Conference in a gymnasium

[MikeR]

The good lady's work lot are staging a conference in a gym. Apparently there will be an exhibition area, a keynote address and breakout groups which will all take part in the gym. They are talking about using acoustic boards to help with noise issues between (physically :) ) the break out groups. Has any one come across acoustic boards? Are they any good? Do they work? Have to admit Ive never seen em unless they're just talking about movable partitions, but I suspect they're not.

[zonino]

I'd imagine in a gym you will get alot of reflection from the ceiling as well, when we did a band gig in an indoor tennis court we had lots of draps surrounding the walls, but we still had big problems with the noise reflection off the ceiling, which your going to find hard to solve with the boards

[MikeR]

Sound reflection was one of my initial thoughts. Ive only ever done larger versions of spaces like that ie (docklands, NEC , Earls Court etc and they've always been draped etc. My current thoughts are along the lines of building extra large sim trans booths for the delegates to sit n sweat in. Having said all that this may yet turn out to be a " moon on a stick" kind of affair (I'm expecting the budget & spec this evening) in which case I want nowt to do with it.

[damian666]

you want drapes mate. I suspect if the event is in a gymnasium, there isn't the budget to build walls!! with sensible attention paid, good use can be made of bags of black serge!!

feel free to pm....

[steveo]

If you are going to go down the drape route you need to get as close to ceiling as possible as the sound will bounce all over. You will still get some sound interference I am afraid as of yet I have never sucsessfully created a true sound barrier. But there is always a first time

[paulears]

Yep, steveos comment on the drapes being full height is essential - snags being the roof is unlikely to be horizontal, so support and access to install will be tricky, drapes are very heavy if they are thick, the full height may cut out light, access for power if required will need thinking about, Even hotels with their room dividers cause real problems when groups are close. Any form of leakage will make it unpleasant, but some may be needed for ventilation.

 

All in all, shot the person who ever thought one large space could be used like this!

[Guest lightnix]

Hmmm, gyms... *shivers*

 

I'm no sound engineer, but is there a professional version of those Bose-type systems, which reduce ambient noise by sampling it an producing it in anti-phase? Just wondering :unsure:

 

Apart from that, black drapes and plenty of them (don't forget to check the weight - they can really add up fast). Even then (as mentioned) you won't get any thing like soundproof environments. Sensitive speaker positioning and seating layouts in the break out groups may help - I'm thinking along the lines of having any speaker positions facing away from each other.

[Just Some Bloke]

Accoustic boards are used in studios to create a "dry room" to record in without natural reverberation, and are used in orchestra pits to stop the sound of the trumpeter spilling into the violinist's mic etc.

 

I suspect they'll be of no use at all in a gym for all the reasons mentioned above: sound will just come in over the top of them. Full height drapes and/or small, very directional P.A. systems will help, though. Don't forget that in a reverberant room like a gym the aim of the P.A. speakers is to get the sound directly to people's ears without bouncing off floors, walls and ceilings, so you'll need lots of small speakers rather than a few big ones.

 

HTH

[enbee]

all I have to say is good luck

 

having done sound for a three day conference in bolton arena ( a large gym full of tennis and badminton courts) I wouldn't again. we had serious problems with reflections off walls, roof etc. there was a small amount of live music involved and out of 1 snare drum hit we could easily count four (still it made the drummer sound insanely fast)

 

I would suggest you get speakers as high as poss pointing down and get some large rolls of cheap carpet on the ground. granted its not ideal but its better than the sound bouncing around all over the place

 

in terms of the muliple groups using the same room, I guess in theory you could try some marquee type tents and cover them in drapes. This would lesen noise inside and gives you essentially another room. but it ain't gonna be cheap

 

all in all, its going to cost a bomb and be a pain in the backside

 

once again good luck!!!

