Patrick Randall Posted December 26, 2013 Share Posted December 26, 2013 I last did stage lighting at Grammar School in UK in 1960s - levers.. An idiot question:Looks like we'll be doing the music at a large church. It has a (working) LightPalette 520 console and a huge rack of dimmer/control stuff under the stage. Light fixtures all over the arched roof - well out of reach. No-one know how to operate it so I've been nosing in the manual and see it appears to be MS-DOS based. Eeek. Should I continue to see if I can get it to work for us as-is or is the only sensible way ahead an upgrade? If it is, can just the console be replaced? Is so, can someone give me a ballpark figure for a system cost? Short term, can I ask questions about the LightPalette 520 with any hope of answers?! The manual was printed in 1997. I'd really like to be able to talk to it with MIDI from my Mac.. Possible? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IRW Posted December 26, 2013 Share Posted December 26, 2013 Short term, can I ask questions about the LightPalette 520 with any hope of answers?! The manual was printed in 1997. I'd really like to be able to talk to it with MIDI from my Mac.. Possible? Probably not...there's no such console ;) I'm guessing you mean a Strand 520 running the LightPalette software? (The americanised version of GeniusPro for anyone who doesn't click!) Assuming the console is in working condition, and assuming you're not trying to do anything rediculous with it, the console should be fine- if you read up on the midi section of the manual, again, depending what you want to do, it may be possible! Ian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulears Posted December 27, 2013 Share Posted December 27, 2013 Any spares you need could ironically be easier for you than us, as Strand 'centralised' spares for these controls. There are still lots in place, still working all over the world. If it still works, as you mention, then the control syntax is pretty easy to get around. If you have the dimmers turned on, then if the desk is patched, but 'empty', simply typing 1 thru 500 (or however many dimmers you think you have) should, with the master at full, and the DBO off, bring up every dimmer. The faders on the desk are sub-masters, on which you can stick lighting states/scenes/cues - so usually people would build up useful common states, using the keypad, then press record, sub 3 (or whatever) then the * button to enter it. Once in the subs, you can make more subs with subs already recorded. By default the desk records what you can see - unlike more modern controls that use levels set into a programmer, rather than what you can see. The keypad lets you enter ranges and individual lights, so 1 thru 10 +15+211@full works, as do most other combinations. It's quite easy to get the hang of it, and you can then operate by just the faders, or build up cues one by one and number them ready for theatre style replay, cue by cue. Your version of the software worked in tracking mode, our version at that time didn't - each cue on our version would record every channel, no matter what their level. The US preference was to only record things that had changed - a system now the default mode for virtually all controls, unless you tell them not to! Many of us were brought up on this system, so although we don't see them that often now, our memory is good - and there are manuals on the net you can read. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomscott Posted December 27, 2013 Share Posted December 27, 2013 The help button is extremely useful too... Just press help and then the button that you aren't sure on and hey presto, the screen tells you what it does! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigclive Posted December 27, 2013 Share Posted December 27, 2013 If these fixtures really are as inaccessible as you describe then ration their use to prolong lamp life as long as possible. Leaving fixtures lit pointlessly is inevitably going to waste valuable lamp life of lamps that will rarely if ever be replaced. It might even be a good idea to nudge the master down a bit while programming and if possible in actual use, since running the lamps at just a few percent below their rated power will extend their life considerably. Many desks still have a command line operating system behind their operation. It's simply more stable than a modern bloated GUI system with about a million more ways to go wrong. If it's using a standard DMX network then you could use your own computer with an appropriate adaptor to run the system directly. But you might find it more reactive and useful in the long term to learn to operate a physical desk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patrick Randall Posted December 27, 2013 Author Share Posted December 27, 2013 Well thanks awfully you chaps. I'm encouraged. It all seems to be working. I think there is one blown bulb. I'm setting up the band stuff right now but I am sure I will be back with a few questions. All a bit mystifying right now but a lot more exciting than the 4 led lamps and a midi 1 channel dimmer we've been using up till now. I'm sitting here with the intensities down worrying about bulb life already!Thanks again - you have no idea of the relief at finding help :-)Patrick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patrick Randall Posted December 31, 2013 Author Share Posted December 31, 2013 well, successfully created a couple of sub masters that fade up and down and bump (whatever that is). Then I stored their current state as a couple of cues. That didn't quite go as planned - it seems that this stuff is incremental? Levels get retained unless they are zero'd out? Shut it all down and got them back - even managed to store the show on a floppy disk ( found some in a cupboard). Onwards!It seem that I might have communique pro so next is to see if I can send some midi from my Macbook and get a response? Any hints? Is it note on msgs or something? Just want to change cues in synch with Ableton Live.Thanks again for help and encouragement.Patrick in Pt Charlotte Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulears Posted December 31, 2013 Share Posted December 31, 2013 Kaleidoscope is what does sound to light - the other adds network services and other linking bits and pieces. Bump buttons just flash the sub to full, and have a bump master fader to set maximum level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonathanhill Posted December 31, 2013 Share Posted December 31, 2013 well, successfully created a couple of sub masters that fade up and down and bump (whatever that is). Then I stored their current state as a couple of cues. That didn't quite go as planned - it seems that this stuff is incremental? Levels get retained unless they are zero'd out? Shut it all down and got them back - even managed to store the show on a floppy disk ( found some in a cupboard). Is the board in tracking? This could be the cause of retained levels. A simple way to find out is to look at one of the screens and at the top it should say 'Tracking On'. It should also display the cue type as 'MF' for Move Fade. I vaguely recall that tracking mode is selectable in 'Setup'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulears Posted December 31, 2013 Share Posted December 31, 2013 If the desk is tracking then remember that only changes are stored - cues that are at the same level as the last cue will be left out. It makes no difference on sequential replay, but jumping to a random cue have odd results. Move fades are the norm in tracking mode, and cross fades are the type that re-record an entire cue, including channels at zero. In the UK normal mode, as in non-tracking, you had the MF as the option. I suspect most Strand users over here never went out of out record everything mode of operation - I know I didn't! I still find it mildly annoying to have to make a conscious decision to record everything in modern controls, and usually turn tracking off if I can. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alistermorton Posted December 31, 2013 Share Posted December 31, 2013 IIRC there should be a key to toggle between "Q only" and "Track" - on the 300 it was a hard key, and I'm pretty sure it is on the 500 series too. The midi messages will almost certainly be midi show control - a google search on that should tell you the message format. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonathanhill Posted December 31, 2013 Share Posted December 31, 2013 IIRC there should be a key to toggle between "Q only" and "Track" - on the 300 it was a hard key, and I'm pretty sure it is on the 500 series too. The midi messages will almost certainly be midi show control - a google search on that should tell you the message format. The 'Q Only/Track' key is for single use in the command line to do the opposite of whatever mode the board is set to, i.e., if the board is in tracking then the command line <Record> <Cue> 11 <Q Only/Track> will save definite values for that cue. It will not toggle between tracking and snapshot modes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alistermorton Posted January 1, 2014 Share Posted January 1, 2014 The 'Q Only/Track' key is for single use in the command line to do the opposite of whatever mode the board is set to, i.e., if the board is in tracking then the command line <Record> <Cue> 11 <Q Only/Track> will save definite values for that cue. It will not toggle between tracking and snapshot modes. Ah, right. I never used it myself, I just knew it was there. Although the syntax looks barse ackwards for a strand ... wouldn't it have been <cue>11<Q only/track><record> ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patrick Randall Posted January 1, 2014 Author Share Posted January 1, 2014 In the communique pro part of the v2.2 manual it says "MIDI note on and note off commands are recieved and used to flash submasters or channels" It doesn't say how though. I use Ableton Live (DAW) and could generate midi note ons at the time I want the lights to change and get them to the midi in port on the back of the 520. Anyone done this? Would "flash submasters" be the equivalent of hitting the bump buttons?If so, can anyone point me at how I tie incoming MIDI note ons to a submaster channel? I can't see it in my 1998 Genius Pro /Lightpalette Ops guide - document 40/B949.And as an aside, what does FLASH do generally please? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulears Posted January 1, 2014 Share Posted January 1, 2014 Prod the button and it's the same as pushing the fader to full - call it flash or bump if you wish to use the more modern term. The level to which the channel bumps up to can be set by the flash master - however, the button can also be set to do other things, like solo - where prodding the button leaves that sub at whatever it is doing, but sets everything else to zero. I think you could also fire off a macro - but it must be the macro with the same number as the button, so sub master 3 could fire off macro 3. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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