Taking over theatre….

[NW1]

Hey everyone - I’ve just been successful in acquiring a local “community theatre” it’s a great space but showing its age! Old profiles and Fesnels etc…..all running on 16amp dimmers. I have some MAC movers to fit but ultimately want to start the process over to LED. My question is can I run them along side each other initially and the slowly reduce the dimmers and swap over to LED fixtures on the same desk? Or should I run the current desk Zero 88 Fat Frog for the dimmers as they’re already patched and then run a separate for the LEDs? 
 

I’ve always worked with LEDs when out and about but I can’t afford to re-rig everything in one go!! 

[kgallen]

You could run your LEDs as fixtures from the Fat Frog quite happily, at least in the short term. The fixture section on the Fat Frog isn't just for movers, it's perfectly usable for "colour only" LED fixtures and you get the colour palettes screen to use. (If the fixture definition is not in the latest library (unlikely) then you can write your own with the Fixture Tools or get Edward at Zero88 to put one together for you).

Many venues including my own have mixed dimmer/tungsten and LED rigs, it's quite normal as we go through the transition. It will probably be over the next 10 years that the funds are incrementally available to move our venue over to full LED - and that will be driven by the loss of availability of T18/T25 lamps rather than problems with the equipment. The Zero88 Betapacks and Strand Quartets we have work just as well today as they did when installed in 1995 - just a little annual maintenance and cleaning required. In fact the LED fixtures we do have are arguably scrap already due to LED element failure - and they are less than 10 years old.

Your space looks quite nice - and inspirational! I don't think you need to rush it too quickly into the 21st Century... ("More art, less tools")

Edited March 19 by kgallen

[NW1]

Thanks for your reply - you’ve set my mind at rest a bit. 
 

yes we’re very excited about taking over it. She’s not too shabby just needs a bit of fresh paint and a bit of TLC. Slowly dragging her up to date - but it’s going to be fun doing it!! 

[ianknight]

@NW1 I saw the announcement on FB - well done for keeping a community venue going 🙂

As @kgallen has said - the Fat Frog is handy for running stuff side by side but it can only control 12 fixtures. If you're 'donating' things like MAC's in to venue then I would urge you to seriously consider replacing the Fat Frog - whist it's certainly possible to run two controls side by side, it can get complex & frustrating for inexperienced users so I'd try to bring them under one desk ASAP.

I'm a little out of touch with the current 'de rigeur' desk but having sold desks in the past as well as lit with them - do take in to consideration that it might not always be you plotting shows and playing them back so pay close attention to any desks UI & whether it can be configured for less experienced users or not. You should also have half an eye to what happens at 6pm Saturday night when you power everything ready for 'the half' and the desk gives it's last gasp - what will you do for backup? Choosing a desk that's used by other venues nearby might be handy in such circumstances...

If you're not happy serving the current racks or desks (and you might not find someone local who is) - then I can help too.

Good Luck with the venue 😄

[NW1]

Hey @ianknight thanks for the reply. 
 

that’s good news - yep I have a back up system but concerned that visitors might not understand it so looking at trying to find a replacement desk as soon as funds allow. 
 

I’ll keep your offer in my pocket - thanks pal 👍🏻

[kgallen]

It looks like you've got some Strand SLs there and maybe Selecon Acclaim profiles? They should do you for a bit - you could do much worse (and you'll need a decent budget to replace with comparable LED) if my image zooming-in sleuthing is not too wide of the mark!

Give 'em a clean - I bet they'll serve you well for quite few more years.

Looks like you've got a half-decent internally wired bar front of house. But I wouldn't be hanging a MAC mover from it though! (Not sure I'd be hanging a MAC mover anywhere these days though!).

Edited March 19 by kgallen

[alistermorton]

Great looking theatre space- hope it comes together for you. 

[NW1]

Thanks, yes it’s not bad at all - just thinking about starting to move across slowly - it may well be a couple of fixtures ever 6-8m  depending on bookings etc. It’s certainly useable as it is. 
 

thanks for your input.

[NW1]

16 hours ago, kgallen said:

It looks like you've got some Strand SLs there and maybe Selecon Acclaim profiles? They should do you for a bit - you could do much worse (and you'll need a decent budget to replace with comparable LED) if my image zooming-in sleuthing is not too wide of the mark!

Give 'em a clean - I bet they'll serve you well for quite few more years.

Looks like you've got a half-decent internally wired bar front of house. But I wouldn't be hanging a MAC mover from it though! (Not sure I'd be hanging a MAC mover anywhere these days though!).

Your zooming skills are top notch! 

[Stuart91]

4 hours ago, NW1 said:

Thanks, yes it’s not bad at all - just thinking about starting to move across slowly - it may well be a couple of fixtures ever 6-8m  depending on bookings etc. It’s certainly useable as it is. 

LEDs are most effective (compared to conventionals) when producing saturated colours. And the nature of optics + LED sources means that wash fixtures are cheaper than profiles or fresnels. 

Depending on what kind of shows/bookings you are getting, it may make sense to use LED for your colour wash and keep the conventionals for face light and specials. 

(I'm thinking things like dance shows or panto where a lot of colour is required - covering the whole stage with a blue wash can tie up an awful lot of fresnels)

[Geo23]

Hello, 

looking at your theatre I feel you are very lucky to have such a nice space to work in.

I've been helping out for the past 6 years in a theatre in Arundel, West Sussex which in a building which I think is as old as the castle!

The building was a priory in the past and was converted in 1977 into a 78 seat theatre.

we’ve recently had the DMX/tungsten dilemma  and an ‘expert’ decided to go for an Etc Nomad +gadget and new laptop.

nobody apart from the said expert gets on with it as it’s more like programming a computer than controlling lighting!

I think we could exchange our progress with each other as we have some similarities worthy of exploring.

We are all volunteers and our only income is from ticket sales.

[ianknight]

@Geo23 Good to see some Mini 2's still doing their thing 😄

[alistermorton]

Also a nice looking place.

 

A nomad setup can really use at least a bunch of faders if not a full wing. There are ways to make inexpensive MIDI faders work with nomad. 

 

That said, I often do whole shows now without anything on the faders on our Ion. Sometimes a fogger or hazer. The only thing permanently on a fader is the house lights. It's just a different way of working, especially with an LED rig. Others in our group still use subs faders.  

Edited March 20 by alistermorton

[sandall]

Would it be worth looking out for a 2nd-hand Zero88 or similar desk for the "non-experts" to use?

[Martin Lepley]

Love the little Theatre.

LED lighting obviously take more DMX channels so that needs to be considered. In our amateur group we have a simple 48 channel lighting controller but have to double or triple or quad the lights up to fit in only 48 channels.

We aim to go over to computer controlled in the future.

With LED lighting, the white colour is different from incandescent (colour temperature) but you can buy some with warm light effect.

I would be inclined to replace the floods above the stage with LED first, and when you can afford it, then replace the spots with high powered LED.

Also might be an idea to replace all the above stage floods with the same type (make and model). This will make programming and controlling easier as well as matching the colour.

 

But... I am an amateur and unfortunately we do not have our own fixed venue.