTS. Other benefit is that it's balloon debris is all in one place. -On the wire line. Nichrome wire is twisted into a loop at the right distance an operator at each end holds a live (12v) hook or handle when the balloons enter the stage then the current goes on and the wire is lifted off the floor -It'll burn the floor! As the balloons reach the wire they should burst - most will. When the feet need the stage then switch off the wire cool it and pull it off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dutcy de dalston Posted March 30, 2008 Author Share Posted March 30, 2008 Thank you! Will discuss with my technical people, experiment and re post results. If the balloons will / can be forced to travel downstage then yes one plan is a nichrome cheesewire running at just enough current to bring it to just below dull red. That way it costs £50 for the wire and a car battery to run it off, MUST BE LOW VOLTS. Other benefit is that it's balloon debris is all in one place. -On the wire line. Nichrome wire is twisted into a loop at the right distance an operator at each end holds a live (12v) hook or handle when the balloons enter the stage then the current goes on and the wire is lifted off the floor -It'll burn the floor! As the balloons reach the wire they should burst - most will. When the feet need the stage then switch off the wire cool it and pull it off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jivemaster Posted March 30, 2008 Share Posted March 30, 2008 Glad about that! The laser info just came to me from a friend and the answer is about £4000 for a laser that will pop balloons at 10m and that would have to be screwed to the floor and fired into a light trap to make sure no-one could get in the beam cos it would blind and hurt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pyromonkey Posted March 30, 2008 Share Posted March 30, 2008 I would hope using a laser to pop them is not the answer! It would be safer to chuck a load of darts at the stage! I’m not suggesting anything but there are safe ways of doing this. Think solenoids or Igniters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jivemaster Posted March 31, 2008 Share Posted March 31, 2008 The OP wants the balloons floating freely over the floor so they wouldnt pass over fixed things so either a line/wire burst trap or better is called for. The OTT solution is a fixed laser firing across the stage and into a dark trap Trouble is that the best estimate is 100 - 300mw for bursting balloons and that is too big to use easily even if it is screwed down. A concurrent post has been automatically merged from this point on.Later that same day Just heard from my friend with the laser. It's a 150mW static green and it will NOT burst balloons. SO drop that idea. However, another idea as bad or worse! Put a pellet of solid CO2 into the balloons and as the CO2 thaws then it will over inflate the balloon to bursting. Timing being totally unpredictable though. Can you get solid CO2 within budget? Risk assessment on the noise at work of balloons bursting and CO2 in the atmosphere may kill the whole show though Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dutcy de dalston Posted March 31, 2008 Author Share Posted March 31, 2008 Seems like the cheese wire idea would suit us best. Where would I source that? My technical guys wondered if we could use a tranformer, feeding a 12v AC current down the wire. Does that sound safe? That way we could control the source from the lighting desk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jivemaster Posted March 31, 2008 Share Posted March 31, 2008 Direct Electronics (Romford Road E7/E12 ) may have wire and transformers etc and being Forest Gate isn't too far away. www.wires.co.uk may supply the wire but they are web based. Some serious calculation should get a length across your stage and a specific resistance in ohms per metre sorted out to give you a likely wire gauge and current flow and power requirement while limiting the volts to be within the requirements of safety and Extra Low Volts rules. A car battery as current source may work a SELV transformer may work. Serious care with method statement and risk assessment is essential, this is an exposed hot part and an exposed live wire albeit lv. It is also a trip hazard and cheeswire for feet if the wire and feet get mixed. From wires.co.uk 1.000MM NICKEL CHROME WIRE 500GR (19 SWGRef: NC1000-500 Price: £31.95 [€41.54] (Excluding VAT at 17.5%) approx: 1.4 ohms per metre, 153 metres per kg £50 gets you 500grammes thats about 75 metres at a 10 metre length the heat to burst a balloon may need 2 - 3 amps. 3 amps through 10 metres by 1.4 ohms (= 14 ohms ) needs 42 volts Maybe less but trial error and MS and RA Actually the CO2 method is my current favourite (ATM)! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ekij Posted April 3, 2008 Share Posted April 3, 2008 Any possibility of bursting the baloons by stabbing them up through the floor?Obviously you would need a false floor and some way to convince the dancers that the stabbing would stop before they got on stage!I was thinking of stabbing with something like the darts mentioned above (not a huge knife) so it shouldn't be too obvious. <not serious suggestion>A mixture of Oxygen and Hydrogen will explode when exposesd to UV light, you could fill the baloons with this lethal mixture and then burst them with a UV lamp</not serious suggestion> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scjb Posted April 3, 2008 Share Posted April 3, 2008 <not serious suggestion>A mixture of Oxygen and Hydrogen will explode when exposesd to UV light, you could fill the baloons with this lethal mixture and then burst them with a UV lamp</not serious suggestion><not serious suggestion>A mixture of acetylene and oxygen will explode when exposed to the sight of a hairy-arsed stage crew's backside, you could fill the balloons with this lethal mixture and then burst them with a quick moon...</not serious suggestion> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foh_al Posted April 4, 2008 Share Posted April 4, 2008 However, another idea as bad or worse! Put a pellet of solid CO2 into the balloons and as the CO2 thaws then it will over inflate the balloon to bursting. Timing being totally unpredictable though. Can you get solid CO2 within budget? Never tried anything like it but I'd have thought there would be a good chance of the balloon bursting just from coming into contact with a pellet of anything at -60 deg. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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