Moving from a manual to board to using moving lights ??

[louis]

At our school ,we have a manual board but I wanted to know if it was easy to change so we could use moving lights and if we can how do we do this

 

All Comments

 

Louis

[Stu]

It really depends on your setup - is the manual desk an analogue or DMX desk? If it's DMX, you could just swap the desks over for the duration of the show and then swap back. Obviously you'd have to run a DMX cable from the last point of your installation (dimmers I'd guess) to wherever you had the moving lights. This way you could run both your generic rig and moving lights together.

 

If it's an analogue desk you might have to run the manual desk for the generics, and then your hired desk for the moving lights - you might be able to use a demux to go from the DMX desk to the analogue dimmers but this depends on the type of dimmers etc, not to mention another hire cost for the demux.

 

In other words, we'd have to know more about your installation before anyone could properly comment about how, in theory, you could go about this.

 

Stu

[Jivemaster]

Assuming you have power available run some hard power to the movers positions then look at a separate desk for movers and a separate DMX line. Try to justify (hire of) movers as in educational budgeting terms poorly utilised movers could be the cost of books to study or another technician, and much less usefull in real lasting terms.

[Lozza]

At our school ,we have a manual board but I wanted to know if it was easy to change so we could use moving lights and if we can how do we do this

 

All Comments

 

Louis

 

hi Louis, as most will aggree, moving lights are legendary, I own 2X mac 500's and have used a comprising rig of 20 movers, + I am only 15. Firstly, might I suggest waiting patiently to use movers in later life as schools very rairly can use, maintain and afford movers. However if you are going ahead, moving to a DMX system capable of running movers is not simple and is not just a matter of getting a new desk! You will need pro advise etc but heres what I can tell you. DMX is the digital system used to run digital intelligent lighting. DMX desks are expensive and complex usually, but great for nightclubs, concerts and theatres. As far as power and wiring goes, it's always different but you need the correct pin DMX cabling and converters etc.

 

Look into it. Moving lights and desks that can control them are incredibly advanced and complex, someone with experiance and good programming skills will help you but dont rush into anything>

[mumbles]

Not knowing whether the original post was concerning what to do in order to change a system to cope with movers, or how programmming and opping differs, I'll try to answer the second understanding of it.

 

Assuming you haven't used movers before, I'll try to give a short and brief explanation.

 

Most desks designed to control movers will work with personalities. These will be laoded to your desk, and tell the desk which attributes are assigned to which channels. Using these, you choose you fixture, and then use the wheels/rollers to set the attributes. This can be done by setting attributes as pallettes, which allow you to change the selected fixtures to what is set in the palette. Then the pallettes, which can contain colours, gobos, postions etc, can be used to build scenes, subs or chases, or used directly to "busk". The advantage of pallettes is that when you notice the lead vocalist has moved, you can reset all the scenes just by editing one pallette.

 

Many desks also have features like shape generators, which allow you to create movements or dimmer chases etc for your fixtures, and assign these to the pallettes or subs.

 

This means that the main difference between a manual preset desk and a movers desk is that a movers desk will need to be programmed first. This is as at 16 channels a fixture, even a small rig can swallow hundreds of channels. Combine this with the sensitivity of the fixtures (a 2% change can cause a gobo change), and it would be nigh on impossible to control movers off of just sliders.

 

This is just a very brief summary of the basics of a movers desk, and so in order to learn more, find which desk you're going to use, and read the manual.

 

Hope this helps.

[greenalien]

As DMX control has become more popular, so usable control desks have become much cheaper.

 

I would suggest thet a good avenue to explore is to buy a new desk, then hire in lights to suit your needs.

 

A good starting-out desk is the DMX Master 1 - costs under £70 from

 

Thomann

 

Similar desks are made by Soundcraft and Chauvet, but they cost a little more.

 

This desk will happily control a dozen scanners / moving heads and is reasonably easy to learn to use.

 

Main disadvantage is that it can only be backed up by copying a show into another desk, so owning 2 is not a bad idea.

(and keep them away from any magnetic fields like loudspeakers, or the memory gets erased! )

 

You'll also need to know the DMX assigns for your DMX lights, as at this price, you don't get a fixture library!

 

Another option, if you're looking for something more professional, is to keep an eye on ebay for a second-hand Pulsar Masterpiece - still widely used and very powerful, can be used for both theatrical and Club style lighting, but takes some time to learn properly.

 

For a similar price, around £300 - £400, you could get a Zero 88 Diabolo. This is much more state-of-the-art, does have a fixture library, and is very much aimed at controlling movers / scanners.

 

Good Luck!

[Nick S]

DMX is the digital system used to run digital intelligent lighting. DMX desks are expensive and complex usually, but great for nightclubs, concerts and theatres. As far as power and wiring goes, it's always different but you need the correct pin DMX cabling and converters etc.

 

(pedantic note) DMX is used to control everything, not just movers but dimmers also, which means the manual desk in question may well output to DMX.

 

If the 'moving lights' you are looking to use are simple disco lights (for exanple, for a batrtle of the bands or similar event) one could run them off a manual board...certainly the Martin club lights can let you run off 1 fader controlling on/off/automatic cycle etc...

[paulears]

Similar desks are made by Soundcraft and Chauvet, but they cost a little more.

I didn't know Soundcraft made lighting equipment?

 

One thing - the move from a manual desk, that you know really well, to a memory desk of any kind is a big step. Basic features can be picked up quickly, and more clever or obscure ones get remembered as you go on. One snag. As you get more proficient at one particular operating system, you are being indoctrinated into having a favourite. This isn't a bad thing - but skews your judgement. The more familiar you become, the more likely you are to dislike any other desk that works differently. One of my people has just moved accross to working a hog in comparison to the strand system she knows well. She hates the desk, despite its powerful features. It's just different, and simple tasks require the manual at the moment, which is a pain when you know exactly the button pushes required on the Strand. Eventually, all will be well.

 

In a school situation, you'll learn one system, then leave and have to start again - probably. Annoying, but life!

[mumbles]

In a school situation, you'll learn one system, then leave and have to start again - probably. Annoying, but life!

Too true, but it goes even further, having spent the last 6 months learning a pearl, I now can't use the fat frog I had at school. And I know have to learn the strand 500 instead of the ETC expression 3 I normally use.

 

For a school, find a nice simple one to use, as you'll need to be able to reprogram it in blind, in two minutes once the house has opened, as the drama teacher has decided that the dance should be rechoreographed. If you'e going to buy one, then make sure you hire one first, to make sure you like it and it does what you want it to.

[greenalien]

I didn't know Soundcraft made lighting equipment?

 

Sorry, that should have been 'SoundLAB'!!

 

Mea Culpa... :** laughs out loud **: