Favourite Mixer

[soundiesam]

its interesting to see what other people have chosen... especially because the Allen & Heath GL series keeps coming up.. I dont know what it is about them but I just dont like them it might be because of my age and I like the fairly new desks but I just dont like them.... I also guess it because I'm a soundcraft all the way I just think there a better sounding desk...

sam

[mervaka]

its interesting to see what other people have chosen... especially because the Allen & Heath GL series keeps coming up.. I dont know what it is about them but I just dont like them it might be because of my age and I like the fairly new desks but I just dont like them.... I also guess it because I'm a soundcraft all the way I just think there a better sounding desk...

sam

werd. I'll admit now I'm rather biassed because I've of course grown up around them (and recieve one on one advice and support from one of their staff!) but I've always been impressed with their frame layouts and build quality in particular. its a really good selling point they stick to, even the lower end of their target market.

[Mr.Si]

It's funny (interesting), Bobbsy, that you mentioned giving reasons for choices, as that's exactly what I was going to do...

 

I'm hoping that this doesn't become an Allen & Heath vs Soundcraft type thread too.

 

 

I currently use Yamaha MG series (I have the 12/4FX) and Allen & Heath GL series desks (particularly the GL2800-824). I love the layout and feature set of the GL2800 and so if I was sticking with analogue desks, this would probably be my choice. I mixed on a Midas Legend 3000 once only, and that was packed with even more features than I could shake a stick at and kind of scary too at the time.

 

So yes, if analogue, basically because it's what I'm familiar with, an Allen & Heath GL2800.

The only theatre thing I've been involved with was an Amateur Dramatics promenade type play. All it required was a laptop and a tiny mixer, so in that sense it was the Yamaha MG12/4FX, as it fit the bill. If I was to choose a console to mix on for a theatre show, I wouldn't necessarily pick my favourite desk, more just one that I'm comfortable with and it makes perfect sense to use due to the show's requirements.

 

 

 

Now, in terms of digital, I've had training on the Digi-Design Venue and the Yamaha M7 & PM5D-RH.

 

For live, given the right budget I'd choose PM5D-RH as I loved it. I liked the fact that there were the same number of faders for physical XLR inputs. The whole layout was really intuitive and I felt comfortable using it. Naturally the ability to load user's data from a USB stick, the fact that is doesn't run on windows (like others do), the fast re-start time and the ability to instigate user level control are all massive plus points. They all add to the ideology as far as I'm concerned and has such become the desk that I'd use If I could. I've not used it out in the field, but using it in SFL's demo room was enough confirmation to me.

 

Given the above digital desks that I've played with, the M7 to me would be my favourite choice. I understand it was designed with theatre in mind so that's a pulling point already. The much smaller frame size of it and thus lightweight-ness of it too is good. I also would like it for the fact that I could lower the brightness of the screen, to be less conspicuous and help maintain the magic of the theatre experience.

[Simon Lewis]

....the M7 to me would be my favourite choice. I understand it was designed with theatre in mind so that's a pulling point already.

 

I believe that it was designed with the North American house of worship market in mind... An indication of how much revenue they expect that sector to yield!

[Mr.Si]

....the M7 to me would be my favourite choice. I understand it was designed with theatre in mind so that's a pulling point already.

 

I believe that it was designed with the North American house of worship market in mind... An indication of how much revenue they expect that sector to yield!

 

That would also make sense! It was just something that was said by the yamaha rep. - the thing about being able to dull down the screen so that the screen wasn't a distraction.

[mackerr]

For live, given the right budget I'd choose PM5D-RH as I loved it. I liked the fact that there were the same number of faders for physical XLR inputs. The whole layout was really intuitive and I felt comfortable using it. Naturally the ability to load user's data from a USB stick, the fact that is doesn't run on windows (like others do), the fast re-start time and the ability to instigate user level control are all massive plus points. They all add to the ideology as far as I'm concerned and has such become the desk that I'd use If I could. I've not used it out in the field, but using it in SFL's demo room was enough confirmation to me

I think you may be remembering the M7CL. PM5D does not have the same number of faders as input ports, does not load user data from a USB stick, and only recently got security features. The M7 has had all of that from the get go.

