2nd hand equipment

[heinz57]

Hi,

 

I am thinking of offering lighting and sound technical support to amateur groups in my local area. Does anyone know of any sites were I can buy 2nd hand equipment which will be reliable for low prices? (Accept for ebay!!) Also if someone knows any shops in my local area of Nottingham, Ilkeston and Derby were they deal in lighting and sound equipment?

 

keeping on the same subject. What is the basic lighting and sound equipment I will need to buy?

 

Will I need to purchase insurance as well?

 

Thanks,

 

Matt

[gherriott]

If you are planning to provide services in both sound and lighting, then probably a quick list of equipment to start with would be: -

 

SOUND:

mixer - would go for a behringer personally as they do a nice range range for nice prices, also the mixers are quite light so easy to cart around.

amp - just a 2 channel basic PA amp would probably be ok if it is just for am-dram purposes.

2 speakers

speaker stands

relevant cabling

mics? would you prived your own mics or hire?

 

LIGHTING:

LX desk, I would go for a Frog as it reletively cheap and easy to use, or even cheaper go for a pc based desk with a usb-DMX converter.

dimmers - again, if you want to provide everything then dimmers would need to be considered depending on the venue. If you are lighting using a couple of lanterns and some lighting stands, then maybe stand-mounted dimmers would be an option.

then there is the relevant cabling again

Power sources

 

Basically I would think of what types of venue you would be lighting at, therefor what equip would need to be provided, and how much you would actually hire in. I'm afraid I am an ebay person, so would normally go there first for any equip or 10outof10.

[paulears]

Well - we come accross this quite a bit. There's not any major problems with buying second hand to hire to your local groups, BUT - most decent lighting kit has a very long lifespan, and rarely gets onto the second hand market until it's too unreliable, or spares are difficult. there are exceptions, but these normally need some care and attention, safety testing and a gentle life (which you may be able to offer).

 

There are excellent bargains to be had on eBay - but sometimes they can be lemons! People like used-lighting sell decent second hand kit, but although it's cheaper than new, it isn't exactly cheap.

 

Sometimes second hand kit is put on sale for really silly prices. I was in a second hand shop the other day and they had some aluminium finish PAR56 cans (old, dented and lampless) - they wanted £35 each - a brand new one costing nothing like that!

 

You mention insurance - I'm not sure what purchase insurance is? You will need some public liability insurance if you are going to hire the kit out, as every body sues everybody nowadays.

 

As to the equipment - depends on how much you have to spend, and most importantly, what do your customers need? So if its a church hall group where you have no proper electricity supply, then this directs your choice. If you play in venues with plenty of power, then there are more alternatives. Sound wise - what do you need, something to play music, or a radio mic based system? Let us know and we can help.

[sparkyweb]

PM sent

[Jivemaster]

The world is a circle made of little pieces! In business you have to bring those bits together.

 

Nobody sets up all the kit they might ever want, then hopes to make a profit.

 

Identify a niche in the market that you can satisfy then see what kit is needed, and work out whether you can do the job at a profit, returning something to the business to cover depreciation.

 

There is more to be made by Knowing than doing or owning! The profitable bit is getting the clients coming in and satisfying their needs. You can do this by understanding the client's wishes and sub hiring the kit from specialists.

 

Buy only that which you use every job, hire the rest.

[paulears]

Sensible man, Jivemaster. My accountant tells me that over 70% of my assets do not earn their keep. The trouble is that buying kit for individual projects that could be just one-offs, doesn't work. As a rule of thumb - if you buy £100 worth of kit, then a week long hire might work out at £20 - 5 hires and it's paid for. However, it may go out for a day, and you could charge say £5. You now need 20 hires, and by the end of hire number 15, it may look pretty dreadfull, and need a new windscreen. You then have to hire it out some more to pay for this. Now if you want to mic up a drum kit, a single mic is no good, so you buy enough - including a kick drum mic. This won't be so useful, as not much use for anything other than loud, low range instruments. So will you be able to hire it enough? Probably not, but the income for the drum KIT, allows it to be kind of subsidised.

 

This is the quandry. No matter how big your business is, you never have enough kit. The sensible thing of course is to do as Jivemaster suggests, and sub hire in the kit you need, and put a 'handling charge' - 'markup' - 'commission' whatever you want to call it, on it. Less income, of course, but better business sense.

[Jivemaster]

There are lots of things to learn!

 

the first one is, that people buy from people they LIKE and trust.

 

Locate the people who represent the market you aim for, Identify them, prioritise them, try targettting the worst ones first, then as you sharpen your selling skills the best ones are waiting for you.

 

Look in the Blue Room Wiki and the lighting FAQ for lists of second user equipment dealers, Keep looking at their lists as they will change.

[lightsource]

Interestingly, as we have interests in the Nottingham area, you are actually asking how you can become competition to ourselves. (Or any other company in that area).

 

keeping on the same subject. What is the basic lighting and sound equipment I will need to buy?

 

I think the first point is - Have a similar amount of technical knowledge that we do ( as well as our partners, and quite a majority of other BR members), then you'll have a good idea what to buy and you won't need to ask a question like that on an open forum. After all, you are openly stating that you have no knowledge of what you intend to do, so your tecchnical knowledge is obvioustly non existant.

 

The second is, You are actually asking potential competitors this question, you could find adequate results from a simple Google search, or Alta Vista, or Yahoo or ..... You really don't need to go past search engines to answer that one!

 

The third... regarding insurance... If you had even the simplest knowledge of Risk Assesment, Electrical Regulations or Health and Safety, you wouldn't even need to ask this question... But to answer it, (UK) these days £5 million PLI is a good starting point, and a recent PAT test of the second hand equipment you have purchased.

 

Sorry Guys, I'm not (really) knocking this venture (as I started out on second-hand kit) , but I think the OP has no idea whatsoever in what he's doing, so my REAL advice initially, is read the 'rules and regulations' and learn the industry a little bit better. Especially the legal requirements, and equipment knowledge.

 

There have been many topics posted on the BR in the past, including buying second hand kit.

I am thinking of offering lighting and sound technical support to amateur groups in my local area

Google (and the others) is your friend so use them all. It may help when you try to explain what technical support you actually have to offer :huh:

[Jivemaster]

Whatever you start and wherever, you will be competition for someone!

 

Using some reliable kit with history, among the new kit does in fact play into your hands, Its how a real company would be a few years down the line, so it gives you "establishment" when clients see the kit! Photography students were advised to get a new camera but an old tripod prior to their first few jobs then clients perceived the "establisment" that goes with the mixed age kit.

[lightsource]

Using some reliable kit with history, among the new kit does in fact play into your hands, Its how a real company would be a few years down the line, so it gives you "establishment" when clients see the kit! Photography students were advised to get a new camera but an old tripod prior to their first few jobs then clients perceived the "establisment" that goes with the mixed age kit.

 

 

Well, just by chance, there's some Vari*lite VL2C's available on http://www.usedlighting.co.uk Possibly a good starting point there, would mix well with new trussing, to support them :huh:

 

Oooh and that was a link to second hand kit.... Although not really local to Nottingham, Used Lighting is a good starting point for buying second hand gear.

[woody74]

Matt, based on your spelling and your profile, I have to ask: how old are you? If you are not of age to acquire insurance or run a business, than whatever has been suggested already might be pretty pointless.

 

-w

 

edit: he has a name, shouldn't use screen name...

[Boggy]

I would hire gear for my gigs until you know:

- Who are you clients.

- What gear do they need.

- What gear do you like.

- Which suppliers provide good service.

Even when you own your own gear, you will still need to hire in gear for larger jobs.

[heinz57]

Matt, based on your spelling and your profile, I have to ask: how old are you? If you are not of age to acquire insurance or run a business, than whatever has been suggested already might be pretty pointless.

 

-w

 

edit: he has a name, shouldn't use screen name...

 

To be honest that is a personal question however I am 17 and in college and this idea was suggested by a lecturer because I have gone far further than the class room requirements. And FYI people in my area do offer services like this at the same age as I am. And the poor grammar is a personal thing. And a fellow friend who uses blue room spotted only 3 mistakes.

 

And I can and will use a screen name but leave my name at the end of comments.

 

P.S. you leaving this comment and asking this is a big offence to myself, I find it quite offencive. Now lets say no more about it. I don't want to start some argument here.

[Jivemaster]

Wharever you wish or think, the people on here are representative of your lecturers, and examiners, your clients suppliers and prospective employers and employees. The friends and foes you make online here will be with you for a whole career.

 

Poor language is one of the most significant mark-downs a person can have. In business people really do judge others by their language.

[GridGirl]

To be honest that is a personal question however I am 17 and in college and this idea was suggested by a lecturer because I have gone far further than the class room requirements. And FYI people in my area do offer services like this at the same age as I am. And the poor grammar is a personal thing. And a fellow friend who uses blue room spotted only 3 mistakes.

 

P.S. you leaving this comment and asking this is a big offence to myself, I find it quite offencive. Now lets say no more about it. I don't want to start some argument here.

 

I don't think this was intended to offend - it's just that it can be much more difficult (and expensive!) for someone under 18 to get public liability insurance, which is something you'll definitely need to have if you're hiring gear out. No-one is doubting your enthusiasm or ability to carry this out successfully, just pointing out the possible pitfalls you may not have thought of.

 

As for kit you'll need, I agree with Jivemaster and Paulears - buy only that which you'll use every gig and sub-hire the rest :)