[JohnPartridge]

I Think someone else has mentioned it , but Acoustic Boards are designed for Semi/Perminant setups where sound reduction needs to be inplace ( recording studios/ venues with STRICT noise pollution laws inplace )

 

I wouldnt try putting up acoustic boards in a gym, just for the reason than you wont get that much reduction in sound quality.

 

Just do what we do and put Black drapes up from floor to ceiling , as close to the walls as possible and get a good sound engineer to setup the equipment.

 

Hope ive been some help

John Partridge

[MikeR]

Drapes are the way Ive always done it in the past, as I think I mentioned. The boards idea was the clients own and never having come across them I wondered what they were. One or two of you have confirmed what I thought they might be though and as you have said fairly useless for this application. Today Ive been told the budget and I'm fairly confident that its not at all achievable / realistic . I just cant see boxed drapes, sufficient sound kit and an engineer (least not the ones I usually work with) coming in under the budget and that's before even looking at lights and pictures. Hey ho can't say I'm surprised, though the main problem apart from the lack of cash is the usual understanding or lack of as to why these things don't work.

[Simon Lewis]

Many of the events I've been involved in take place in agricultural showgrounds, which have large display halls. These have concrete floors, breeze block walls and corrugated angled roofs. They have similar problems to gyms (and large Catholic churches ;-) )

 

The typical approach is to carpet the whole floor, then run steel wire at height (strained with Tirfors) to suspend black drapes. These work better if there is a small gap between them and the wall. You should be aware that you are trying to reduce unwanted reflections and lower the overall reverberation time. The drapes will not offer equal attenuation with frequency, but if you use a heavy material with a certain degree of "pleating", it will help to reduce low frequencies too.

 

PA wise, the usual wisdom is to:

a) reduce the number of sources as much as possible (i.e. central or distributed cluster)

b) use directional sources to cover the audience and not the reflective surfaces

c) if a) and b) can't be done properly, use a number of lower level sources close to the audience with suitable signal delay.

 

In the worst cases,

d) Use a "Pewback system"

e) use headphones.

 

 

 

With regards to acoustic boards, these may prove useful if you are trying to create breakout spaces, but you would need to screen to about 2m height, and preferably enclose the break out space. Also, what might be considered a true acoustic board (i.e. an acoustic treatment system such as RPG) is quite different from the hessian covered 4'x8' chipboard that gets used as a moveable partition in offices. Such dividers will have little impact!

Use of the proper acoustic boards must be in conjunction with the drapes.

 

Lastly, it really does help to get a good signal into the PA. Use of "cheek mounted" headset mics (Countryman E6s are good) provide unobtrusive looks with good audio performance and much improved gain before feedback.

 

I suspect that your Good Lady's chums haven't got a budget for any of this? :-;

 

Simon

[JohnPartridge]

Hi mike , just to point something out , the cost of Acoustic boards is about £8.00 each for a 100mm square , now to cover a gym ( or 1 wall ) you are going to be looking at alot more money than the cost of a decent sound engineer and drapes and a set of nice speekers.

 

Just a point

John Partridge

[MikeR]

John, Simon Thanks, both very helpful. The acoustic boards are, I think, a non starter, cost as you say John is prohibitive. Simon what you describe is pretty much what I had thought might have to be the case, and as you say Im pretty sure that the budget won't go anywhere near it. Ive suggested that they need to rethink the format of the day. The whole thing is ill conceived and theres every possibility that they might just cancel it if they think it will be a failure. An option which may be in their best interests. Thanks again, we shall have to see what happens after the weekend when they discuss it further.

[JohnPartridge]

In reply to Simon's post , yes Ive worked in Gyms , Churches , Halls and sports halls.

 

And what Ive found is that if you setup correctly and follow suggestions that Simon has written you should be able to keep a good level of sound integrity. Ive managed to in the past ( and I'm a Lx not a soundy )

 

If you setup well before the show you should have enough time to get a good working setup.

 

Hope Ive helped

John Partridge