 

Mac

[simonwest]

Hi,

 

I have three mixers I prefer, each one for its own reasons, so here goes (each mixer assumes a well set up PA with a relatively reasonable flat response:

 

Midas XL8:

The midas XL8 has an, in my opinion got an awesome pre amp and eq ability. It really does sound great with whatever you put though it. The system is so flexible with what you can with it, and has no single point failure through the entire board...which cannot be said for more desks in digital world.

 

On board there are various types of compression, gates and eq's available, along with more inputs and outputs than you'll ever use.

 

I could brag forever about latency being very low (in most respects lower than most analogue systems), audio quality, variations and flexibility ..... but the main thing with this desk, is not 'what can I do today', but 'what do you want to do today'.

 

Now granted, the price tag on this desk is out of most peoples budget, BUT, if you can get one your event and it has the budget, you will not regret it, and in my opinion, you'll really enjoy the results.

 

 

Yamaha M7CL:

Low price, lightweight, small in size, 48 in 16 out as standard, you can loose your room clogging outboard / dynamics racks with this baby. granted, might not sound on the pre amp side as good as a PM5D (in my opinion), or have quite as much flexibility, but the price tag makes up for it and its easier to get around with, not to mention the USB storage capability instead of the PM5D's pcmcia cards (which are expensive!) the desk is fairly flexible in its usage, granted however, somethings take a little looking around but once you've got the gist, its brill.

 

Analogue world, Heritage 3000:

The trusty H3, festival regular. Sounds great, works great, tried and tested desk. Now, in terms of digital desks vs analogue, I generally believe that in festival situations, digital can provide more hassle than positives. For example, engineers who may not know the board, will take longer to mix than the change over allows.

 

So with festival situations why not have a system which is easy to use, plug in and go stuff. I guess if band engineers have their band on USB or PCMCIA storage then the settings can be loaded, but audio companies mostly have a generic patch system which will not be the same as the stored patch list, taking up more time. So short of audio companies visiting each band engineer and 'premixing the show' so when it comes to sound check (whats one of them I hear you say :) ) they load up....but then tweaks will be made anyway.

 

So why not analogue? straight forward, simple, trusty and it works...especially for festivals. Im not saying digitals cant be used, an audio company I work for used the at a festival not too long ago, but sometimes when engineers bought their own pre saved shows to our PM5D, softpatching was required as not to bugger up the monitor / stage patching system.....and this was a **** ache to put back after the band,

 

So analog for festivals please, it works :unsure:

 

Regards

 

Simon

[Bobbsy]

So analog for festivals please, it works :unsure:

 

...though I think some really big events like "Live 8" used things like the DiGiCo D5 as their mixer of choice!

 

Seriously, if it's the sort of festival where you have to continually "busk it" then I suppose analogue makes sense. However, in situations where you get a reasonable soundcheck in advance, the abilitly to store multiple preset states, including soft patching where necessary, can be a godsend.

 

This brings me to the problem I have selecting a "favourite mixer". Every situation is different and calls for different tools. Obviously basics like sound quality and the number of channels are fundamental, but things like size, weight, budget, ease of operation, and so on all come into play. Add personal preferences to this, and everyone's needs are different!

 

I have to put my hand up and admit a bias for digital mixers, usually in the Yamaha flavour. (As an aside, in terms of interface, I LOVE the Soundcraft Vi6 but, in my experience, it's just not reliable/stable enough.) There was a learning curve moving to digital, but once I got used to the flexibility of the dynamics processing and EQ on every channel, the in-built effects and the ability to store endless presets, I now find mixing on an analogue desk a bit limiting. Which Yamaha digital is my favourite? Well, much as I love the PM5DRH, I think my favourite "all rounder" is the M7CL. It's got all the resources I need, has "fader per channel" operation without layers, the UI is easy and intuitive, it's small enough/light enough that 2 people can easily put 48 channels into place (try that with a Cadac!) and, especially considering that most/all your outboard is built in, is hard to beat for the budget.

 

Bob

[mervaka]

what do people think of the LS9 after using an M7CL? its got a little more realistic a price tag for me :unsure:

[dbuckley]

For a theatre show I'm doing very soon(*) I've just put in the hire order for a Yamaha 03D. A what? An 03D. Why? 'Cos it's got a MIDI implementation that compared to the other stuff I've looked at positively rocks, and as its the old boy of the hire stock it's relatively cheap to hire, $240 (88 quid) for a week :) and fairly unpopular so in good nick given it's getting on in its years.

 

(*) Actually, I'm not 'doing' the show, someone else will be opping, I'm just have to make it all work for a "go" button pusher, but there are a number of funky audio bits, and without some sort of automation support it just isn't going to happen. So it's PCStage sending MIDI to the 03D to change EQ, faders, and aux levels on the fly...

 

So todays favorite desk is an 03D!

[pisquee]

I'd make sure the 03D is working well, I used a couple of ships I was on for while, and they frequently would lock up and not pass audio, I think through overheating, so tended to have have them powered off til just before the show, and also powered down in the interval. Would not trust one on a show nowadays.

[zonino]

I'd make sure the 03D is working well, I used a couple of ships I was on for while, and they frequently would lock up and not pass audio, I think through overheating, so tended to have have them powered off til just before the show, and also powered down in the interval. Would not trust one on a show nowadays.

 

depends how well they've been treated I'd say. I've certainly seen an unfortunate amount of broken stuff on ships that is that way through lack of proper maintenance (I've also seen a lighting system that had been "broken" for over 2 years. I'd hope that hire company stock would be better!

 

but anyway...

[Bobbsy]

Knowing dbuckley (well, from online anyway) I'm pretty sure he will have researched all this but...

 

I've used quite a few 03Ds in edit suites and was very happy with them there. However, for live use they have a couple of major drawbacks:

 

First, the PFL/Solo operation is very awkward when you're moving quickly. You have to select the channel you want to hear (in the normal way) then select a "global" solo button which (for me at least) is at full stretch in the top right corner of the board.

 

Second, only the first 8 channel inputs are set up with proper mic level inputs. If you're using mainly radio mikes with line out, no problem...but this could trip some people up.

 

As I say, I suspect these are non-issues with dbuckley's plans for automation but "normal" users should beware!

 

Bob

[dbuckley]

Indeedy - I am not going to dirty my hands touching the thing once it's plumbed in. It's just a remote controlled audio processor thing, a rack box but of the wrong shape. In fact the same thing in a 2u box with no front panel would be really useful. But the world's moved on since then, so I guess thats a non-starter.

[James]

I've used and maintained a lot of 03Ds in edit suites,

 

We are phasing them out at the moment, as they are starting to exibit problems.

 

Things to check - Power Supply, as pisquee says, not passing audio is a frequent problem - all the regulators for seperate parts of the desk are on one giant heatsink, In my experience, the +/-5v regulators driving the AD/DA board is the most frequent to go - fairly close to the centre of the heat sink and often very little heat sink compound. The problem with this way of doing it is there is often no indication when the AD/DA board fails other than suddenly no sound is coming into or out of the desk.

 

ADs/DAs These dual chips frequently fail, spairs are still available but expensive and not the easiest components to change.

 

Faders, These sieze up over time - worth a check.

 

Basicaly If you are looking at an 03D that has been in use and powered all day every day in a suite for the last 5 years or more, it might be showing signs of age, recently we hired in a couple and they were absolutly imaculate - the hire company inplied we were the fist people to hire them for years

 

So - it all depends on how it's been looked after and maintained - all the problems I mentioned are adressable (if you have the time and parts etc...)

 

Oh and another point - if you haven't already, try running it with the serial mouse plugged in - it makes navigation on the screen an absolute dream, This is a feature I realy miss on the 01v96s and DM1000s we've replaced our 03ds with.

 

good luck - they are nice little desks,

 

James

 

James